[QUOTE=100-Plus;2423267]DMOORE,

Are you seriously trying to suggest that carburetors are more reliable than electronic fuel injection? Yeah, that's why the entire mainstream automotive world has gone to EFI. That's why Mercury Racing doesn't have a carbureted engine in its line-up.


Actually they went to efi for emissions reasons. But hey you seem to be THE expert. Just be sure to tell all the guys with "sensor" problems that are sitting on the dock, that their EFI system in their boat is so reliable. With modern ignition systems, and VERY simple carbs, there really asn't too many things to go wrong. I believe that efi systems will eventually become more reliable with time, but for the present, I see many problems with 496's on the river. Oh well, it's what I've seen over the last 5 years or so.

darrell.


Darrell.

No, my friend, I'm not the expert. The guys who build the engines are. And regardless of why engine builder adopted EFI, it's been a good thing for engine reliabilty and performance.

EFI, combined with onboard computer control, gives you the ability to map precisely, which is why engines like the 1075 deliver power at the high end of operating range (like big-horsepower carb engines did) and still idle smoothly at the docks (like big-horsepower carb engines often did not). And that's just one benefit.

The early versions of 496 engines did have problems when builders like Mercury switched platforms. I'm sure some were related to EFI, and some were not. Kind of hard to lump them all into the EFI bag if you didn't follow up.

You "believe EFI systems will eventually become more reliable with time?" Sure, anything can and should be improved, but for the most part EFI is already there. Ask an engine builder.

Ray?

What, me worry?
 

DMoore:

You are right in the sense that carburetors are in a sense a more simple way to deliver fuel to an engine. The flathead v-8 was a more simple v-8 engine too! Glad were not still trying to use those in our vehicles today. although there still are some of those people who won't give them up for anything!
I know the sensor sytems on these newer engines are sometimes a pain, but when you consider that Mercruiser has built and installed over 40,000 496MAgs and HO's in the last 7 years you can see the 5 or 6 on a lake in a season on a lake called Havasu where there are probably 3 to 5 hundred per season running around the small number of sensor failures is small by comparison. Remember you're always going to hear more loudly from those with problems that ruined a perfectly good weekend than those many who enjoyed the weekend with no problems, human nature!
When you consider that there were really nearly just as many carbureted boats that had problems you did not see or hear about I would propose the failure rate is a lot closer than you suggest.

As for the efi motors with electronics, they are the only hope the performance boating community has to meet the ever more stringent emissions rules being put in place!

A carbureated motor will never be able to be calibrated and controlled to any point where it could run at these new fuel settings. As for the sensor issue, I agree the reliability rate of these devices can be improved and it is every year. Remember the settings that these sensor systems have to run under are set by the biggest (Mercury) manufacturers to protect the engine for warranty reasons that help shield the manufacturer from increased warranty costs and liability. Hence the very sensitive "Guardian" settings in the ECM. They are also there to keep the weekend "IDIOT" who roars up and down the lake with his 5000 watt stereo blasting away, his party girls dancing on the deck and his head buzzed with a few to many beers and one who rarely looks at his guages until "Heck, I did'nt hear no Godd**m buzzer! You need to fix this exploded piece of Sh** on my warranty !!
Sometimes I can't blame the manufacturers for trying to protect the customer and themselves from his own disaster!

In any event, the EFI electronically and sensor controlled marine engines are here to stay. Get used to it and have fun with a much better product! For those who have to have carburetors, there will always be enough around to keep you happy, Enjoy!

Regards,
Ray @ Raylar

LA Boat show...............Mercury booth!!!!!!!!!!! :Whatever:


http://www.scopeinfo.com/images/2008...w/DSC09420.JPG
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http://www.scopeinfo.com/images/2008...w/DSC09422.JPG

Saw the cats at the Volvo booth, too. One boat manufacturer said they will add about $1500 to cost of the boat per engine. Mercury rep said the cats are not in their parts books yet, so no replacement prices available. They will be covered under warrantee for the warrantee period. He said that the cat can be removed from the manifold for replacement, which is a good thing since a few salt water reversions will ruin them. He also said disuse will ruin them, with salt air deposits building up while the engine sits.

Michael

There's your reversion trap! That cat is mounted very high indeed, they're clearly aiming to prevent reversion. That must be what? An 18-24" rise straight up?

Quite a tight package though. Not sure about the disuse argument. I can see water wash being a problem (destructive cooling), I'll can't see a mechanism for salt water vapour (which by definition does not contain salt!) causing damage. Splash would be a problem certainly but that water reversion trap is quite a hill to climb.

I also cannot see how you get to 1500USD for two cats either. Sounds like a bit of fear of the unknown to me.

Interesting to see things progressing.

Yeah, right, it's a 2 foot riser.:rolleyes:

No, there is no such thing as airborne salt. Tell the Navy to stop washing the salt that doesn't exist off their planes.

Definitely, "fear of the unknown", such as the unknown cost of development, tooling, durability testing, certification, warrantee, dealer tech training, etc., amortize it over a few thousand engines, repeat most of the process for each engine line, and return a profit to the stock holders.

Michael

i hate when the picture is 5 times the size of my puter screen:party-smiley-004:

Looks nice, simple, and lightweight :hitfan:

Need a higher resolution computer screen! :D