audacity

Everyone always says they would come back if they would use a less expensive engine package...it's there.... HAS BEEN!...your 500 efi can be upgraded and sealed to a 525 by innovation for damn near the same as a rebuild, aprox 7K i think! and w/ a lot less issues in a factory boat.

"Would you add a little weight to level the playing field so more boats can come out and race"....A BIG NO! the snap on boat is VERY fast with 500's in it...in fact 2 other 525 have not been able to beat it this year. we are the heiviest boat as it is!!!8900#!!! we spend 80 hours week(most weeks)...it really doesn't matter what rules or what class, we're going to put in the effort! as is snap on....donzi seems to have good teams in a good boats...donzi is making better products....maybe the other companies should look at making a better product to compete, rather than changing the rules so they do not have to.

audacity

John Kostelac...your right on!

p4-33

Ever been on the beach watching other classes race while you're waiting your turn on the race course, and a fan see's your jersey and asks "who's winning?" Then watch the excited look on their face turn to confusion as you explain who's actually doing what in which class out there.

This is our sport's biggest dilemma: we have relatively small numbers of boats, so we try to create and maintain classes that accomodate EVERYONE that has a boat and wants to race it. Now, in general, that's not a bad position to take, but when you're trying to gain fan confidence, who in turn buys the products that are emblazoned in fancy graphics on the side of our boats, which in turn makes our sponsors happeir, so next near's team budget grows, massive numbers of classes are not helping.

F1 guys are still figuring out what's the best 1-1-1 combo to run. There's still disagreement on the engine manufacturer, much less cubic inches, HP, and stuff. A-Boats (and F1, for that matter) are fighting for survival. Some F1 and A-Boats have thrown in the "spec" towel and stuck a P4 number on their hull, fragmenting the classes further.

I say "screw the spec motors" and give these groups just some loose rules to remain competitive, (like X-compression ratio, Y carb venturi sizes, Z-cubic inches) and let them go with any engine builder they choose. Or, they can keep their current engine package, because it's fits the wider spec. Let them run any hull they think they can be competitive in. Let them choose their own drive supplier. Who cares what X-dimension they want. OK, maybe limit prop sizes for some parity and safety factor. Who cares if they drill a couple of extra holes in the oil galleys because it may make their engine last longer, or run faster. As long as "no dry sump" is in the rules, who cares what happens inside. Bet you'll bring a bunch of retired F1 and A-boats back together, and when there's 20 boats all racing against each other, our fans and sponsors will be able to say "Hey!, Joey's winning!"

Call it Open Vee racing (for a moment)

Multiply this concept times two. Take the same looser rules, and apply them to twin-engine boats. B-Boats are completely gone. F2 boats are getting there. There are still a number of P4 and P3 vee bottoms that could easily comply with some light rule changes, and I'll bet you'll see some old retired teams taking another look.

OK, so this is Open Vee, and the single-engine class is Open Vee Light. With some real consolidation, you could use the OSS model (chit, did I just say that?) and have six classes that cover EVERYTHING. SC, SCL, SV, SVL, OV, OVL. Not 21, six. Six with large numbers per class.

Something needs to be done. I've been trying to grow my program, and after only two years in racing P4 class, I'm finally gathering some interest from sponsors. But unless some changes happen to grow/unify/consolidate this sport, I'll NEVER be able to quit my day job.

And that's what sucks the worst.

Cheers,
Brian

BenPerfected

This thread asked " what can be done to bring APBA back". Most talk about the goal but what is the road map to reach the goal? Who will relinquish power so all of OS can benefit?
It seems to me that money could fix many of the issues. As it appears the OSS teams have more than most, maybe it is time to invest more $ to move forward.

n2boatn2

Benperfected,,,, I'm in lets put our money were our mouths are. It is time to shine,,,you have an willing partner here.Let this be the first of many steps forward.

vinny kostelac

Benfercted, everyone is avoiding directly answering the question to keep it from getting personal, we all have our politically correct opinions of which organization should be the party of choice. However until any organization is strong enough and has enough to offer to attract racers that have to fit there classes, racers will continue to run where ever they feel the best chance of them winning is with the boat they already own, ie A- class was revived for a couple of boats, why weren't they just added to the p classes already in place?( no offense to anyone just an observation ) P4-33/brian good ideas but a tech nightmare, without seals or certs on HP, nobody would be happy with that, we as racers cannot even agree on GPS racing. I think some f class racers dropped off due to safety concerns, thus SV and SVL was developed, and as stated by an organization offical once "that alot of f class boats were financed as pleasure boats and they termed them as credit card racers", the economy was much better then. Not my opinion just info I digested through the years.....maybe some truth some where in the middle.
How can we bring it back? Build and organization that listens to the racers, but does not cater to their every whim! I Think progression is the answer as N2 stated. The local, regional and national levels. Keeps all boats that are racing some where to race and the incentive to move up the ladder. I see it at the local track the sportsman driver wants to go to sprints, sprints to busch, busch to nascar. Not let me modify my sportman and run at Daytona.
John Kostelac

TYPHOON

I like the idea of local racers racing in one of 5 P classes like OPA and great Lakes have done. I also agree there needs to be less classes on a national circuit as well. 3-4 classes max so each class would run by themselves. Keep everyone in a Merc 525 for all classes. If F classes would all run the 525 they could always use there equipment if they stepped up and just buy a hull like we did. Keep it simple 525 for everyone! Even if I had a P boat I would by a 525.

Next question. How many classes do you all think there should be on a national level and a local level.
MD

TYPHOON

The only way more classes will work is if there are more heats with less miles per heat and thats fine with me as well. I don't need to race for 45-60 miles to see who is the best on that day. Make it more exciting with 25-30 miles where everyone is close and the race is interesting to watch.

Next question. Do you ever leave a race to get food,drink or just get out of the sun because its to long and after the first two laps you knew who was going to win anyway. I have more than once.
MD

Flashwave

Randy,

Did you just say get rid of anything that doesn't run a 525? That leaves

Factory
SVL
SCL
SV

Interesting concept, unless you own a SuperCat. Then again, SV stepped down to a 525. Imagine all classes running a 525? Very interesting. I think you just made some SC guys cringe.

J

TalkOffshore

Ok you guys can hash it out in 30 min on www.talkoffshore.com. Call in @ 800-582-2150

AC