Purchase deal went wrong. Need Advice
03-18-2009, 07:49 PM
#151
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wow, interesting thread going on here, only 2 ways i see the cracked blocks are 1st way, engines were checked out and given a clean bill of health at kinser, then the owner stored them maybe in the winter time and maybe some water in block froze, this would be easy to tell. second way, the cylinder walls on a bowtie block bored this far out needs to be sonic tested for core shift and wall thickness, so if the only crack's are around the cylinders this is most likely what happened, they should have magnafluxed the blocks then measure bore diam. if they really needed a boring maybe the block should have been sleeved instead of boring to next size. maybe he will go in half with you on some replacement blocks
03-18-2009, 08:15 PM
#152
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Freeze damage would not cause that type of cracking.
Boring the cylinders too large, to insert a sleeve, because a few cylinders needed .010 overbore and someone wanted to reuse the old pistons instead of buying all 8 at .010 larger would cause this type of cracking.
Boring the cylinders too large, to insert a sleeve, because a few cylinders needed .010 overbore and someone wanted to reuse the old pistons instead of buying all 8 at .010 larger would cause this type of cracking.
03-18-2009, 08:29 PM
#153
I will throw out just for fun that Chip from Competion Marine told me it was amazing the motors made the last runs at the Shootout. 
Larry ran the motors for years.
But not because of cracks just the huge hours on the motors.
And a friend of mine was thinking of buying the motors from Jeff and I said it was a real good deal in parts just need some $ and work.
Larry ran the motors for years.But not because of cracks just the huge hours on the motors.
And a friend of mine was thinking of buying the motors from Jeff and I said it was a real good deal in parts just need some $ and work.
03-18-2009, 08:56 PM
#154
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instead of spending money on a lawyer, just spend the 2000grang for tall decks bored out by your guy or buy the bored 572 blocks for 2800 and I bet they will knock off money for two since cars are not selling much and for a phone call they can make a buck ship to you. but after reading again I think the machine shop might of goofed since the creaks are around and not up and down. sorry but lawyers fees are going to be the cost of the two blocks.
03-18-2009, 09:00 PM
#155
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The crack thing is what throws a wrench in the gears for me.....wear and deterioation will give a crack that runs with the cylinder (up & down).....the fact that it is cracked around the circumfrence of the cylinder throws up a major red flag.....so back to my statement about when were the cracks found and it seems to be that from tango 36 quotes of empires posts that we have the answer which is NO DUE DILIGENCE really leaves NO RECOURSE.....
Norty how's the haps out there buddy!!!!!
Norty how's the haps out there buddy!!!!!
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Dying,....Is the day worth living for!!!!!!
03-18-2009, 10:53 PM
#156
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Mike wrote;
I will try to get all the parts back and have a different machine shop look at them to get a better idea. Many of you guys have pointed the finger on the machine shop, i will investigate that as well. If you know of any one that specializes in this field which is not far from Los Angeles, I would appreciate the information.
I will try to get all the parts back and have a different machine shop look at them to get a better idea. Many of you guys have pointed the finger on the machine shop, i will investigate that as well. If you know of any one that specializes in this field which is not far from Los Angeles, I would appreciate the information.
The crack thing is what throws a wrench in the gears for me.....wear and deterioation will give a crack that runs with the cylinder (up & down).....the fact that it is cracked around the circumfrence of the cylinder throws up a major red flag.....so back to my statement about when were the cracks found and it seems to be that from tango 36 quotes of empires posts that we have the answer which is NO DUE DILIGENCE really leaves NO RECOURSE.....
Norty how's the haps out there buddy!!!!!
Norty how's the haps out there buddy!!!!!
03-18-2009, 11:07 PM
#157
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Mike wrote:
Yes, you are correct, the note was an email from my mechanic which start saying "Hi Mike, he does indicate blocks were bored, but at one point he indicated to me that after doing one, they noticed the crack and checked for the second block. I just wrote a post, indicating that i will have the blocks checked if still possible to see if machining would do this type of cracking. If you have any advice in this matter, would like to hear it and also recommendations as well. Due to the situation, i will have to hold on to these motors and figure what i am going to do. Meanwhile, fixing the other motors i purchased and getting ready to have lot's of fun. I'm posted off, due to the circumstances, but again any used parts could go wrong, but i did not expected to be this bad, when talking to the seller and his mechanic, it was suppose to be in running condition. This is the issue here
Yes, you are correct, the note was an email from my mechanic which start saying "Hi Mike, he does indicate blocks were bored, but at one point he indicated to me that after doing one, they noticed the crack and checked for the second block. I just wrote a post, indicating that i will have the blocks checked if still possible to see if machining would do this type of cracking. If you have any advice in this matter, would like to hear it and also recommendations as well. Due to the situation, i will have to hold on to these motors and figure what i am going to do. Meanwhile, fixing the other motors i purchased and getting ready to have lot's of fun. I'm posted off, due to the circumstances, but again any used parts could go wrong, but i did not expected to be this bad, when talking to the seller and his mechanic, it was suppose to be in running condition. This is the issue here
Hmmmmmmm, by an earlier post you stated that the machinist had already bored both blocks (it clearly says "after boring the blockS"). Now you are saying that he had just started on one of them? Here it is from your early post:
" Hi Mike,
Yesterday I went over to the machine shop to check the satus of your engines. I was not very happy when I saw the results. After boring the blocks we found two cracks in each block, in the same place ob both blocks. In cylinder # 3 & 5 about half way down. The strange part is that they are staight lines in a circular direction ( the do not follow the direction of the piston-up and down). Pete (the machinist) has never seen a crack in this form before, after consulting with other machine shops and myself, we decided that it is too risky to try to sleeve the block. We are afraid that the block will try to separate, the deck from the bottom. It is our conclusion that the engines had water in them at freezing temps which caused the cracks."
Now, in plain black and white (or whatever color), we see you changing your story about how things happened. You would expect your word to hold up in a court of law with a guy like Jeff that would have a mile of people lining up to testify on his behalf? Of course I have printed all of these posts just in case sometime in the future your recollection needs to be adjusted.
Now what was it? Were they were both bored and then the cracks were found? or was one was bored, the crack was found, and then the other one was also found cracked? Your machinist is pretty clear what he thinks (they were both bored before finding the cracks) based on his email. If he is as honest as you say, and I would believe based on the other guys that he is, then his word must be good and they were bored before the cracks being found.
I'd say that it is probably time to save face, admit that you should have at least done a little bit of due diligence before purchase. Find some used blocks (and have them maganafluxed), switch some parts, and get on the water. You have drug a good mans name through the dirt long enough.
Hmmmmmmm, I wonder what role Pete, the machinest and the 4th person on your side (you, mario, engine builder, Pete) to see the blocks before the cracks were found, played in this? He was the one and only person in this entire delema that did any work whatsoever to the blocks before the cracks were found. I wonder if Pete got a little overzealous with the boring tools?
" Hi Mike,
Yesterday I went over to the machine shop to check the satus of your engines. I was not very happy when I saw the results. After boring the blocks we found two cracks in each block, in the same place ob both blocks. In cylinder # 3 & 5 about half way down. The strange part is that they are staight lines in a circular direction ( the do not follow the direction of the piston-up and down). Pete (the machinist) has never seen a crack in this form before, after consulting with other machine shops and myself, we decided that it is too risky to try to sleeve the block. We are afraid that the block will try to separate, the deck from the bottom. It is our conclusion that the engines had water in them at freezing temps which caused the cracks."
Now, in plain black and white (or whatever color), we see you changing your story about how things happened. You would expect your word to hold up in a court of law with a guy like Jeff that would have a mile of people lining up to testify on his behalf? Of course I have printed all of these posts just in case sometime in the future your recollection needs to be adjusted.
Now what was it? Were they were both bored and then the cracks were found? or was one was bored, the crack was found, and then the other one was also found cracked? Your machinist is pretty clear what he thinks (they were both bored before finding the cracks) based on his email. If he is as honest as you say, and I would believe based on the other guys that he is, then his word must be good and they were bored before the cracks being found.
I'd say that it is probably time to save face, admit that you should have at least done a little bit of due diligence before purchase. Find some used blocks (and have them maganafluxed), switch some parts, and get on the water. You have drug a good mans name through the dirt long enough.
Hmmmmmmm, I wonder what role Pete, the machinest and the 4th person on your side (you, mario, engine builder, Pete) to see the blocks before the cracks were found, played in this? He was the one and only person in this entire delema that did any work whatsoever to the blocks before the cracks were found. I wonder if Pete got a little overzealous with the boring tools?
03-18-2009, 11:11 PM
#158
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The crack thing is what throws a wrench in the gears for me.....wear and deterioation will give a crack that runs with the cylinder (up & down).....the fact that it is cracked around the circumfrence of the cylinder throws up a major red flag.....so back to my statement about when were the cracks found and it seems to be that from tango 36 quotes of empires posts that we have the answer which is NO DUE DILIGENCE really leaves NO RECOURSE.....
Norty how's the haps out there buddy!!!!!
Norty how's the haps out there buddy!!!!!
Busy busy......SCOPE kickoff is this weekend. I won't be able to go.....Jake's 2nd birthday is Satruday! Where does the time go!
03-18-2009, 11:18 PM
#159
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Mike wrote:
I emailed you the pictures
I emailed you the pictures
If you are not a $$ member of OSO you can't upload pics.
You can email them to me and I'll post them if you want! [email protected]
You can email them to me and I'll post them if you want! [email protected]
