Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

My husband and I were boating last year.
Well, first let me say that I just found this site today, and think it is a great resource for power boating and for owners.
That being said. I want to share with each of you that reads this, that I truly hope you will always exercise good judgement when you are out in your boats. Please wear a "kill switch" , and keep it on until you dock the boat. He had taken his off too soon that day.
My husband is gone now, and I think he would like this site too, if he were still here.
We were in our boat last September, less than a 1/4 mile from the Kemah Boardwalk/ Chanel,when he swerved to miss a crab trap, that was barely noticeable because of the poorly discolored float, and also it was in a navigable chanel, and was not supposed to be. We immediately hit another boat's wake that was off to our port side about a 100 feet, and he was ejected from the boat, where it ran over him & he went into the prop and died.
I sustained broken ribs, and an arm, and was knocked out.
I stayed inside the confines of our boat.
I would like to know if any of you has ever heard of such an incident,etc?
I had always felt like our boat was too fast & too light for the type of chop we have in Trinity/Galveston Bay, and that the accident was avoidable, if only some slight changes to the boat were made during manufacturing. and lastly that there were stricter laws for crab trapping in the Gulf waters.
I have been writing to our representatives and trying to get some new laws passed regulating the placement of crab traps.
Our speed at the time of the accident was not very fast, maybe 45-5- mph, again the chop keeps the speed down somewhat.
Not sure why I wrote this today, but I have been planning his one year memorial this past week, and so it is so fresh on my mind, I guess.
Clark was 45, and died one day shy of his 46th birthday.
We had just gotten married a few months before in May in Grand Cayman.
He loved all kinds of boating, especially being in our Baja, as well as sailing, and he was formerly in the Navy when he was younger.
He died September 4th, 2004. His Memorial is going to be held on September 3rd, 2005, at Outrigger's in Kemah, TX, at 2pm. If you think about it that day, maybe you can say a prayer for him. I know he would appreciate it.
Sincerely,
Jacque West
Seabrook, TX

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

That is extremely tragic and I am very sorry for your loss. This story is a good reminder to wear kill switches, even though it may have not helped since it sounds like the boats momentum would have passed over him regardless.

I think this thread needs to be on the main forum. :(

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

That's simply very tragic, I'm very sorry for your loss. :( :(
Please accept my condolences.

To answer your question though, yes there have been other incidences where someone was ejected from a boat and it kept running and came back to harm the occupants, it's not common though. There was a guy who got thrown our of a boat about a month ago and ut continued along the shoreline smashing some boats and docks. Lanyards are a must.

In all fairness though, I too owned a 25 Outlaw for almost 4 years and it is one of most stable, forgiving boats on the performance market.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Jacque, it was your husband's death that changed my boating forever.

We were rafted in Nassau Bay after the Poker Run when we heard the news. Another boater, who had been on the scene, told us of the accident. It was sobering news, since we boat the same waters on a boat the same size as yours.

Since that time, my wife and I will not even start our boat without attaching kill switches (we have two). Our "gang" has adopted the practice, also, because of your husband's accident. We police each other diligently, and won't let them forget.

We're so sorry for your loss, and can only imagine your pain.

Jim & Janet Guidry
Dickinson, Texas

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Very sorry for your loss.

God Bless

I found this link which shows your husband must have been a hell of a guy!

http://www.bakerdrywall.com/news.htm

________________________________________
As for the 25 Outlaw like mentioned above I have found them to be a very capable boat. But we all must take every safety measure available to us and never forget that we and our boats have limitations. I do not know what Baja could have done differently, a 25 foot boat is a 25 foot boat, and the Baja is much heavier and rough water ready than many other brands.

Look at it like this, if it had been a lighter boat, or a stepped hull boat you both may have been ejected and we would not be talking with you today.
God Bless

P.S. Welcome to the site.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

To everyone who replied back, Thanks for your kind words.

I can try to explain for you, my quandry about our boat's performance that day and other days as well, but perhaps it is more speculation than anything else factual.
As I said earlier, I felt like there was never enough "true weight" to our boat to keep us as stable as I would have preferred. Meaning that on numerous occassions I noted that we seem to wobble somewhat in choppy waters at speeds of not really more than 30-35 ish or so. When we decided to purchase a power boat it was the hull design that attracted us to the Baja, the deep "V" hull design so to speak.
I can't help but wonder back to that awful afternoon when we made that abrupt left turn, and how the boat seem to take on a life of it's own. After that I don't remember much, it's pretty hazy, but the witnesses that saw us said that our boat did some crazy moves even seem to stop and resurge again in the seconds before we hit the wake that sent us vertical, and ejected Clark. My thoughts are this: Is the boat too light with only 2 people in it, and no real interior weight, except for our personal items? Should we have had added some additional weight for balance? These are the questions that plague my mind, my heart, and lastly because I'd like to prevent anyone from going through what I did. Not being an engineer, I am not educated in this area enough to be sure of any of this. So, perhaps some of you are, and can help to ease my mind about our boat, which I still own, but am selling. I do want to someday return to boating, as I grew up around boating, and love it so much, but part of me is unsure if I will ever be able to go out in a similar type boat ever again. Thanks for listening.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

I am no engineer however these are my thoughts on the questions you ask.

(Is the boat too light with only 2 people in it, and no real interior weight, except for our personal items?)

All performance boat companies strive to reduce the weight of their performance boats to gain faster top end speeds. The 25' Outlaw is actually heavier than some other brands of similar size. Smaller boats do tend to "chine walk" (what you are talking about when you say it rocks back and forth). It can be hightened when you have a 24% hull. However the 24% hull cuts through chop and swells better. It's a give/take situation.

(Should we have had added some additional weight for balance?)

No. And I assure you if you did this accident would have still occured unless you doubled the weight of the boat and slowed the speed down. But no one can see the future and adding weight to a boat would bring into play a whole new set of dangerous circumstances. That's why there are load restrictions on the hulls.

Alot of the time when tragedy strikes people look for blame. I can assure you that this was an accident that would've happend to any boat of a similar size and unfortunately has and will continue to happen. It sounds as if you hooked the boat when you came down from the wake. I've done it in my 24 Outlaw I used to own and was nearly tossed out the boat too.

Hooking, stuffing, loosing control, or any other bad event can happen in ANY size performance boat and does happen. It's not your husbands fault and it's not the boats fault. With any extreme sport (I would consider "speed boats" an extreme sport) there is an amount of risk that occurrs. It's simply fate, if you believe in that. I'm sure your husband would not want you to stop boating and I hope if you can bring yourself to continue that you do indeed keep boating.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

So sorry for your loss. Welcome to the site and I hope you find some comfort here among us all.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

I don't know....You can't blame someone for swerving to miss something that pops out in front of you. I've had it happen to me. The fact is it happens. I guess the plane fact is that he was in control of the boat and the reaction caused the swerve that hit the wave and caused the boat to hook or hit violantly. I wouldn't neccessarily say that's driver error. But I def. wouldn't say it's boat malfunction. It's an accident. One of many situations one can find themselves in while running their boat.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Kemah IS notorious for having those damn crab traps right at the mouth of the board walk. You can't even see them with the little white buoys they mark them with. I'll see if I can't take some pictures this weekend that way everyone will understand better. I'm very sorry to hear about your lose....

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

westwelljs, again we are very sorry for your loss, and we all share your pain. It is always regrettable when someone ends up hurt, or worse, killed when partaking in something that we all get great enjoyment from in boating. My sympathies are with you.

The 25 Outlaw, like I said before, is perhaps one of the most stable, if not THE most stable boat in its size as far as performance boats go; It's a simple straight vee, 24deg, deep freeboard boat. At 4750 pounds dry, it is by no means a light boat for its size, either.

As far as crab traps go, I hate them too, as well as the ignorant people who choose to place them in the middle of navigable waterways, often times with a marker far too small or not visible enough.

I must agree with high-tide in respect, agressively turning any boat at any appreciable speed is approaching the limits of the safety envelope.

May I ask what size wake you hit, what kind of boat generated it?

Kind regards,
Nick

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Well said Tank.

High-Tide is right on. Driver error. It is up to each operator to know his own limitations and those of his boat, and to be familiar with the water way he is navigating and use extreme caution when boating in new areas.

Nick, I was thinking the same thing. Having run the 272 for a good while and having riden in many 25's it had to be a BIG wake and there had to be another boat very close by. You must know what is ahead of you, on both sides and coming up from behind at all times.

This can be a good lesson for us all. Sometimes it is better to hit something in the water than try an avoid it. If you remember there was a guy killed here in North Carolina early this year in a Cig Top Gun on the ICW that was running pretty fast and tried to miss a log in the water and he hooked was ejected and killed. I'm sure if he hit the log he would have done some major damage to the boat, but he may have survived. As it was he damaged the boat and lost his life.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

While I can appreciate and respect everyone of your comments, I must remind you that I was coherent before the the accident until I fell and hit my head. Our closest boater was at least 90-100 feet off our port side. I was waving to them, and we were approaching at somewhat of an angle to join up with them. Clark & I are both certified boaters, and sailors. Clark was unable to see the crab trap he was dodging, because it had such a filthy float, it was the same color as the bay water it was floating in, and if you know our waters, then you will understand how discolored it was. It really just happened on him too quick, therefore I truly belive that he reacted with what I, myself probably would have done, which was turn away from the object. Regarding the size of the other boat's wake. According to the witnesses that saw our accident, the other boat's wake was barely noticeable,meaning that the boat was likely already way ahead of it's wake when we hit it. The whole mystery for me is why did hitting wake that is barely noticeable cause our go completely vertical, and tilting so extreme to the starboard side, thereby ejecting Clark. We had had some repairs done on the trim tabs before we took it that weekend, and so I would like to know if that might have caused the boat to mishandle?
I weigh about 117 pounds to his 230 pounds, and while I was thrown out of my bolster seat, and backwards against his, breaking 2 right side ribs. Then, I was lifted completely off my feet , and thrown towards the back of the boat where I was hanging on to the back seat. I also can remember a very sudden jerk, and that is when I lost hold of the back seat & hit the floor and my head as well.

While according to witnesses, the boat was making unusual surging motions, while continuing in a circular motion, and eventually hitting the same crab trap that Clark was trying to obviously dodge. We made as many as 4 circles until the boat finally slowed to a complete stop.
It took 2 days to find Clark's body, and that was one of the worst things about our accident, was that he was lost at sea for those 2 days.
I still have bad dreams about that day, but with each new day there is new hope and peace.
Still, it is a mystery for me, and always will be.
I appreciate your opinions and comments, but until you actually experience something like this, you really can't know what to think. I do hope that everyone's boating is safe each and every sinlge time you go out.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

You are so correct in that statement.

I feel you pain and wish we had the answers for you, but it is impossible to know for sure. Please take peace in knowing that God is in control and has a plan for all of us.

I can tell you from experience that it is really hard to get a 25 Outlaw out of the water. I have done it many times and you really have to plan your speed and approach to a big wave or wake. To get the bow up you have to hit pretty much straight on, have the trim up and probably even throttle up to really get the bow high. I have launched a lot of boats over wakes and have found that they usually fly pretty straight and level with just a little bow up.

Just guessing, but I would say he probably without even thinking about it throttled up as you rode the wake up and were at a slight angle to the wake also.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

i am truely sorry to hear about your loss, i for one am heading to the store to get a different kill switch, the one i have now is a pain to keep attached and as a result i dont wear it like i should.
thank you for sharing your story and opening at least one set of eyes.
god bless and dont give up boating.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Hey zybert,

Hope all is well with you. I recently saw a guy that had a kill switch lanyard that velcroed around his wrist on the left hand and had about three feet of cord which allowed him to move around and steer without any problems.

I thought it was a great idea.

If anyone knows where you can get these I would appreciate it.

Think of it like putting your seat belt on in the car and make it an automatic practice.

If you are riding with someone in their boat, don't be afraid or feel that you are out of line to ask them to hook up. It could be you that goes in and could be saved because of it.

Hopefully we are all getting to be much safer boaters from learning about these accidents.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

very sorry for your loss and your story has too changed the kill switch issue for me.....i will say that the 25 baja is one of the best handling rough water boats i have been in for a 25 footer very forgiving...{4-6' seas} i have another boats that is {42') built for rough water so when i bought a smaller second boat i chose baja because it was heavier and had no steps....i lost three of my close friends in a boating accident and they didnt have life jackets on......very painful when they could be here today if they had them on again sorry for your loss

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

In the latest copy of PB mag, there's a company offering a wireless kill switch. Get too far away from the helm, and it kills the ignition...

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

My sincere condolences on your loss. I lost my father in an ultralight accident that should have never happened if it wasn't due to poor judgment on his part. Boats are no different than any vehicle and cannot possibly be designed to handle every and all situations we put them into. There are few cars or boats that can handle hard reactionary turns that put the vehicle into a situation it was not designed for at that speed. Someone turing very hard off a highway to avoid a deer may face more dangerous terrain that the vehicle could not be designed to handle. Thank you for coming on here and sharing your experience with us so we all can learn from it. Beyone the need for tethers (I will not start my motors without it attached) it should be realized that sometimes its better to continue your course even when damage could occur. After all boats are repairable.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Thanks for your input, Highmark. Great post, excellent analogy.
My condolences for your father's loss as well.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Westwelljs, boating safety. A reminder to all of us. I never wear my switch line. Will now.

God bless you and I truly am sorry for your loss.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

To every boater/passenger who is listening, and especially to those of you who are making choices to use start using , or keep your kill switches at "all" times.
Words can't truly describe how deeply moved I am to read that some of you are going to be using your own kill switches.
If the outcome of his death saves even one life, then he didn't die in vain. If he were you, reading this, he'd make the same changes too.
Sometimes it takes a tragedy to bring about change.
Believe me, when I tell you that you, and your loved ones will all be the benefactors of your wise decision. However, sadly, if you happen to find yourself in similar circumstances, and you are not wearing one, then you, and your loved ones will, also be the benefactors of your decision.
Clark disliked the kill switch, and so did his most all of his boating buddies, who are wearing them now, though.
I'd see him wear it , then gripe and take it off.
He was surely feeling his proverbial oats on that September 4th, one day before his 46th birthday. He took it off less than 5 minutes before the accident..He stopped the boat to use the bathroom, removed his switch (BTW he preferred the outdoors/back of the boat)...I was goosing the engine while he was going off the back, and he was laughing at me, and finished, came & gave me a little kiss,(ourlast kiss) got back in his bolster, and took off towards Kemah/home. He did not put it back on, and I can still hear remember the sound of that loose kill switch flopping against the boat.
Please wear them, there's not much chance of staying alive if you get thrown out.
I am grateful to this site in so many ways.
It has been tough to write this, but it was theraputic in many other ways, and so I thank each of you for all the time and thought you so graciously extended me.
I will visit the site from time to time, as I get more at ease about boating again, and I will say hi to you all again.
Please, if you like, feel free to drop in to Clark's memorial, to say hi and introduce yourself.
There is an open invitation for boats to go out into the bay also, where I took his ashes last year.
Location: Kemah TX- Outrigger's Seafood
Date: September 3rd : 2pm-6pm
God Bless & Fair Winds
Jacque
Jacqueline Stilwell-West
Seabrook, TX

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Jacque,
I've been following this thread since you first started it but didn't know what to say. First of all, I'm very sorry for your loss. I can't begin to know the trauma you've gone through. Secondly, I would like to thank you for reminding everyone of the importance of always wearing the tether. Unfortunately, it seems that the only way for us to learn a lesson, is to be slapped in the face by reality. I think it was stated before, but I'll say it again : everyone has driven their boat without it on. Whether it is a conscious decision or not. I have been reminded many times by my teenage son to put it on. Now, I make it part of my routine. Sadly enough, I think there is a large % of drivers out there that do not wear one, at least where I boat. I've seen dozens of poker run photos where the tether is not being worn. My prayers go out to you and I will keep the Sept. date in mind for a little extra prayer for you husband. God bless you.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Thanks so much for bringing me closer to acceptance and peace, this week. It's been my best week since the accident.Sometimes it's nice to put faces to words, so I am attaching a picture of Clark & I in Grand Cayman last May at our wedding. It was on the water in our boats that we spent our "best" times, and it was on the water, and on our best friends yacht that we were married, and lastly, it was on the water where we departed lives. My goal is to be comfortable with boating again, and to look at the water the way I used to as my favorite place. In time, and with my friends and family's support, I think I will.
Jacque West

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

I sure hope that you do get on with your life and and enjoy it to the fullest.

We have a very short time on this earth and we must all from time to time regroup, take what life has thrown our way and move on.

Best of wishes

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

Doc,

If you are looking for a teather with velcro, try any shop that sells jetskis, they should have them.

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

My condolences Jacque.

Thank you for bringing this very necessary aspect of boating to light. It is so important that it be fresh in all of our minds, and should be taken as serious as venting the engine fumes, checking fluids, etc.

I hope you can step away from this tragedy and have a life full of family, friends, love, and laughter.

Neil

Re: Lost at Sea : All Baja 25 Owners Please Read
 

TRhat is one of the sadest things Iv ever heard, thanks for sharing , because I will wear my lanyard from now on. Im sorry to hear this tragedy