Re: Fu*%ing Theives
 

Btw: why shoot 'em, I don't shell out to feed 110 lb. dogs for nuthin :D

Re: Fu*%ing Theives
 

Excellent thread with many interesting observations.

I can't think of an 'emptier' feeling than being stolen from. I'm one of those 'eye for an eye' types. I agree with most who lean this way in this discussion...

Danny O and JUST ONCE- It would be hard to top those capable performers as the first line of defense. Man's best friend...thief, think again!

Brian

Re: Fu*%ing Theives
 

Like it or not, many (I want to say most) Americans with guns will shoot someone over property theft, TRUST ME!!! I review and contract to Repo agents all day long. I have asked most of them if they have been shot at. They either have, or havent yet. But its just how people choose to protect there assets. The thing that I love watching in my business, is that more people will protect getting there assets with a gun, rather than protecting it by PAYING FOR IT!!!
And for the record, stealing in Luisiana is just plain taking your chances. I give less than 50/50% on getting away with it.

Re: Fu*%ing Theives
 

Troutly'reponse is typical of a cop in a state with no concealed carry permits. I talked to several cops before the State of Texas enacted the concealed carry permits. Everyone of them said that if the citizens carried guns, it would be total anarchy and a vast increase in murder and other violent crimes. Now that many Texans carry concealed guns, the crime of car jacking has almost disappeared because those perpetrators are now afraid that if they grab the door handle of your car, they may get shot by the heretofore unprotected white man or woman. In general, violent crimes of opportunity have decreased. And there is a very, very strong consensus among the police that the law has been good for the prevention of crime.
By the way, you are taught how to recognize potential problems and help defuse the situation. And lastly, when a cop stops you for a traffic violation, you are supposed to give him your drivers license and carry permit card. He will immediately treat you as a friend because only the good guys have permits, as the screening process is very thorough.

Re: Fu*%ing Theives
 

You people are retarded on here. Thinking it's ok To blow a guys head off because he was stealing your lawn mower. If that's Ok Then when your kid gets shot because he steals a candy bar then that's ok too then. Can you imagine if 1 person was Judge , Jury, And executioner. We'd be back to old west shoot out days. And don't tell me crime was low back then because everyone carried a weapon. People were shot and killed over petty arguements right in the street. Problem is most people lack common sense, and the capability to reason. I understand that a person on my property shouldn't be stealing my things. But if the courts allow me to shoot and kill or cripple someone over a $200 lawn mower or ATV then they'd have to re-write all the law books changing punishments to death for everything. NO I'm not anti- gun, I have a about 15 myself. I just have enough common sense to know what guns are forand when to use 1.

Re: Fu*%ing Theives
 

Von, I hear what you're saying about the concealed weapons practically eliminating car jackings. I personally know of a couple people that carry concealed weapons. Not sure if they're legal or not so I won't mention names. But, in this case..both are really nice guys. One of them carries our company employee paychecks around (a few hundred of them at a time) and delivers them and he doesn't want anybody's paycheck getting stolen.

I think Troutly and the other cops deal with another breed entirely. I don't think they're worried about the lawful citizens carrying the gun with a permit, it's the ones that buy the guns off the black market. Look at what cops deal with every day - sure, there's the speeding tickets that piss us all off and we breathe a sigh of relief when we drive through and they're already busy filling out the ticket for the sucker that got nabbed and now we probably can drive for another 5 miles without worrying - but I would be willing to bet a LARGE portion of their calls are spent with domestic violence and/or addiction. Neither of which are safe for them and can turn highly volitile in a heartbeat.

Viper, I don't understand why you take exception to the system backing them up if they misjudge. Clearly if there are a lot of complaints against a cop (to IA) they have to look at "God syndrome" but let's be honest - I'd be willing to bet a year of my pay that any of the perps that got shot were not on a walk home from church and simply putting their hands behind their back like good boys and girls when the cop said to, which is probably what is portrayed in the lawsuit their mom's bring against the cops.

Now, it takes a lot for me to say this and back up a cop. Some cops (sorry Trout) are thicker than thieves and if one decides he doesn't like you for some reason, he tells his cop friends and they can make your life miserable. We need to give them the respect they deserve (worded that way on purpose). I know I try to...even if my favorite song is "Piggy" by Nine Inch Nails.

And...if the cop really IS in the wrong, they're dealt with internally. I'm quite certain that's true. If their God syndrome happens to include shooting people (or dogs as the case may be) it is not ignored. They back up the otherwise good cops. The ones with repeated questionable judgement end up pushing papers or on airport duty with the newbies.

Re: Fu*%ing Theives
 

Troutly Wrote

Viper31,

You simply cannot compare the two. We are empowered by law to do a lot of things 'you' can't. We are expected to go to the fight, not turn and walk the other way. There are many laws (and case law) that gives us much more lattitude in dealing with use of force situations and the courts normally view our actions through the eyes of a 'reasonable peace officer', not joe-**** the citizen.

We can also stop and detain people without arresting them. 'You' cannot do that (at least here in MN a private citizen cannot). A private citizen here can only arrest based on probable cause and has no authority to detain an investigate. We also can use deadly force in more situations than a private citizen can. We also get to use force a step above the bad guy as we get to detain and arrrest.

Simply put, we often times operate under a different set of rules than the average citizen does. If you take the time to look at the big picture you will see it has to be that way.

Troutly,

It is just this type of attitude that causes many 'Peace Officers' to think that they do not work for "Joe-****" the citizen as you put it. Just look at how many times the word "We" and "You" is used in your writings. There is no doubt that Law Enforcement Officers are expected to do many things they should not be and are certainly underpaid. I have seen many Officers perform admirably and I certainly appreciate the work that they do, but to think that anyone wearing a badge should not be held to the same level of scrutiny as a person not wearing a badge is ridiculous simply because they have been to a certain type of training and have been sworn in.

My point is simply this, there are many cases where innocent people are shot and killed by Law Enforcement Officers in this country. Unfortunately these are usually page 16 news for one day and all are usually written about in a similar manner with references like:

Man with criminal record was distrought.
Man was suspected of selling drugs.
Officers said they fired their revolvers eight times because they believed their lives and those of others were in immediate danger
Officer was in fear of being run over.
Officer "Friendly" was not making any statements at this time.

Watch the case in NJ and see how many times he is written about or talked about on local TV news. I will bet that if he has ever been arested, even for a minor infraction, or his firearms paperwork is not in order, it is already being reported.

Re: Fu*%ing Theives
 

Here's my "memory" of another simular story.

A fellow had a store in the inner city. It had been broken into several times, each time through the same window. Every time the window was forced open in the same manner. The police never caught the guy. The owner was sick of this happening and rigged a trap. He ran some bare copper wires INSIDE of the window and hooked up 220volts to them. The burgular broken to the store, was electrocuted and died. The owner was charged with something, but I can't recall what. It may have been manslaughter or a parallel charge. What did the owner do wrong?


If I recall correctly, I remember it being something about the owner KNOWING that the burgular would be coming through that window and may die from his trap.

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To Bonnie Outlaw;
So you are from NY, are you going to the NYC poker run. I am coming up from Texas for the good time Fri nite and Sat. If you are there, stop and say hi.

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Hey Cap....What P.O.S. ATV do you have thats only worth $200.00? :rolleyes: :drink: