No, don't even start...
Enough about Profile all ready...
Several guys have ask what is going on with the TNT/Holdings d/b/a Profile vs. Dean Owen lawsuit so here goes (sorry it is long, it has turned into a complicated mess):
The whole thing is currently haggling over if I am referring to the IA Profile, or the WI Profile, when referring to this story. These guys are trying to deflected the conversation away from the facts, which are that Randy and crew wrecked my boat, committed credit card fraud, and showed extreme signs of incompetence in basic marine mechanical applications. No one can or will deny that, they want to discuss legal entities and how this shields them.
This guy in WI says he bought out profile in December of 2004 totally, that there is no other Profile, that Randy Schultz has had nothing to do with Profile since the buyout, so I am referring to his company when I say Profile. (I can post copies of the lawyers letter tomorrow if someone wants to see it).
I spent a half hour with his attorney on the phone today and basically threw the BS flag (and as usual with documented facts, not hearsay, faxed a bunch to him, so JB, your lawyer now has enough to keep you from telling him how innocent you are, you should have given him the documents I gave him. It does not look good when I have to catch YOUR attorney up to speed, he seems to be a good guy, you should play straight with him).
For the record everything relating to the SCREWING UP OF (please deleate the word *destruction*) of my boat is regarding TNT Holdings, dba Profile Custom Powerboats, aka Profile boats, and the entities owned, controlled by Randy and Debbie Schultz, or the organizations they receive singificant managerial assistance from, or employ them. I did not know this guy in WI even exist until he jumped in and until he started telling me half stories and then changing those stories, and then got a lawyer involved.
I know every time I post something they huddle around and read it so, Hello Profile Guys, have a GREAT weekend! Whoever you are!
I am confident this guy in WI is not telling his attorney everything, or maybe he just does not have a clue what is happening in his own company, or they are just throwing things wildly about, hoping something sticks.
From the discussion I had with his attorney he is NOT being told everything, because I have a PLETHORA of documents that say Profile Custom Powerboats is a IA company that Randy Schultz owns and runs, and the documents have been generated after the date he said he sold it, some old deal, change the story, make up stories, and see if it gets you anywhere. There is a pattern here.
One of the following is truth:
This guy in WI is committing fraud on the boating community telling everyone lies about who builds them, OR Randy and Debbie Schultz have committed perjury in court documents and lots of other places OR There are two Profiles and the guy in WI just picked a bad name and really has nothing to do with this but does not want the story to reflect badly upon him so he is making up more wild stories via telling only half truths OR The WI deal is a front to try and deflect legal actions against Profile.
The truth probably is a mixture of these but we do not know yet, I am looking forward to the discovery phase. Randy and Debbie are silent on everything, apparently content to let the WI guy fight this for them. This really looks like the stuff Debbie was doing when discussing them wrecking my boat, which is to keep telling stories hoping SOMETHING that sticks. However nothing ever did.
I argue that even if some guy bought the molds, if the same people are running the operation, then you, as a fellow boater, can expect the same thing as when someone else ran it, good or bad. As a boater in this community I think I need to at least to help you know what reality is, I hope you would do the same for me.
I have filed a counter claim in IA and am ignoring the WI guy, I think he feels threats will censure the story, they won’t, and if he tries, it will be through a legal action, which means I will pass on that “Profile Boats has brought actions against me to not tell you what they did to my boat". So if all of a sudden this happens, know that is what happened.
Even if he does, he will have to prove damages, which he will not be able to, and even if there is a completely different Profile Boats, and he sells them, and Randy Schultz is totally out of the picture, his company has been telling this story for over a year after he bought something and he has been letting this Randy Schultz use the Profile name, so through his silence he has lent creditability to the public perception that Randy Schultz is closely associated with Profile. If he has a totally different company as he suggested he needs to stop Profile IA from telling everyone it is the old Profile and Randy Schultz has not been associated with the company since 2004. I suggested he also change the company name. (Since this is not the case, so they can not make this argument).
Again, everyone wants to run a legal circle jerk around the main issue, which is Randy and crew wrecked my boat, lost on these facts in arbitration twice, and then SUED me to try and extort money, and now instead of dealing with that fact are throwing up all these bull schite defenses and legal wrangling and are trying everything they know to try to keep you from finding this out. This likely explains why so many people have had this done to them and dropped it.
Fortunately I have the means and damned determination to not let it censure the facts. NOTE TO PROFILE GUYS: Do you really think I am going to take being sued and not do something about it? COME ON.)
In their defense, I have had a LOT of people tell stories of guy who had almost the EXACT same experience, down to unbelievable details, but not ALL. A few guys have said they had a good experience. So far it is running about 80% bad and 20% good, but I am sure the guys who also got screwed are a lot more vocal, so that probably is not a good indication of reality. Randy and Debbie COULD be committing fraud on lots and lots of entities, and this guy COULD be just an innocent, but non-observant enough to not know someone else is using his company name to commit perjury and fraud on the public. Can a company have its identity stolen like a person? If they could, this extreme level of not even knowing causes me to go ummmmmm.
To the Profile guys, who ever you are, as we stated in our e-mail conversations, we should have this discussion in public, censure ship will not work in this case, and the boating community is full of smart guys. There are three sides to every story, so this would be a good time to tell yours, then let the boating community decide. I have no less to lose from being less than honest than you, so lets lay it on the line.
Also if there is something else to this story, or if I have gotten it wrong, please clarify. NOTE: I am asking for your clarification here (meaning if you do not give it, do not belly ache as to how it appears). NOTE: This is going to be a SECOND legal defense against you, first is honesty (can’t defame someone with honesty) the second is asking you for clarification, and we know you are reading this. So again, this would be a REALLY good time to chime in here and clarify. THIS is the boating community, and according to your assertions for over a year someone has been committing fraud o the boating community by telling them Randy and Debbie Schultz have been associated with Profile boats. If this community has been defrauded, you need to tell them, remember these are your customers, you have an obligation as a person who makes a living servicing this community.
However note, if you lie or tell half truths, I am going to blow that up, I already have almost all the details, so they best all tie out, actually, I am interested in seeing how quickly my legal case will end your legal attacks, I think it will shatter them really, really fast, and once we get past that we can get back to the main issue of my boat being wrecked, which is where I want to go. More importantly, the guys in this forum are smart guys, if you are gonna tell a half truth, they are gonna figure it out. If you are a straight up business owner servicing this community, this discussion will be good for your company.
To J.B, isn’t it time to drop the charade? If this has nothing to do with your company, DROP IT, if someone is using your company to commit fraud, SAY SO, if you are part of the charge, God help you. I do not know which is the case.
I do not know you or your company and nothing I have never stated anything was geared toward you except these legal charades; you need to either say you have nothing to do with you know who, and the entity he is using to commit all this perjury and fraud, or you need to squash his ass and stop it. As a reasonably young man I should not be giving you business, legal, and life advice, but apparently some is needed. If you are truly innocent, stop sleeping with dogs if you do not want flees, and when the chips are on the table, facts are all you can believe in, so always keep the facts on your side.
You can respond off line, you have my email address, but I prefer a public discussion, it brings clarity to this community, a community you apparently make a living serving. Thanks.
NOTE: I have tripped off on to the war path, so I make no claims that I am 100% non-bias, I do make complete claims that everything I have said is 100% accurate and to the best of my knowledge complete.
Last edited by dean51267; 02-18-2006 at 05:42 PM.
No, don't even start...
Enough about Profile all ready...
I applaud your efforts....I hope this sends a strong message to all the vendors out there.
OSO...The BS stops here.
This is very educating on how to deal with problems, Keep us informed...I'm sure you will.
Last edited by Back4More; 02-18-2006 at 10:32 AM.
I agree. This board is for helping each other, making friends and keeping us all informed on what's going on in the boating industry....good or bad.Originally Posted by Back4More
Originally Posted by Back4More
For the record, this is no longer about money, all money proceeds after legal fees will be donated to a local children's home we provide Christmas for each year.
Secondly, to vendors out there, and there are a LOT of GREAT ones, watch this exchange, if you are one of the truly great vendors this should serve as a reminder of why you make the hard decisions you do the way you do, and believe me, we notice great vendors and show up and give you our money with a smile, you are important to us, we count on you, we believe in you, we trust you and we pour praise all over you like gatorade over the Super Bowl winning coach. We WANT heros in the market, so thanks for being one.
If you have earned our trust we know it was not earned easily, and every day you make difficult decisions about maintaining that trust. Again, from me and a lot of other guys, thanks for who you are and how you run your business, we are having a HELL of a lot of fun because or what you do.
This is not a "bash vendors" discussion, this is a "share with fellow boaters our experiences" discussion, and we are going to have them 24/7 from now until the end of eternity, and with the power of places like OSO, they will be even more rapid fire than EVER before. The winners will be the ones who come to the market with great products and services and the customer service to make our experiences what they can be. There is a fundamental shift in the market place, it is easier to get to millions of potential customers all over the globe, but it is easier for them to get to you, and each other.
for boaters there is OSO, there are list servers for every imaginable topic in the universe, a website can be had for $10/month, information can no longer be held captive, whatever you know, someone else does to. The beauty is that we all get to control what happens or does not, so we get to CONTROL the chatter with great, or less than great, actions. However, if you do not want people to know your business dealings, do not enter this game, because in an electronic age, businesses do not have secrets. The market is a fair place, if a custoemr gets out of line say so, the world is filed almost entirely with reasonable people who can see through the BS of a false complaint, have FAITH in that, and you will be rewarded, no one wants a vendor to be beaten up unjustly, and if this happens to you, we WILL come to your aid.
These kind of exchanges are driving a lot of dishonesty and negativity out of the market, making capitalism stronger, peoples lives better, and forcing the losers to face the consequences of their decision much, much faster. Once and idea is formed, it can never be erased, the ability of consumers to discuss real work events is an idea that will never be silenced and the market will reward. Why do you think OSO has 30,000 paying members? Because they facilitate this exchange, and they do a hell of a job. Why do I pay to be here, for the same reason you do, it is cheaper to pay OSO and learn from fellow boaters than to learn the hard way, as my experience proves.
Whyis capitalism and Democracy spreading all over the world? Because of exchanges just like this on every imaginable topic in the universe, knowledge is power, and busienss secrets are no more.
Anyway, this is an on going saga, several guys ask for update, for those who want to ignore it, please do so, simply "do not click". I will make sure the subject line clarifies what the topic is so there should be no confusion. I do respect that some would "rather not hear it". Fair enough?
Ditto!Originally Posted by Semper Fi
wow, just realized, was i on the soap box or what?
great work best of luck (not that youll need it)
i have my popcorn and am ready for a good show!
Originally Posted by Back4More
Having been screwed before when buying a boat.
GO FOR IT FULL THROTTLE
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