iamjoe

I have my opinions on what looks like caused last weekends tragedy (judging by the tape I saw) and I have opinions on how close some of the boats seemed to be running to the parked boats, but since I wasn't there and didn't witness each situation first hand, I'll keep my mouth shut. Rather than come on OSO and "motherf*ck" each other by pointing the finger at whom did what wrong and otherwise insulting and pizzing each other off, why not allow our collective genius figure out the problems we can solve and then solve them as best we can. I'm all for open dialog but not if it isn't productive.

Things we cannot fix:

Stupidity
Arrogance
Ego
The ability to purchase unlimited power and speed

One thing we can solve- the blow-overs that continue to kill people. We've lost 5 highly regarded and talented people in the past 2-years by my count. All to the same "problem" that is inherent with these boats and is a relatively simple fix. Design, engineering, prototyping, R&D all cost money, and I certainly am not an aerodynamicist, but common sense tells me that once the solution is developed, these "accidents" would be much less common than they are now.

Asking people to follow rules works for most but not all (refer to things we cannot fix). But having a device that can stop the blow-over without human input or reaction, I think its pretty simple. It will not fix the roll-over or the collision or the inexperience and stupidity of the drivers, but it solves a huge issue and saves lives. Why not start a discussion about how this could be pulled off.

88bullet

iTrader: (1)

well i think its more than a simple fix. you cant just put wheelie bars on a cat. Go stand in your yard during a wind storm with a 4x8 sheet of plywood balanced on top of your head and tilt it up a little and see what you can do to prevent it from blowing backwards. at that kind of speed these guys are running they are like a plane ready to leave the ground. all it takes is a little wing tip and speed and up up and away you go. ive been in a cat at 145mph and its a pretty smooth ride due to the amount of air its packing and lack of hull still in the water. they are amazing pieces of machinery but at those speeds your flirting with disaster

glassdave

iTrader: (1)

I'm not an expert in any way but have my experience with running a cat fast. Not quite sure how to word this or if its appropriate but i guess this is as good a time and place as any. In the last ten years as i have found myself in groups of faster boaters and racers i have been around and witnessed my share of accidents and incidents. I have kept a quiet tally on prop rotation in boats that have gone over as i believe it is a big factor here. Nearly all the boats (if not all) were spinning in. This is not new news though, after we tried spinning in on the Wahoo Super Stock cat and went swimming after one lap i started to really pay attention more and looked into it. I believe Rich Luhrs (T2X) was a big proponent that tried to even outlaw spinning in on racing cats. When i read that somewhere i started to really realize that generally spinning in was a bad idea. The action of spinning props out tends to correct a boat that is near out of control and pulls the boat back down and flat while spinning in tends to cause the boat to pull the bottom out from under itself and become more violent. Spinning in also causes increased bow lift, couple that with wake crests from adjacent boats you are trying to overtake, tunnel volume is decreases causing higher air compression and even more lift enabling the bow to rise to the point of no return. A lot of guys just arent aware of this and my thoughts are just based on some personal experience as well as some observations. If any one could add to this with personal experiences please do so.

most people know me on here and know that i rarely jump into heated debates but i do feel strongly about this and if this thread can stay on track and as a source of education and information exchange then it will help all of us.

glassdave

iTrader: (1)

one other thing, I have seen repeated posts blaming boats crossing in front of the poker run fleet and i feel that this is absolutely the wrong direction to point blame. People, these are not closed course events and it is no ones responsibility to stay out of our way. A vast majority of boaters out there are not in any sort of loop that would alert them of any sort of event going on. They are every day boaters maybe just out on the lake for a day with the kids, why would they or should they know about it. Again these are not closed events and there is nothing that dictates right of way other the simple rules of the road navigation. If a person chooses to go a hundred and fifty miles an hour on an open public water way it is his sole responsibility to put the safety of others first. Some of the videos i have seen do not support this but i was not there, the clip of the red red Skater cutting in between the two anchored boats looked irresponsible but again i do not know what the situation was as i was not there.

bripar77

No way you would get a Boat Builder to install any kind of moving wing. The first time the thing doesn't work correctly they get sued and even if it works but doesn't prevent a blow over they get sued for it not preventing it. Hell if the thing works fine and somebody stuffs it then they get sued because somebody says that it caused the stuff. The Spinning In prop issue would be worth looking into but I am guessing that spinning in makes the boats run faster and that is why most everybody does it that way. Don't remember Tres talking about that in School. I think what might solve some of these recent PR accidents is to Charge a higher entry fee to the first couple groups (+120 MPH boats) and then use that money to hire Patrol Boats to close off a couple (for just an hour or so) of designated large wide open areas during the Poker Run that could be used to run fast. The rest of the run and day is limited to a certain speed. These fast areas need to be wide open parts of a lake. The Poker Runs I have been in are always in areas that don't provide enough width for the amount of boats running side by side except for a few exceptions were the lake opens up. That is the only place I feel conmfortable running fast. I usually end up on one extreme side or the other (ie: no boats to one side of us - doesn't always work out) so that I have room to bail out if need be. I don't run with the front runners so it is easier for me to make the choice to back out of the throttle if need be knowing I am not loosing anything.

Level III Chaos

iTrader: (1)

This one...or the other ones?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NGi5yU0FOs

glassdave

iTrader: (1)

Had not seen that one, jeezsus . . . thats nuts. Theres a kid like ten feet away. wtf? I realize people come out to spectate but is that really necessary? Musta been REAL close to that blue Baja off to the left in the beginning of the clip.

Wobble

Man, the more videos I see of this run, the more I can not believe the risks that are being taken.

Catastrophe

exactly !!!!!

Smitty

iTrader: (1)

Sad to say but that was Jeff and Brad and another boat coming way to close !!!