Converting an old school Gale Banks Twin Turbo system to modern technology
12-10-2015, 11:04 AM
#21
Registered
Few things,
Why throttle bodys before the turbos? Never found a good reason for this and turbos hate pulling vacuum on the intake side of the compressor.
If it was mine I would be using BBC EFI manifolds running a Holley HP efi system. If your running this thing on the edge I would want the injectors as close the intake valves as possible. What you will find with a throttle body injection is fuel flow to cylinder can be off as much as 10%.
I can only tell you what my system is doing but I have a pair of 64mm turbos on a 5.3ls motor running Holley HP efi thru the factory plasitic intake(yikes). Tuning has been a super simple and easy with Holley system.
I have used Mega squirt on plenty of projects it works in theroy and I have gotten it to work but it never seemed to be the same day in and day out. Was alawys messing with it, On my last project I was able to simple switch over to a Motec system copy Spark and fuel maps and the thing ran 10x better. Should have done that long ago.
I'm guessing your looking at mega squirt from a cost standpoint since you have to buy 2 of everything. Spend the money upfront and get a good system it will pay for it self in the long run. I blew up a few to many motors running mega on the edge, luckly for me works paid for them
Just my 2 cents
Why throttle bodys before the turbos? Never found a good reason for this and turbos hate pulling vacuum on the intake side of the compressor.
If it was mine I would be using BBC EFI manifolds running a Holley HP efi system. If your running this thing on the edge I would want the injectors as close the intake valves as possible. What you will find with a throttle body injection is fuel flow to cylinder can be off as much as 10%.
I can only tell you what my system is doing but I have a pair of 64mm turbos on a 5.3ls motor running Holley HP efi thru the factory plasitic intake(yikes). Tuning has been a super simple and easy with Holley system.
I have used Mega squirt on plenty of projects it works in theroy and I have gotten it to work but it never seemed to be the same day in and day out. Was alawys messing with it, On my last project I was able to simple switch over to a Motec system copy Spark and fuel maps and the thing ran 10x better. Should have done that long ago.
I'm guessing your looking at mega squirt from a cost standpoint since you have to buy 2 of everything. Spend the money upfront and get a good system it will pay for it self in the long run. I blew up a few to many motors running mega on the edge, luckly for me works paid for them
Just my 2 cents
The following users liked this post:
kvogt (06-03-2021)
12-10-2015, 11:33 AM
#22
Platinum Member
Platinum MemberThread Starter
Few things,
Why throttle bodys before the turbos? Never found a good reason for this and turbos hate pulling vacuum on the intake side of the compressor.
If it was mine I would be using BBC EFI manifolds running a Holley HP efi system. If your running this thing on the edge I would want the injectors as close the intake valves as possible. What you will find with a throttle body injection is fuel flow to cylinder can be off as much as 10%.
I can only tell you what my system is doing but I have a pair of 64mm turbos on a 5.3ls motor running Holley HP efi thru the factory plasitic intake(yikes). Tuning has been a super simple and easy with Holley system.
I have used Mega squirt on plenty of projects it works in theroy and I have gotten it to work but it never seemed to be the same day in and day out. Was alawys messing with it, On my last project I was able to simple switch over to a Motec system copy Spark and fuel maps and the thing ran 10x better. Should have done that long ago.
I'm guessing your looking at mega squirt from a cost standpoint since you have to buy 2 of everything. Spend the money upfront and get a good system it will pay for it self in the long run. I blew up a few to many motors running mega on the edge, luckly for me works paid for them
Just my 2 cents
Why throttle bodys before the turbos? Never found a good reason for this and turbos hate pulling vacuum on the intake side of the compressor.
If it was mine I would be using BBC EFI manifolds running a Holley HP efi system. If your running this thing on the edge I would want the injectors as close the intake valves as possible. What you will find with a throttle body injection is fuel flow to cylinder can be off as much as 10%.
I can only tell you what my system is doing but I have a pair of 64mm turbos on a 5.3ls motor running Holley HP efi thru the factory plasitic intake(yikes). Tuning has been a super simple and easy with Holley system.
I have used Mega squirt on plenty of projects it works in theroy and I have gotten it to work but it never seemed to be the same day in and day out. Was alawys messing with it, On my last project I was able to simple switch over to a Motec system copy Spark and fuel maps and the thing ran 10x better. Should have done that long ago.
I'm guessing your looking at mega squirt from a cost standpoint since you have to buy 2 of everything. Spend the money upfront and get a good system it will pay for it self in the long run. I blew up a few to many motors running mega on the edge, luckly for me works paid for them
Just my 2 cents
TB before the turbos because it will make my plumbing simpler, and the turbos are Rayjays so they are able to handle pulling thru the TB.
The EFI system is using port fuel injection.
What kind of Megasquirt system were you using? A MS1? MS2? MS3?
12-10-2015, 03:22 PM
#23
Registered
12-11-2015, 06:35 AM
#24
Registered
not runing it on the edge. I am looking for 650 hp but more importantly i want better cold starts and driveability.
Tb before the turbos because it will make my plumbing simpler, and the turbos are rayjays so they are able to handle pulling thru the tb.
The efi system is using port fuel injection.
What kind of megasquirt system were you using? A ms1? Ms2? Ms3?
Tb before the turbos because it will make my plumbing simpler, and the turbos are rayjays so they are able to handle pulling thru the tb.
The efi system is using port fuel injection.
What kind of megasquirt system were you using? A ms1? Ms2? Ms3?
12-11-2015, 12:15 PM
#26
Platinum Member
Platinum MemberThread Starter
The ECU
I have been all over the internet with this decision. I use to work in a hot rod shop in the 90's and anytime a customer wanted to add functionality to their EFI system we had to send the ecu back to the manufacturer so they could turn that bit on. EFI ecu's have come a long way since the DFI gen 6 systems. I looked at FAST, DFI, Holley, Megasquirt, comparing the outputs, inputs, table scaling, customer feedback, ease of tuning, ease of setting up the base configuration. The thing that turned me off to the FAST and DFI systems was that you had to pay for upgrades that were already in the box. About 5 years ago i found out about the Megasquirt systems and bought a version 3 to play with on my '86 TPI Vette. I wanted the top of the line that could do sequential injection and coil on plug to play with it and all the settings. It was more than enough to run the engine in batch fire with a conventional distributor ignition. The thing that I liked about it was that it was 1/2 the price of the comparable systems ($750.00).
12-11-2015, 03:31 PM
#27
Registered
I bought (2) sets of Gentry turbos. They were EFI, but I've been told they the system was ill-functioning speed density system and the cost to revamp the existing system was cost prohibitive.
To the point---the system I bought had a crossover pipe between the turbos (with a 4150 mount) dead in the middle, with a single throttle body mounted there (before the turbos like a carb) and the rest was rail fuel injection with injectors at the intake and the ECU box mounted to a plate at the back of the engine. Turbos move dry air metered pre-turbo, fuel injected at valves, easy breezy!
To the point---the system I bought had a crossover pipe between the turbos (with a 4150 mount) dead in the middle, with a single throttle body mounted there (before the turbos like a carb) and the rest was rail fuel injection with injectors at the intake and the ECU box mounted to a plate at the back of the engine. Turbos move dry air metered pre-turbo, fuel injected at valves, easy breezy!
06-02-2021, 09:53 PM
#28
Registered
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Alcalde
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am going to start a build thread on converting my Mercruiser 476 HP Gale Banks twin turbo engines to EFI. In doing this I have set out some limitations and goals.
1. Reuse as much of my existing equipment and parts as possible.
2. Reliability is the #1 top priority,
3. Driveability is a close 2nd.
4. Budget is a concern.
5. What items will I have to compromise on.
My existing engine consists of the following
1980 454 block 4 bolt main
GM forged steel crank
7/16 GM forged rods
TRW forged blower pistons with pressed pins. 7.5:1 compression ratio
Iron rectangular port factory heads with stainless 2.19 intake and Inconel 1.88 exhaust valves
Crane gold rockers
ARP rocker arm studs
ARP head bolts
Felpro Marine head gaskets
double roller timing chain set
Nothing too fancy in the long block.
Here is where it get interesting.
Intake system
existing: dual plane Mercruiser intake manifold
PFM dual core intercooler that sits on top of the intake manifold
Draw thru Twin Rayjay E trim turbos with the bypass hole in the exhaust housing welded shut.
single 800 CFM Holley double pumper with electric choke
mechanical 110 gph free flow fuel pump preset at 7psi
mechanical waste gates calibrated to open at 10 psi of boost
Ignition system:
MSD distributor, rotor locked and timing set at 32 degrees of timing.
MSD 6 ignition box
MSD rev limiter.
7 mm wires.
Exhaust system:
Mercruiser rear exit iron log manifolds
1" thick plates for the wastegates between the manifold and the turbo riser.
3/8 studs to attach the turbos to the manifolds.
Wishlist for the new EFI sysytem:
1. sequential fuel injectors
2. individual cylinder control for spark
3. coil on plug ignition
4. adjustable boost control.
5. methanol injection
6. O2 correction
7. knock detection
8. Multi octane spark/ fuel table selection
I already have some parts purchased but will continue to post pictures of the old system and the new system. I also have to give big thanks to Mr. Gadgets who has guided me with some of my parts selection so far and Akattack for detailing the original history of the boat and how he modified the original turbo system.
1. Reuse as much of my existing equipment and parts as possible.
2. Reliability is the #1 top priority,
3. Driveability is a close 2nd.
4. Budget is a concern.
5. What items will I have to compromise on.
My existing engine consists of the following
1980 454 block 4 bolt main
GM forged steel crank
7/16 GM forged rods
TRW forged blower pistons with pressed pins. 7.5:1 compression ratio
Iron rectangular port factory heads with stainless 2.19 intake and Inconel 1.88 exhaust valves
Crane gold rockers
ARP rocker arm studs
ARP head bolts
Felpro Marine head gaskets
double roller timing chain set
Nothing too fancy in the long block.
Here is where it get interesting.
Intake system
existing: dual plane Mercruiser intake manifold
PFM dual core intercooler that sits on top of the intake manifold
Draw thru Twin Rayjay E trim turbos with the bypass hole in the exhaust housing welded shut.
single 800 CFM Holley double pumper with electric choke
mechanical 110 gph free flow fuel pump preset at 7psi
mechanical waste gates calibrated to open at 10 psi of boost
Ignition system:
MSD distributor, rotor locked and timing set at 32 degrees of timing.
MSD 6 ignition box
MSD rev limiter.
7 mm wires.
Exhaust system:
Mercruiser rear exit iron log manifolds
1" thick plates for the wastegates between the manifold and the turbo riser.
3/8 studs to attach the turbos to the manifolds.
Wishlist for the new EFI sysytem:
1. sequential fuel injectors
2. individual cylinder control for spark
3. coil on plug ignition
4. adjustable boost control.
5. methanol injection
6. O2 correction
7. knock detection
8. Multi octane spark/ fuel table selection
I already have some parts purchased but will continue to post pictures of the old system and the new system. I also have to give big thanks to Mr. Gadgets who has guided me with some of my parts selection so far and Akattack for detailing the original history of the boat and how he modified the original turbo system.
