153 tooth BBC flywheel help
 

Need a flywheel for a big block Chevy, 153 tooth, (and here is the kicker) needs to be for a single piece seal crank. It's for a 454 but at this point I'll take a neutral balance flywheel and have it rebalanced if needed.

Do you need a flywheel or a flex plate?

http://www.summitracing.com/search/p...9%2B4294924890

http://www.summitracing.com/search/p...6%2B4294924890

Looking for a flywheel. The flywheels in your Summit link are for small blocks. I even ordered the 1st one on the list (for a small block) and it will not fit.

They were all 153 tooth, there should've been BB ones in there.

What's the application?

put this in the wanted section also, Im sure you will get a bunch of answers, I got some stuff from Ron Im sure he has one


Ron 504-616-6005
Sporl Performance

Why a 153 tooth for a Big Block

Alright here’s the deal. This is a Gen V, 454 that is attaching to a Volvo Penta bellhousing. Sadly the bellhousing I have in stock is for the smaller flywheel (most likely for a small block). I know that a larger flywheel is used in most boats to keep the motor spinning under load but this motor is going in an 18’ Donzi and not a heavy boat so having a bigger flywheel is not necessary and will even help the motor rev faster giving the boat a better take off. I’ve done this before in an 18’ Monza (bigger boat) that worked out well but it was with a Mark IV 454 with a 2pc seal.
This is where everything gets screwed up. It’s been 4 or 5 years since I’ve done this so just to be on the safe side I did a little internet searching and started finding flywheels listed for 1pc and 2pc seals. Now I remembered having (what I thought were) Mark IV flywheels rebalanced for Gen V’s for the 2 motors in the race boat but now I was second guessing it. Maybe they were Gen V flywheels after all. Then on the net post after post on site after site said that there was a difference in the bolt pattern, center hole and balance of a single piece seal flywheel compared to a 2pc. Not finding a 153 tooth, single pc seal, flywheel anywhere I came here thinking someone would come on and say the definitive answer on what the deal was but I guess most are like me and if it came with the motor it stays (after it’s re-balanced of course).
So today after moving a bunch of stuff around I got out all my flywheels. I keep them all because you never know.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...enname/8-5.jpg

Top of picture - motor is Gen V 454.
Right side of picture – Volvo Penta Bellhousing
B – Original to motor flywheel, #10101171, externally balanced 14" diameter with 168 teeth on the starter ring gear
A – Is off a 1969 Kiekhaefer 482ci (stroked 427ci tall deck), 2pc seal
C – Is a new 427, internal balanced, 168 tooth, 2pc seal http://www.summitracing.com/parts/atp-z296
D – Is a Flexplate I took off of a Gen V 454 a few years back (a good balancer can match a manual flywheel to it if they know what they are doing)
E – One of the first ones on the Summit list, 153 tooth, external balance http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ZZZ-50-6503

All but “E” (small block) fit the crank, all the bolts lined up, wasn’t going to hit anything when spun and the ring gear is in the exact same place as the original flywheel. Besides the weight being off between the 1969, 427’s flywheel and the Gen V there was no difference between the two. So I guess I’m going to try my luck with a 2pc seal flywheel and keep my fingers crossed. As long as it lets the bellhousing go on and the ring line up I can work with it at this point.

so the one-piece and two piece 454 flywheels are same bolt pattern? i assumed they were diff cuz small blocks are. another possibility. it is a 19 foot boat. put a 427 in it.

Need to search and see if there were any applications that used such a odd ball deal...the kicker is the one piece seal as the cranks are different in balance...

Use a mercury bellhousing and fabricate a mounting system to the inner transom plate

I have a nasty 512 BBC for my Camaro. It is neutral balanced and has a 427 flex plate on it. That's where you should look for the flywheel.

Maybe call a company like Hayes??

but is it a 1 piece rear main seal ?? they are different

Small block, big block...........doesn't matter. GM is either 153 or 168.

Can't..its a volvo aq style..

It's a two piece, but im sure any reputable company can help the OP out.

Oh c'mon fixx since when do you say "can't"???

This could work for you. Give'm a call.
http://www.prwonlinestore.com/sfi11b...70-90-2-1.aspx

All there other sbc / bbc steel flywheels:
http://www.prwonlinestore.com/chevy_10.aspx

I ordered a 168 tooth neutral balance flywheel for my 496 stroker build (summit billet) and it fits my callies BBC crank perfectly. The 2pc and 1 piece deal is a difference in balance. What the op is looking for can be had in either neutral or external balance.

I was also going to mention PRW. They are sold on eBay, and I recall seeing a 153 version, but it was kinda pricey. Good luck!

lol i wish i can give him some good advise nut in this cast i wont work..bbc in adonzi classic 18..the volvo bellhousing is one piece ane the intermediate housing that holds the bearings and shaft that connects to the outdrive,,if he machines off the bellhousing the intermediate housing would just spin..the intermediate housing is sandwiched in by 2 big ass orings and a tapered plate and 4 bolts..he cant really move the engine forward that much with out moving the bulkhead..

Big Ass O-ring and 6 bolts ......

Gotcha, I was thinking newer omc/volvo style drive.

Alright, alright, alright ….
I was totally brain farting on this until I sat down with what I had and the paperwork on each boat I’ve done (keep all records of what was bought for on each boat I rebuild for future reference).
Like Fixx said, this is for a Volvo Penta. Before I would go crazy like switching to a different motor then the one that’s completely built for the boat I would have had to replace the bellhousing. They do make them for 14” flywheels but the cost is insane and something I’m trying to avoid after this long and expensive Donzi rebuild.
As for modifications, there is no way to build a bellhousing to block spacer big enough or anything else to get around the flywheel issue without pushing the motor to far forward or changing to many thing so it would not be cost effective (unless I owned a machine shop) then just replacing the expensive bellhousing. So yes I could have gotten a hold of a shop that would cut a custom wheel starting in the 5 or 6 hundred dollar range for a “single pc seal” or for 7 to 8 hundred I could buy a bellhousing for the larger flywheel or figure this ***** out because I’ve done this before. The only difference this time is it’s a Gen V motor. But I’ve used Mark IV flywheels on Gen V’s before but they were 14” flywheels. This all has to go full circle.
Ordered this one off of ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=201154312655 Not so worried about having super high dollar big name flywheel anyway. I’ve never seen one “fail” in a boat no matter how cheap it cost. Not like it has a clutch hitting it or anything and I figure once they come back from the balancer it will be as good if not better than anything I can buy. Also last time the motor was rebuilt it was all balanced so I want the new flywheel to match the old so anything off the shelf would had to be balanced no matter how much it originally cost so….
Now that I have the new flywheel, for the record on 454 and BBC flywheels in general, the bottom line is this, there is no difference between any of them besides clutch size and balance. The ring gear may stick out or in a couple mm’s from the block but that’s it. A big block Chevy neutral balance flywheel is a BBC neutral balance flywheel, same exact flywheel for one of two piece seals. Weight on the crank flange or not they are still are all the same.
454 (external balance) flywheels, there is a balance difference between the Mark IV and the Gen V, VI. You will only find 153 tooth flywheels for Mark IV in the aftermarket today so all of them will have to be rebalanced for later motors. I have done this a couple times before and all they had to do was drill the new wheel a couple spots and not add metal ($$$) being the 4, 5 and 6 are that closely balanced out of the factory. If you are building a motor you are having it balanced anyway.
Small block and big block V-8 flywheels do not interchange. I have to add the exception of an older small block flywheel which I didn’t have in stock. The later 1pc seal SB flywheels will not fit on a Big Block Chevy. The bolt pattern is different and the center hole is not big enough to fit on the BBC crank. This also leads me to believe contrary to almost everything I have read on the net the only flywheel change (besides some small balance changes for the external motors) that Chevy ever made was to the 1pc seal small block only. Nothing to do with BB at all and all the listings for BBC flywheels on summit and jegs, etc, etc should say for 1 or 2 piece seal cause there is no difference. And with the difference balance flywheels, the one I bought the weight just screwed into the backside of the flywheel. How hard would it be to offer different weights for 4, 5 or Gen 6 motors if anyone who sells flywheels is listening? Lol.
But really this easily could have been a stock Gen VI replacement of a Mark IV, Volvo Penta power plant. There should be a “off the shelf” for under a 150 bucks, 153 tooth flywheel for the Gen 5 and 6 on the market. That 50% more than the average cost for a stock replacement and there’s still nothing. Someone needs to recognize… Lol.

RAM does, "0" bal. I believe 4 or 5 from 10 lbs up to 30 lbs.

ok, if 2 piece small block flywheels fit all bbc bolt patterns, then there should be zillions of 305-307-350 clutch flywheels avail on craigs for 10 bucks that could be balanced to the motor. heck i have several in my garage here in s. jersey. i believe the reason a pre balanced small flywheel for gen 5-6 bbcs is not avail is there is virtually no market for them. the stuff that only fits small flywheels was obsoleted 30 years ago.

See that’s just it, I didn’t have a 2pc small block flywheel to check so I’m not sure if they will fit or not. After all the research I’ve done on this crap I wish someone had one (confirmed it came off a small block) and tried to put it on a BB just to wrap this thread up with the right answers because the web has it all screwed up. After reading thread after thread on the interweb you would think there was no option for a small flywheel on a gen 5 and 6 big block. That is wrong. Flywheels for BB Chevy are no different regardless if the crank is 1pc or 2pc and only matters with external bal motors because of small weight differences on the bob. For that matter if you were just doing a stock job you could use the neutral flywheel and one of those aftermarket weight plates (I forget what they are call but jeg, summit, etc carries them) that bolts on when you put the flywheel on.
The situation I was in was in basically saying that the bolt pattern from 4 and 5 and 6 were different meaning there was no flywheel that would fit, period was not true and I’m sure has screwed other people up. Rebalancing a flywheel is nothing to do compared to trying to find one that is nonexistent. Been down that road before finding one of these 153 flywheels for a Chrysler 360. Did that a few years back. Took a year locate one.
One thing about the small block flywheel though (except for the 400) and a 454, you really don’t want to start off with a neutral balance flywheel for an external balanced motor. The balancer will have to add weight and that’s when the money adds up for a balancing job. So any weight (in the right general area) is a help even if the weight is not just right. I also have to say that if you looked at the 2 flywheels (mark 4 and gen 5) it looks like the only difference is the bob is shifted about 2 degrees. When I was a kid I would have slapped that dog on there and ran it. Wish I would have to find out but not stupid enough to do it today to find out knowing up front there is a difference.
As for no market I have to disagree. There is an insane number of Volvo Penta’s out there and there has to be more than a few people that at least thought about replacing their tired small block with something newer and bigger. Just like I’m doing with this 1976 Donzi 18. VP’s are good to 500+ hp. I have this Gen V 454 that should be an honest 375hp without over building it (pretty tame really), Once you start swapping parts like the aluminum intake and aluminum exhaust there will be almost no weight difference between it and an all cast iron small black. I’ll take a same HP tame BB over a hopped up small block any day. I’m not saying they should build a foundry or anything to make these flywheels but you would think there would be more options than some guy in Maryland figuring it all out. Like I said there is absolutely no difference in the BBC neutral flywheels except for the listing on about every site that sells flywheels and even the external bal flywheel is an easy fix.
The main reason I post all this is to help someone in the future sort through this mess. I know a lot of you guys have long since moved past Volvo Pentas and have Brovo 27000000’s, Kevlar, anti-gravity, surface drives with after thrusters on the back of your boats but some of us still do it old school. I mean honestly the latest Mercruiser drive hanging off a 1976 Donzi. Something just not right about that. lol

I need a pair of the Kevlar, anti gravity, surface drives with after thrusters for my Magnum. I think if I use the right paint they will look like old volvo drives.

Ayuh,.... How ya doin' f_n,..?? Long time no see,....

Atleast ya got past the ole Dodge motor,..... ;) :D

I'm sure you have something in the back of that shop Tom that Joe is not telling you about. lol


Shhhhhhh ..... The new owner is around here some where. lol
4 or 5 years back still having it sitting in the corner of the garage I basically bought a whole 360 motor off of ebay and just used the good part from my old motor and built a pretty bad ass motor out of the two. Just not a fan anymore when you factor in the money and availability of parts compared to Chevy.
Again nice to see you outside of iboats. You don't know how many times I've wanted to go there and talk to DonS about a Volvo.
------

Ayuh,.... I'm still at iboats,.... Ya might already know, but Don past away alittle over a year ago now,....

My go to guy for Volvos is now Rick, aka; Ricardo, over at marineengines forum,...

Good Luck, 'n Good seein' ya,..... ;)

i put a 400 sbc into a 79 sundancer trying to get it over 35. bought a 400 flywheel from a core guy. boat shook like a leaf at low rpms. pulled it and checked number. it was a 454 flywheel. i still have this wheel that i then had balanced to a 400 small block for me. so they definatly interchange.

Mark,
SHHHHHH. That's the top secret squirrel stuff. I keep it hid from Joe.