Prop Help? Houston 5 Blade.vs. Maximus.vs,. Hydro Pf5
02-20-2004, 04:24 PM
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Prop Help? Houston 5 Blade.vs. Maximus.vs,. Hydro Pf5
CURRENTLY HAVE LABBED 26 BRAVO ONES ON MY 40 OUTLAW. LOOKING AT THE 5 BLADES. WHICH ONE IS BEST , WHAT WILL IT DO FOR MID RANGE, PLANNING, AND TOP END. WHAT PITCH 5 BLADE WOULD BE EQUAL TO BRAVO 1 4 BLADE. ARE ALL OF THESE PROPS PRICED WITH LABBED FINISH. ALSO SHOULD I GET THEM POLISHED OR BRUSHED. I'VE HEARD BRUSHED IS FASTER THAAN POLISHED.
02-21-2004, 07:19 AM
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wiggler4490,
As far as which one is best that should be an easy answer. Which one of the props you listed has a proven record? There is only one, the Hydromotive. My personal opinion is that the Maximus needs work. I don't think it is quite right. I'm sure with time Mercury will get it working right but for now I believe there are other better options. The entire Hydromotive line speaks for itself. No other manufacturer has more experience with Bravo style 4 or 5 blades than Hydromotive. Hydromotive was the first to develop the 4 and 5 blade prop for the Bravo style outdrive. Can't say anything about the"houston 5 blade".
You will probably need a 24 pitch 5 blade.
You should expect an increase of 5-8 mph in the mid range, planning will be much better and top speed the same as your stock Bravo 1.
The Hydromotive and Mercury props are priced without lab finishing.
As far as polished of brushed the polished look better and don't rust as quickly. You should expect the same top end speed with either polished of brushed.
Matt
877 842 6855
As far as which one is best that should be an easy answer. Which one of the props you listed has a proven record? There is only one, the Hydromotive. My personal opinion is that the Maximus needs work. I don't think it is quite right. I'm sure with time Mercury will get it working right but for now I believe there are other better options. The entire Hydromotive line speaks for itself. No other manufacturer has more experience with Bravo style 4 or 5 blades than Hydromotive. Hydromotive was the first to develop the 4 and 5 blade prop for the Bravo style outdrive. Can't say anything about the"houston 5 blade".
You will probably need a 24 pitch 5 blade.
You should expect an increase of 5-8 mph in the mid range, planning will be much better and top speed the same as your stock Bravo 1.
The Hydromotive and Mercury props are priced without lab finishing.
As far as polished of brushed the polished look better and don't rust as quickly. You should expect the same top end speed with either polished of brushed.
Matt
877 842 6855
02-21-2004, 08:53 AM
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Not necessarily true,
Stock P-5X have had the same top end speed as stock Bravo 1's at the same WOT rpm with production props in real world testing, plus all the benefits of a 5 blade.
Matt
Stock P-5X have had the same top end speed as stock Bravo 1's at the same WOT rpm with production props in real world testing, plus all the benefits of a 5 blade.
Matt
02-21-2004, 02:22 PM
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Throttle-up, what have you found to be the reason behind so many of the Hydro's breaking blades? I have heard many people speak of one of their blades breaking off. And these were stock props, not even labbed. I would hate to fork out the money to lab a set of Hydro's then have a blade break. Has anything been done to stop this? I haven't heard of any Bravo's breaking any blades.
02-21-2004, 02:42 PM
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I had Hydros on my 42, and they sucked ! Constant blow out when comming on plane. If it was real rough out, had a real hell of a time. Top end was good as was acceleration, but out of the hole.....it was pretty bad.
Went to Bravo 1's. Problem gone. Lost a few mile per hour top end, but mid range cruise speed was up with the B1 no blow out and great hook up. The Hydros had no diffuser ring, but just about everyone I talked to said the Hydros had limited use and only worked well on certain boats. If I had the diffuser ring added, I would have lost the top end & stopped the blow out, Plus I wasnt happy with the idea of welding on a ring after the fact. The Bravo out of the box did the trick & no problems.
Plus with the Hydros I had a slight vibration getting on plane. Was told that was the blades on the Hydros flexing as they were thin and would do that. All that went away when I went to the Bravos. Just personal experience.
Not bashing the Hydro, just didnt work for my application and I didnt like them. The Merc boys must be doing something right. I have heard of some guys gaining up to 10mph with the new Merc 5 blades, running high X dimensions.......
Plus when I inquired about trading my brand new Hydros to a certain prop shop, in exchange towards a new set of B1's, I was only offered $400.00 for both props ! I think that says something about the Hydro in my opinion.
Went to Bravo 1's. Problem gone. Lost a few mile per hour top end, but mid range cruise speed was up with the B1 no blow out and great hook up. The Hydros had no diffuser ring, but just about everyone I talked to said the Hydros had limited use and only worked well on certain boats. If I had the diffuser ring added, I would have lost the top end & stopped the blow out, Plus I wasnt happy with the idea of welding on a ring after the fact. The Bravo out of the box did the trick & no problems.
Plus with the Hydros I had a slight vibration getting on plane. Was told that was the blades on the Hydros flexing as they were thin and would do that. All that went away when I went to the Bravos. Just personal experience.
Not bashing the Hydro, just didnt work for my application and I didnt like them. The Merc boys must be doing something right. I have heard of some guys gaining up to 10mph with the new Merc 5 blades, running high X dimensions.......
Plus when I inquired about trading my brand new Hydros to a certain prop shop, in exchange towards a new set of B1's, I was only offered $400.00 for both props ! I think that says something about the Hydro in my opinion.
02-22-2004, 07:55 AM
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mpally,
As far as blades breaking this is a problem that is getting worse with all props.
Bravo style props were designed years ago when horsepower levels barely hit 300. Now it is common place to have 700-800 or more through a Bravo style drive. Yet the props are the same. Everybody wants to go faster. This requires a thinner blade. The thinner the blade the weaker it is and the greater the chance of breakage.
As far as breakage on Hydro's I have seen more Bravo's with broken blades than Hydro's. Just replaced one for a customer, stock 22 Bravo 1 on a 225 outboard. He only got about 10 hours on it and lost 1/3 of a blade. I have seen Hydro's fail as well.
The cleaver/semi-cleaver (Hydro Quad IV) design prop has a great load on the trailing edge of the prop. The load on a round ear prop (Bravo 1) is distributed along a rounded trailing edge which is a stronger prop design.
There is no doubt that a stock prop is stronger than a lab finished prop. All manufactures have a warranty on stock props and will replace them if they break during the warranty period. Of course if the prop is lab finished or modified the warranty is void.
Props work in a brutal environment, especially a surfacing prop. Every time the blade re-enters the water it flexes from the load on it. Like any other metal that is constantly flexing it will eventually fail. Factors such as the weight of the boat, torque, HP, water conditions and driver style all have a great deal to do with the longevity of the prop.
Matt
As far as blades breaking this is a problem that is getting worse with all props.
Bravo style props were designed years ago when horsepower levels barely hit 300. Now it is common place to have 700-800 or more through a Bravo style drive. Yet the props are the same. Everybody wants to go faster. This requires a thinner blade. The thinner the blade the weaker it is and the greater the chance of breakage.
As far as breakage on Hydro's I have seen more Bravo's with broken blades than Hydro's. Just replaced one for a customer, stock 22 Bravo 1 on a 225 outboard. He only got about 10 hours on it and lost 1/3 of a blade. I have seen Hydro's fail as well.
The cleaver/semi-cleaver (Hydro Quad IV) design prop has a great load on the trailing edge of the prop. The load on a round ear prop (Bravo 1) is distributed along a rounded trailing edge which is a stronger prop design.
There is no doubt that a stock prop is stronger than a lab finished prop. All manufactures have a warranty on stock props and will replace them if they break during the warranty period. Of course if the prop is lab finished or modified the warranty is void.
Props work in a brutal environment, especially a surfacing prop. Every time the blade re-enters the water it flexes from the load on it. Like any other metal that is constantly flexing it will eventually fail. Factors such as the weight of the boat, torque, HP, water conditions and driver style all have a great deal to do with the longevity of the prop.
Matt
02-22-2004, 08:16 AM
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teamsonic42,
What you described is a common comparison between the Bravo 1 and Hydro Quad IV. The application of the Quad IV had limited applications. Some boats do very well with the Quad IV design, such as Fountains, and some boats won't even get on plane with a Quad IV, like a Warlock.
We have some customers who don't care about planning ability and will live with a boat that is difficult to get on plane as long as there is a speed increase on the top end. Other customers don't care about a couple mph on the top end if they have to give up planning ability. It's important for us to listen to the customer and recommend a prop that best suites their boating style.
The only speed increases I have heard about from a stock Maximus was at cruise. We have had several customers test the lab finished Maximus, Hydro P-5 and Hering 5 blade. Never has a customer told me that the Maximus was faster than either the P-5 or Hering. If you know someone who picked up top end with a Maximus I would be interested in talking them and find out what kind of boat and set-up they had.
It's important to keep in mind the target customer of Mercury and Hydromotive. Mercury needs to make a prop that runs good on all boats in just about any set-up. They have done a great job with the Bravo 1. You can put a Bravo 1 on any sport boat and it will run well. Hydromotive targets a high performance customer who wants the last couple mph from the boat. They have done a great job with that as well.
Hydromotive realized that they were missing a large segment of the boating market with the Quad IV and P-5 due to the complaints you described. In response to that they have developed a new line of propellers called the X series.
The Quad IVX and P5X are a bow lifting propeller with increased blade area and a rounded trailing edge. It has more positive rake than the Quad IV and P5. Our testing with these props has shown that a stock Quad IVX runs about the same top end as a lab finished Bravo 1. The plane off is similar to a Bravo 1 as well.
Attached is a picture of the new Quad IVX.
Sorry about the long winded response.
Matt
What you described is a common comparison between the Bravo 1 and Hydro Quad IV. The application of the Quad IV had limited applications. Some boats do very well with the Quad IV design, such as Fountains, and some boats won't even get on plane with a Quad IV, like a Warlock.
We have some customers who don't care about planning ability and will live with a boat that is difficult to get on plane as long as there is a speed increase on the top end. Other customers don't care about a couple mph on the top end if they have to give up planning ability. It's important for us to listen to the customer and recommend a prop that best suites their boating style.
The only speed increases I have heard about from a stock Maximus was at cruise. We have had several customers test the lab finished Maximus, Hydro P-5 and Hering 5 blade. Never has a customer told me that the Maximus was faster than either the P-5 or Hering. If you know someone who picked up top end with a Maximus I would be interested in talking them and find out what kind of boat and set-up they had.
It's important to keep in mind the target customer of Mercury and Hydromotive. Mercury needs to make a prop that runs good on all boats in just about any set-up. They have done a great job with the Bravo 1. You can put a Bravo 1 on any sport boat and it will run well. Hydromotive targets a high performance customer who wants the last couple mph from the boat. They have done a great job with that as well.
Hydromotive realized that they were missing a large segment of the boating market with the Quad IV and P-5 due to the complaints you described. In response to that they have developed a new line of propellers called the X series.
The Quad IVX and P5X are a bow lifting propeller with increased blade area and a rounded trailing edge. It has more positive rake than the Quad IV and P5. Our testing with these props has shown that a stock Quad IVX runs about the same top end as a lab finished Bravo 1. The plane off is similar to a Bravo 1 as well.
Attached is a picture of the new Quad IVX.
Sorry about the long winded response.
Matt
Charter Member
