Illusive water leak
 

I got rid of the Donzi and bought a 2004 Chaparral Sunesta with a 5.0MPI Alpha ll. !00 hours stored dry. BUT it leaks water ! I have been on the Chaparral forum and find that this is a common problem. The answers have been questionable workmanship with hose clamps missing, hoses near the water line left unconnected, Enlarged thru bolt holes without sealant or backup washers, unsealed/loose thruhulls, unsealed swim platform mounting hardware. I am not talking about rainwater. I am talking about just sitting in the water with the engine off. It takes on 6 gallons in a little over an hour.
Now I have checked all the above and they are OK. I have checked the drive bellows and shift bellows. I have checked the water inlet tube and hose and all clamps up to the W.Pump. The hull drain is sealed. I inspected the Hull on a lift and nothing that I could detect.That brings me to the Drive mounting parts, inner and outer. I have laid next to the motor and watched but cannot detect a slow leak. I have used a inspection camera for the places I couldn't see and The engine is not leaking. The remaining spots are the exhaust "Y" and the trim lines connector plate seal. How about out of specs transom flatness ?
Has anyone had a mystery leak on a A ll drive ?

I had a mystery leak meself. It took some poking around but I finally determined that the upper hinge pin or swivel pin whatever you want ta call it was a little worn and that caused the seal around it to leak. With your boat on the trailer,lower the drive then physically try to lift it up and down to check for play in your hinge pins. Good luck. Hopefully they are not worn or you have to pull the engine to fix. Mercury makes a repair kit that you can use without pulling the motor but requires drilling fairly large holes in the side of your gimbal housing. I choose to pull the engine.:party-smiley-004:

That much water shouldn't be too hard to determine if it's leaking high or low. Also check the manifold seal bolted to bottom side of transom assembly where the trim hose connect.

Thanks guys
Yes, I have three "hot" spots to check. The Trim hose connector plate seal under the Gimbal housing can be replaced relatively easy The other two are Exhaust "y" seal and the two lower transom plate bolts but they require removing the motor.
Other Chap owners have found that the thru bolt holes were drilled oversize during installation and then improperly sealed. Seems like someone at the Factory didn't like to get their hands dirty because most of the items installed on the outside of the boat were not sealed !
Anyone else have a hard to find leak ? I laid along side the motor feeling for a weep under the inner transom plate and could not detect any leak but still the water came up ?? You are right. I should be able to see it !

The Gen II's transom assembly's bolts are all within the sealing gasket area. Even if the lower holes were drilled oversize, (unless they used a holesaw :) )they are still inside that sealing are and shouldn't leak. Beside, why/how would they have beeen drilled oversize? The drill jig has drill bushings for the drill bits. A larger bit won't go in, and I'd be hard pressed to think Chap drilled these free handed. Have seen the exhaust y-pipe o-ring be a leaker before because the mounting bolts were loose.

I had to pull my engine on two different boats and put the boat in the water with no motor and a few guys on the swim platform to find leaks. Also look at anything bolted on the transom like trim tabs, brackets for swim platforms. If they are not sealed good, they will leak into the transom and then show up in the bottom of the bilge.

find a boat ramp with running water. back boat partway down ramp. NOT in the water. turn on hose. fill bilge. you will see the water come OUT where it goes IN...

I've got a 2004 Chaparral 260 SSi. I've never had water in the bilge unless I get caught out in the rain. It is always bone dry. Chaps of this era, though fundamentally solid boats, had a bunch of drunk/hungover Georgians building them for sure. Are you sure all the thru hull fittings and hoses at the waterline for the self-bailing cockpit are all dry? If your boat is like mine, the two main cockpit drains are right at the water line. Are the rubber flappers in place on these thru-hull fittings?

That much water has to be a good sized leak,shouldn't be too hard to find .

Again my thanks for getting in the "Ring" with me. I have installed over 250-300 drive units in my time, both with and without the jig. Every thing from Alpha One to #5's along with Kama and Arnesons, so that's what bites me. Yes the bolts are inside the seal area and that's why they can leak. Ever notice the little rubber seal on the lower two bolts ? "Oversize " drilled hole was a quote from a chaparral forum member and what he found. yes the rubber seal should have sealed regardless of hole size.
Filling the boat with enough water to look on the outside is not a good idea unless it's an outboard and your trailer is strong enough.

6-8 Oz. per minute isn't much to perceive in a bilge. I lloked up the history of Chaparral and they did move from a boat building start in Florida to Georgia. Loved the comment on their workers. Chaps are a good looking, fast boat but only skin deep. If you have been on their forum it's a nightmare with what's been found and it's censored so only some of it gets through.

Nothing on my boat is installed straight. The latches for the head door and wind block are off, the anchor locker is installed crooked (high on port side), the padding on the outside of the head door runs downhill, 2 of the 4 speakers are crooked, motor mounts lagged into stringer blocks crooked, adhesive spilled all over the diamond non-skid on cockpit floor, etc. No attention to detail payed when assembling the boat. But nothing has fallen apart and I have 400 hours on the boat, many of those hours on LOTO.

I had a small leak i could not find too. afer amny many times looking, finally found it.

The cable that goes through the hull, to the trim tab/Kplane. if goes through the mounted bracket on the transom. it comes out int he middle of a nut kinda thing that has a rubber grommet inside it. this was letting a little water trickel in, and run down the back side of the transom, ever so slightly.

I Googled a picture of the tabs I have, and you can see the cable for the indicator in it (there is 2 hose fittings, one on top and one on bottom, and the cable i am talking about is in the middle.). I back out the nut thing, and moved the rubber grommet around some, re seating it, and now no more leaks.


anyway worth a shot looking there

http://newimages.yachtworld.com/1/7/...1770885_28.jpg

Forgot that this was a Gen two....the two lower bolts are within the big seal. I guess too much time standing on my head for this one !
The Oversized hole was for the bonding bolt on the hull drain flange. That is my next step since it is hard to see and would be below the water in the bilge.Also setting up a test for the "Y"

Apoligize, i got so mucked up with others comments that i forgot that mine was a Gen ll. Yes the lower two bolts on the Gimbal no longer are the anode cap bolt with a seal. Mark it off !
Snuggled up next to the motor (no small trick) and dryed the bilge, hand dry.Blocked off the forward limber channel and lowered the boat into the water. I watched with a flashlight to see any reflection from water. None ! I then felt the hull drain plug opening and it remained dry. I could also feel the bonding thru bolt and it waas dry. That's after an hour and a half. I could feel under the inner transom plate and it was dry. Swim platform lower support bolts...dry. The transom area is dry. so I am changing my direction of thought. Originally I inspected the outside of the hull looking for anything obvious and noted all thru hulls. They were then checked on the inside. I will now goback to the inspecting the hull closer for a crack.
Please don't tell me that your boat doesn't leak, that doesn't help. I have had 6 boats and none of them leaked either but Go on the Chaparral forum and read about boats built on Mondays and Fridays. Doesn't seem to be an exception.

Tilt drive up/down, left/ right to check bellows

Do you have any waters streaks/stains that may point you in a direction?

When you checked the thru-hulls, especially the cockpit scupper thru-hulls that if they are positioned as mine are sit half submerged when in the water, did you check them with the boat sitting in the water? And again, are the rubber flaps in place to keep the majority of water out of the thru-hulls when floating/sitting on anchor? If nothing appears to be leaking at the transom, that would be my next area of investigation. Here is a pic I took of my boat after having some of the emblem letters fall off. You can see the fitting I'm talking about in the pic. I wouldn't suspect the thru-hull seal itself as much as water backing up into the opening past the flapper and then leaking at the hose connection to the cockpit scupper.

Edit: New letters installed!

Second inspection of the hull revealed a suspicious spot right on a forward lift bunk. Reposioned the bunks in front to get a better view and found a 6" damaged corner of the front strake. The gel coat was chipped and inspection of the area shows raw glass and no impregnation of resin. This area is a 90 and needs special attention when being laid up. I have seen the same problem on my "Extended swim Platform". It has a hollow area where it Popped !
I cleaned and sealed the area with two layers, progressively larger plastic and duct tape for a test. Three hours later and no water ! Bad news is that it is under the liner for the Head !

Good news is it may be an easy way to drain the head!

Even though it would obviously be better to have access to backside of bad spot. I would think a good glass guy could do repair from outside if necessary. At least you found the leak

did this get hurt by the bunks? running aground? or do you think it is orig equipment f/up? if bunks did it, you need to repos them so they are on a stronger section of the hull. if done by using hull as a depthfinder, hey, it is what it is. if chap built it that way, i would scream bloody murder even though it is only gonna get you a sore throat...

The failure was caused by normal use. No grounding or banging into something. The manufacturer will not get involved. So I am just looking for some ideas on repairing a spot that is backed by to the stringer on the inside and is not accessable. Interesting problem. Everything written about repairs are inside/outside repairs or using wire or string to hold a "backing plate" in place. But what do you do when there is a stringer on top of that area ?

I found the answer that satisfies the condition. Boston Whaler gave a step by step procedure for repairing their boats. Since their boats are filled with foam, access to repair them from the inside is difficult. They basically said to clear out material behind the hole, and all around it from the outside, working thru the hole. Then mix glass and thickener to fill the cavity. This provides a "Back up" for the outside repair. It simulates the "Inside/outside" method commonly used. The strake was filled with wood behind the bad glass work and also gave a base to put the glass against.

Update to the repairs.
I made several tools to clear away the material on the inside of the strake. I left the wood filler (not the stringer) in and used it as backing for the glass that I would stuff in. I cut all the way around behind the damage and then filled the hole. This week I started the external repairs and got those lams on. Next finishing it.
Answer question on why damaged? The strake layup had dry glass and voids. Only had Gelcoat and some glass in spots. Something like an eggshell. Doesn't take much to crack it.

I've knocked big chunks of gel coat off both my port and starboard inner strakes that end midship on my 260 SSi. My lift bunks set just inside these strakes and if the boat is not perfectly centered in the slip the bunks will contact the edge of the strakes when the lift comes up. After repeated strikes, eventually a big chunk of original pops off. My repairs hold firm. On my strakes, it exposes glass, not a filler material. The gel is too thick in these areas. It must pool some when they shoot the hull mold. Then I assume they get some air voids in this somewhat tight area when they lay the glass in.

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close up after getting rid of bad glass. This allowed water to migrate into bilge.

Well guys it's been a long trip from finding the leak to coming up with a method to repair, it but it has been done now for a while. Thanks to West Systems Technical help and Boston Whaler for their step by step repair method from the outside. No thanks to the manufaturer for any help.
if you check the Manufacturers forum you will find a delaminated hull in the forward area.

is it really delaminated if it was never laminated in the first place?

Gee....another chapperal with a water leak......got any advise?

I'm a regular on the Chap forum. So much to learn from the guys that own them. Seems as though water leaks are a common thing. See them posted all the time. Strake repair finished