Water Injection
02-25-2008, 08:17 AM
#11
Charter Member
Sure, although on a boat there is a supply issue. I have used it on high compression street engines and ran regular fuel, only bringing in water at low vacuum/ open throttle times (rarely in a car). On a boat you are under a load all the time so when you bump the compression and timing up to make more power you will squirt a lot of water, requiring a LOT of water to inject. Obviously if you add methanol that is even more of an issue. If you throw a vacuum gauge on your engine and run some vacuum at cruise, then you could make it work with a little tuning. But you will not see huge numbers, just a nice increase and safety from bad gas.
02-25-2008, 08:32 AM
#12
Registered
Platinum Member
Sure, although on a boat there is a supply issue. I have used it on high compression street engines and ran regular fuel, only bringing in water at low vacuum/ open throttle times (rarely in a car). On a boat you are under a load all the time so when you bump the compression and timing up to make more power you will squirt a lot of water, requiring a LOT of water to inject. Obviously if you add methanol that is even more of an issue. If you throw a vacuum gauge on your engine and run some vacuum at cruise, then you could make it work with a little tuning. But you will not see huge numbers, just a nice increase and safety from bad gas.
02-25-2008, 08:33 AM
#13
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When we used the systems on the old Banks turbo systems, we took pressure from the manifold and used it to pressurize the holding tank. That made it self-powered and self regulated. 1lb boost pushed a little through the nozzles, 10 pushed alot. Nowadays it looks like you can do it much more precisely- http://www.alcohol-injection.com
If you want to read some of the early tech info written on the concept-
If you want to read some of the early tech info written on the concept-
02-25-2008, 10:01 AM
#14
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When we used the systems on the old Banks turbo systems, we took pressure from the manifold and used it to pressurize the holding tank. That made it self-powered and self regulated. 1lb boost pushed a little through the nozzles, 10 pushed alot. Nowadays it looks like you can do it much more precisely- http://www.alcohol-injection.com
If you want to read some of the early tech info written on the concept-
If you want to read some of the early tech info written on the concept-
Right down to the proper gaskets,solenoids,plugs, gap etc. As Methanol will eat standard gaskets as well as bonding agents for lunch in a few hrs,the leading kits solenoids will also only last one or two blasts in this application etc, we have tried them all..
We now have over 120 flawless hrs on this set up.
Simple and safer hp and we have averaged approx 10+ gallons of Meth to 250 gallons of 93 pump gas running as much as 15+ lbs of 14-71 High Helix boost with even and very acceptable EGTs..The only thing You will require besides an engine assemble designed to handle your hp level as well as an excellent cooling system will be an EGT gauge to help tune as you add to your boost levels.
Low water temps and EGT data are a must!
02-25-2008, 08:32 PM
#15
Registered
I was just wondering about these water injection systems the other day, and possible marine applications. I remember them back in the late 70's/early 80's...reading articles in Car Craft and looking through the Summit Racing catalog.
As I recall, those [water only] systems were reported to deliver not only a mild HP boost but even slightly better MPG as well, depending on how they were set up. Actually, the efficiency factor was what really had my interest this time around...though more HP is always welcome!
As I recall, those [water only] systems were reported to deliver not only a mild HP boost but even slightly better MPG as well, depending on how they were set up. Actually, the efficiency factor was what really had my interest this time around...though more HP is always welcome!
02-25-2008, 09:05 PM
#16
Banned
[QUOTE=Pantera28-650HP;2459890]Can it be used to protect the engine at high boost and not really add huge HP???
I have enough problems with HP!!!!!
Seriously. I would be interested in learning more. When do you guys go public with your equipment?
Runninghot - Where's John located?
Johns in Yorkville RT 47 & 126
give him a jingle he's knows this chit backwords & forwards .. I believe he's in Dubai or japan this week but will call you back
I have enough problems with HP!!!!!
Seriously. I would be interested in learning more. When do you guys go public with your equipment?
Runninghot - Where's John located?
Johns in Yorkville RT 47 & 126
give him a jingle he's knows this chit backwords & forwards .. I believe he's in Dubai or japan this week but will call you back
02-25-2008, 09:19 PM
#17
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Not just HP!! Methanol/ Water Injection used properly will make an engine much more efficient across the board! It is recommended to run a 50/50 to a 60/40 Methanol to Water ratio for various reasons and is considered extremely dangerous and detrimental to engine components at 100%! We will be doing a fair amount of research on this in the coming weeks and months as well as real world testing on Gas and Diesel engines.
02-25-2008, 09:28 PM
#18
Registered
I think it fell out of favor for a bunch of reasons:
1) Knock sensors allowed engines to be tuned much closer to insipient knock today than 30 years ago.
2) Fast burn combustion chambers allow for higher compression ratios. The new BMW M3 V8 has a 12:1 compression ratio!
3) Fuel injection manifolds are not good at distributing water injected at the throttle body, so a decent system would require setting up some sort of port injection.
4) A system should detect when the water reservoir is empty, and adjust the engine parameters accordingly, if you are really going to get the full benefit of water injection.
5) The amount of engine octane requirement only drops by 1 to 2 points.
6) People are lazy about filling another tank, and/or they forget.
That being said, it is still a viable system.
Michael
1) Knock sensors allowed engines to be tuned much closer to insipient knock today than 30 years ago.
2) Fast burn combustion chambers allow for higher compression ratios. The new BMW M3 V8 has a 12:1 compression ratio!
3) Fuel injection manifolds are not good at distributing water injected at the throttle body, so a decent system would require setting up some sort of port injection.
4) A system should detect when the water reservoir is empty, and adjust the engine parameters accordingly, if you are really going to get the full benefit of water injection.
5) The amount of engine octane requirement only drops by 1 to 2 points.
6) People are lazy about filling another tank, and/or they forget.
That being said, it is still a viable system.
Michael
02-26-2008, 08:59 AM
#19
Registered
I saw a boat once with a hose out of the exhaust elbow drain plug, thru a filter, then into the top of the flame arrestor into the carb. Self regulating once you get the base flow correct, I guess it worked. Simplest method I ever could imagine. Fresh clean lakes only of course.
