Best Cat design Mike Peters?
#31
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catmando,
1)
Skater people are loyal to their brand. I would hope and expect they argue against the statement I made.
For the record, I respect Pete and his product. Both are originals. :-)
Pete Hledin is one of those pioneers in this industry, who is entitled to claim an original design. His products have been splashed as well.
2)
If an independent panel of professionals would come to the conclusion that the Mystic 50 is not a splash of the 43 Tencara, I will issue a full page formal apology in both Powerboat Magazine and Performance Boats magazine. Needless to say, I would not have made the statement, if I would think there is a risk of having to print a retraction.
Andreas
#32
I really dont now who is Mike peters but my respect, Mystic, Platinum and other catamarans desings,FOR ME , are inspired in the old Team Victory and Jolly Motors catamarans who raced around 1997 in the UIM circuit this boats were basically the same about 45-50 ft not too wide but with a very big tunnel.
The controversy here is the John Cosker, founder of Mystic, throttled for Callan Marine so someone got it in their head that since he has seat time in a Michael Peters boat and is himself a Naval Architect, he must have copied it on a giant Xerox or something and then out popped a 50 Mystic. I would like to see a Xerox machine that big, although it must be broken because the boats are very differnt, not just becasue of the 2 foot difference either. I think class 1 tunnel width is 72". Supercat is 66"
#33
catmando,
2)
If an independent panel of professionals would come to the conclusion that the Mystic 50 is not a splash of the 43 Tencara, I will issue a full page formal apology in both Powerboat Magazine and Performance Boats magazine. Needless to say, I would not have made the statement, if I would think there is a risk of having to print a retraction.
Andreas
2)
If an independent panel of professionals would come to the conclusion that the Mystic 50 is not a splash of the 43 Tencara, I will issue a full page formal apology in both Powerboat Magazine and Performance Boats magazine. Needless to say, I would not have made the statement, if I would think there is a risk of having to print a retraction.
Andreas
Guilty until proven innocent??? Thats a great philosophy. Watch the videos from the LOTO Shootout in 04 with the Tencara and in 05 with the Mystic and see how much better the Mystic rides.
Maybe you can answer this for me.
Why did Cintron go from a Platinum to a Mystic???
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The controversy here is the John Cosker, founder of Mystic, throttled for Callan Marine so someone got it in their head that since he has seat time in a Michael Peters boat and is himself a Naval Architect, he must have copied it on a giant Xerox or something and then out popped a 50 Mystic. I would like to see a Xerox machine that big, although it must be broken because the boats are very differnt, not just becasue of the 2 foot difference either. I think class 1 tunnel width is 72". Supercat is 66"
your ideas are amusing! :-)
The scanning equipment of Brian Jones, the individual who scanned the 43 Tencara for John Cosker, will probably fit in the back of your car.
The APBA Supercat rules indeed have the tunnel width restricted to 66 inches. UIM Class 1 does not have this tunnel width restriction, so these boats, including the 43 Tencara, have a wider tunnel.
Andreas
#36
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Ok don't beat me up here but I'm not a Naval Architect so here goes. How different can a 200 mph offshore cats be? At those speeds, I would think that there is a rather standard length to width ratio of the sponsons and boat. Also it would appear that the amount of lift a tunnel makes could be easily calculated with software. So my point is there is a reason Formula 1 cars, fighter plane wings and shapes etc are all nearly identical. I would think it is not that hard to "design" the perfect shape the trick is to tune it perfectly.
So how far off am I?
So how far off am I?
#37
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Ok don't beat me up here but I'm not a Naval Architect so here goes. How different can a 200 mph offshore cats be? At those speeds, I would think that there is a rather standard length to width ratio of the sponsons and boat. Also it would appear that the amount of lift a tunnel makes could be easily calculated with software. So my point is there is a reason Formula 1 cars, fighter plane wings and shapes etc are all nearly identical. I would think it is not that hard to "design" the perfect shape the trick is to tune it perfectly.
So how far off am I?
So how far off am I?
Good questions...but Lamborghini, Ferrari, Porsche, Corvette, Mercedes, and Bugatti (among others) all make 200 mph cars and yet you can spot them as unique from 100 yards away. You can also clearly tell an F16 from an F18 or an F4 for that matter from a MIG.......at a greater distance.
The statement that form follows function....exactly and repetitively....is patently absurd. As an example, Peter Hledin has been able to take his 32 foot designs and completely change them over the years... with integrity and completely from scratch. To say that any cat you make must look like Peter Hledin's or Mike Peter's designs because there are limits based on the hp/speed envelope..is ludicrous... especially since those two gentlemen's designs are so clearly different from each other's.
T2x
#38
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T2X,
Thanks for not being to hard on me, but as I said, I don't design boats. I assumed that like a bullet or for that matter anything, their is only ONE design that is the most efficient on the water and all designs would eventually evolve to that design. Regarding the cars I referenced, my point really was to the bullet shape, air diffusors and overall smoothing of the body. The wing designs on planes are probably the most developed man made designs and all follow the same lift principals.
So as the Cat evolves, I would assume they would all be nearly identical at some point in the future.
Thanks for not being to hard on me, but as I said, I don't design boats. I assumed that like a bullet or for that matter anything, their is only ONE design that is the most efficient on the water and all designs would eventually evolve to that design. Regarding the cars I referenced, my point really was to the bullet shape, air diffusors and overall smoothing of the body. The wing designs on planes are probably the most developed man made designs and all follow the same lift principals.
So as the Cat evolves, I would assume they would all be nearly identical at some point in the future.
#39
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T2X,
Thanks for not being to hard on me, but as I said, I don't design boats. I assumed that like a bullet or for that matter anything, their is only ONE design that is the most efficient on the water and all designs would eventually evolve to that design. Regarding the cars I referenced, my point really was to the bullet shape, air diffusors and overall smoothing of the body. The wing designs on planes are probably the most developed man made designs and all follow the same lift principals.
So as the Cat evolves, I would assume they would all be nearly identical at some point in the future.
Thanks for not being to hard on me, but as I said, I don't design boats. I assumed that like a bullet or for that matter anything, their is only ONE design that is the most efficient on the water and all designs would eventually evolve to that design. Regarding the cars I referenced, my point really was to the bullet shape, air diffusors and overall smoothing of the body. The wing designs on planes are probably the most developed man made designs and all follow the same lift principals.
So as the Cat evolves, I would assume they would all be nearly identical at some point in the future.
Look.....you have two kinds of "designer builders".... (1)those who quietly innovate with very little chest pumping and ego gratification... and (2) those who spend a great deal of time explaining and defending themselves from charges that they pirated from the former. I'd rather deal with #1.......but a lot of buyers don't see the distinction.
Nuff said.
T2x
Last edited by T2x; 06-29-2009 at 02:34 PM.