glassdave

iTrader: (1)

yes and they also have a great on line tech section. They are a bit pricey on most stuff but have a good selection and some hard to find things.

I think the CF diamond plate would be to hot and kinda hard on the feet for a cockpit floor. I use it in white for all kinds of stuff i think the CF would be cool as some bling in a bilge or step plates or ??? These are bagged sheets and its what i back up with the black FG to help stabilize the color.

dammmagnum

Scippy - Dave,
Here is something interesting on CF vs black FG
was on the Fiberglast site. i tried to copy the photo of the two materials, but couldn't. if go to the web site and you can see the two side by side.
Thank you
Jim

Carbon Fiber vs. Black Fiberglass
by [email protected]



Carbon fiber compared to its inexpensive alternative.

Would you like to give your project a carbon fiber look for half the price? Black Fiberglass might be the product for you, but before you start, let’s uncover the similarities and differences between carbon fiber and Black Fiberglass.

Black Fiberglass is an E-Glass that is woven and dyed black to look like a 3K Twill Weave carbon fiber. This fabric is for cosmetic applications only and does not have the strength properties of a real carbon fiber.

Can you tell the difference?
IN THE IMAGE ON THE RIGHT: (left) #2212 Black Fiberglass, (right) #1069 3K, 2×2 Twill Weave Carbon Fiber Fabric

The Look

You can see in the image that the Black Fiberglass and the Carbon Fiber look fairly similar. They both have a twill weave and the color is pretty close. The black fiberglass has a slightly smaller weave. It is also apparent that the Black Fiberglass has more of a matte finish and is lacking some of the gloss/highlight attributes of a real carbon fiber.

The Feel

The Black Fiberglass seems to have a ‘tighter’ weave. When compared to a carbon fiber, the Black Fiberglass seems more rigid. It is harder to skew or warp the weave pattern when performing a hand lay-up.

Before you start your next project, there are a few questions to ask:

Do I want it to be more cosmetic than structural?
Do I care if some people can tell its dyed fiberglass and not real carbon fiber?
Do I want a carbon fiber look without spending a lot of money?
At Fibre Glast, we want to help you get the right products for your application. Do you have more questions about Black Fiberglass? Call 1.800.838.8984 or visit www.fibreglast.com

1 comment

1 Josh Jordan { 10.05.10 at 3:13 pm } Carbon Fiber is a semi-conductive material, so, for EV applications, it’s a bad choice. However, Fiberglass is a great insulator (modern insulators are made of fiberglass). If this fiberglass is just dyed (no carbon added), it should also be an insulator, suitable for EVs.
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dammmagnum

Dave,

Thank you, i could see how the sheets would be tough on your feet. unless there was way to coat the top side to make it smooth with resin or something like that?

What do you use to cut the sheets, a carbide router bit or carbide saw blade? We use both and also carbide drills for the e -glass laminate when we machine it or drill it.

thank you
jim

glassdave

iTrader: (1)

Both those pics are of the laminate in its dry state, trust me it is in no way shape or form even remotely resembles CF when layed up. At least for our purposes. It really kills me when these suppliers push this kinda stuff without fully disclosing the differences. I purchased five yards of it for a project based on chatting with a sales rep (who i'm sure now had never used it) and i still have most of it left, ended up going back to CF.




I just use my bandsaw to cut the sheets, seems to work just fine. Keep in mind these are just a single layer of CF and the rest is FG in a polyester resin.

dammmagnum

Dave

I agree with you,, seems that Laminate suppliers are good at that,, i deal with them now,, not as much as I use to years ago, but they will swear that their product will work great and when you go to process it,, it is a mess,, plus they will tell you it has all these great electrical properties and it doesn't.
then the bigger problem comes into it,when they they sell the idea to our OEM customers that their product is the best thing since slice bread and when it doesn't work ,, the OEM comes looking for us. thats life.

Okay on the band saw, we machine and route striaight E-Glass Laminate, but we drilling holes sizes from 0.006" up to 0.250' into panels that are 0.062" thick and up . and we are talking 1000s of different size holes.
We use 100% Carbinde drills and router bits ,, Drills can be re-sharpend carefully some times 2 times.
On holes sizes below 0.006" we use Laser drills.

i wonder if we could vacuum press CF sheets using a CF pre-preg material? If we could we could then make sheets in various thinckness(0.010" to 0.250") and up to 50" X 12' sheets. its a Thought??

Thank you
jim

scippy

iTrader: (3)

DAVE,

I'm certain of one thing, but confused about the other. .....I certainly would like CF (not the mimic blk FG) to drape the triangular deck insert of my sport ......of course, the tie-breaker will always lean towards "painting the insert" if doing it in CF becomes ridiculous in $$$......that's a no brainer
What I'm uncertain about is the best means at which it would be applied?.....let's say, I buy the cloth (CF) enough to cover the insert (I think U know it's not small -see pic) would bagging be best? .......What about a finished panel? ...are they thin veneers that glue down? ....how thick would a 3K- 2over2 twill weave have to be?........Sorry in advance for the brain pick.

Jim................Thanks for the websites,do you have a handle on any CF material yourself??...........Thanks

dammmagnum

Hello Scippy

You are most welcome

Am sure that Dave will be able to help with the lay up and how to do the insert
i would think you might be able to do the CF over a sub straight material like FG. and vacuum bag it.

The only CF i ever did was fabricate a air box for a friend's
World Challeage Racing Corvette , was a pretty simple 2 pcs box with inlet and outlet that fit up front and took in the air from a a grill opening, hard part was to fit both the air box opening and the brake duct work also
I used a small vacuum pump and what we call a large turkey bag around the box halfs.

Was a few years ago,, most of the work that i did was laminating e-Glass FG in the PCB industry,, mostly working with pre-pregs
Also used a auto clave many years ago
along with Vacuum presses


Thank you
Jim

scippy

iTrader: (3)

Hey Dave, I got some CF samples being shipped to me from a composite store called CST on the westcoat www.cstsales.com would it be best to bed the CF on top of a layer (blk) FG -or- just laminate it down on the surface of the deck insert?