FormulaGuard
 

Has anybody had any luck ever getting a claim paid? it appears the warranty we pay for excludes almost every single thing that could ever go wrong. Needless to say, I had a horrible experience and had to pay for an engine out of pocket.

What was the nature of your issue?

I had a misfire alert on my smart craft display. Come to find out, I lost compression in 2 cylinders. The claims adjuster said it "tuliped" the valves and was likely caused by detonation. I have no modifications to the boat at all, all maintenance is completed, and the computer controls should have pulled timing and ensured this did not happen. The same fuel tank supplies both engines yet only one had a problem. The engine never overheated and there were no signs of it either. I have asked for the test results and nobody will provide any information as to what exactly happened or why or how. With the engine controls, this should have never happened.
The claim was denied as "tuliped valves" are excluded.

Did you just leave the Mercury warranty period? My next step, if Formulaguard is off the table, would be to go to Merc. Also, a call to get advice from Formula would be worth it. I have had nothing but a great experience with them so far.

Wow....just read the fine print of the policy. I would like to have a list of what they DO pay....they almost exclude everything imaginable.
A partial list....
What is not Covered
PARTS NOT LISTED ARE NOT COVERED. THIS LIMITED WARRANTY PROVIDES NO COVERAGE OR BENEFITS FOR THE FOLLOWING:
A. FAILURES WHICH OCCUR OR REPAIRS PERFORMED, OUTSIDE THE TERRITORIAL WATERS OF THE UNITED STATES AND CANADA.
B. REPAIR OR REPLACEMENT OF ANY COMPONENT PARTS NOT SPECIFICALLY COVERED BY THE LIMITED WARRANTY.
C. REPAIRS OF COVERED COMPONENTS REQUIRED AS A RESULT OF THE FAILURE OF A NON-COVERED COMPONENT.
D. REPAIRS REQUIRED AS A RESULT OF OTHER THAN A MANUFACTURER'S DEFECT, SUCH AS A DESIGN DEFECT OR
E. NORMAL WEAR.
F. REPAIR TO PISTONS, RINGS AND/OR PINS DUE TO CARBON OR "COKING" CONDITION.
G. REPAIR TO VALVES DUE TO CARBON, DISHED, TULIPED OR STUCK CONDITION.
H. LOSS AS A RESULT OF WATER INGESTION THROUGH THE INTAKE MANIFOLD, CARBURETOR, OR EXHAUST
SYSTEM.
I. REPAIR OR REPLACEMENT OF ANY COMPONENT COVERED BY INSURANCE OR THE MANUFACTURER'S
LIMITED WARRANTY OR RECALL POLICIES AFTER THE LIMITED WARRANTY EXPIRES WHETHER
COLLECTIBLE OR NOT.
J. DAMAGE AS A RESULT OF IMPACT, COLLISION OR GROUNDING.
K. MAINTENANCE SERVICES SPECIFIED IN THE OWNER'S LITERATURE SUPPLIED WITH THE PRODUCT AND
THE PARTS USED IN CONNECTION WITH SUCH SERVICES SUCH AS, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, ADJUSTMENTS, SPARK PLUGS, OIL OR FLUIDS, BELTS, HOSES, OIL FILTERS AND CLAMPS, MISCELLANEOUS AND SHOP SUPPLIES.
L. USE OF EQUIPMENT AND ACCESSORIES NOT INSTALLED BY THE MANUFACTURER OR DEALER, OR IMPROPER INSTALLATION OF THESE ITEMS BY THE MANUFACTURER OR DEALER. LOSS OR DAMAGE ARISING OUT OF WIRING, CABLING, PIPING AND FITTINGS SUCH AS HOSE CLAMPS IS EXCLUDED.
M. LOSS OF DETONATION, OVERHEATING, PRE-IGNITION, OR LEAN OR IMPROPER FUEL MIXTURE UNLESS CAUSED BY THE FAILURE OF THE OIL INJECTION SYSTEM (CARBURETORS ARE NOT COVERED). LOSS CAUSED BY FOREIGN SUBSTANCE IN THE FUEL AND/OR OIL NOT RECOMMENDED BY THE MANUFACTURER.
N. LOSS CAUSED BY EXTERNAL WATER INLETS, OR OUTLETS AND/OR INTERNAL WATER PASSAGES BEING CLOSED OR RESTRICTED, OR MOTOR/DRIVE IMPROPERLY MOUNTED.
O. REPAIRS REQUIRED AS A RESULT OF (A) FAILURE TO PROPERLY CARE FOR OR MAINTAIN THE PRODUCT: (B) FIRE, ACCIDENT, ABUSE, NEGLIGENCE OR ACT OF GOD; (C) FAILURE TO PROPERLY OPERATE THE PRODUCT; (D) MODIFICATION OR ANY ALTERATION TO PRODUCT NOT RECOMMENDED OR APPROVED BY THE MANUFACTURER; (E) USING THE PRODUCT FOR SPEED EVENTS SUCH AS RACES OR ACCELERATION TRIALS; (F) RUST, COSMETIC OR PAINT CHANGES; ELECTROLYSIS OR CORROSION; (G) INADEQUATE OR IMPROPER HAUL-OUT; LAUNCH, TOWING AND STORAGE (INCLUDING RACK STORAGE); (H) FREEZING OR ICE DAMAGE; (I) WATER DAMAGE DUE TO SUBMERSION; (J) REVERSE POLARITY; (K) AQUATIC GROWTH, SEAWEED, ALGAE, BARNACLES OR ZEBRA MUSSELS; (L) OVERHEATING (REGARDLESS OF CAUSE), DETERIORATION, CONDENSATION AND CONTAMINATION; (M) THE FAILURE OR LOOSENING OF EXTERNAL FASTENERS AND/OR BOLTS.
P. UNAUTHORIZED REPAIRS PERFORMED BY ANYONE OTHER THAN AUTHORIZED DEALERS AND REPAIRS REQUIRED AS A RESULT OF PARTS USED OTHER THAN THOSE RECOMMENDED BY THE MANUFACTURER.
Q. ADDITIONAL SERVICE WORK REQUESTED BY YOU OTHER THAN NECESSARY TO SATISFY THE LIMITED WARRANTY COVERED REPAIRS.
R. CHARGES FOR INSTALLATION OF APPROPRIATE CARBURETOR JETS OR GEARS TO MEET LOCAL ALTITUDE REQUIREMENTS.

They must have copied that from Mercury Marine, they cover everything - unless you start the motor

LOL - good one

I have worked with Formula. They went back to AMT, the warranty company, and asked for further review. The response I got back from Formula was that AMT inspected it and they have to go by that.

I agree, Formula has been a great company to work with. This instance is frustrating as it is mercury marine and FormulaGuard.

I talked with mercury marine and they were surprised that it was classified as "tuliped vales" as the engine controls should have prevented any possible detonation (detonation was the only speculation on the cause of the failure). Needless to say, no help from them either.

Very frustrating with a 2013 model year boat with 276 hours on it.

To find tuliped valves I'll assume they removed the heads. If everything was working with the motor sensors it should have detected pre-ignition from a lean condition. With everything being the same my guess would be that the injectors on the cylinders were clogging or the fuel pump pressure was reduced.

Were any other codes found?

Exactly. A compression test was done first. Cyl 3 and 8 had no compression. Pulled the heads and that is what was determined. No measurements were taken, just visual but I certainly can't see it.

No other codes, just the initial misfire code. Nothing else, no prior indication. Once everything was repaired and put back together ran tests on everything and found no other faults as you have described. That is why I am still nervous, nothing was found that would have caused the concern.

That being the case I would have the injectors sent out and flow tested. If the injector doesn't supply enough fuel you will start running lean.

That is probably the best idea but even with that being said, the O2 sensors should pick that up and adjust the pulse width of the injector. The O2 should kick a fault for too lean.

I agree that I need to find the root cause however, I thought that was the purpose of the FormulaGuard. It does surprise me how very little is covered by the warranty that we do pay for when purchasing a premium boat.

What motors do you have that are running closed loop on the exhaust? I know many have added Catalysts and O2's, knowing the engine me package may be helpful.

Not an expert with the sensors, but I'm thinking that the O2 sensor reads the combined exhaust of all cylinders. So if one is lean and if the ECM enriches all slightly, the overall reading may read within range. Also don't think the O2 sensors are that sensitive, it just needs to be within a range.

I have the 350 mag ECT. Both exhausts have the catalyst on them.

The O2's do run in a range and they are pretty sensitive. You are correct in they do measure the collective 4 cylinders on each side of the engine.

Again, this post is more about the FormulaGuard and not necessarily about my engine.

It has been repaired and it is back running. I have run a bunch of test and will certainly be monitoring engine performance much closer and use a boroscope occasionally to view inside the cylinders.

I had an issue with trim sending units on mine about 2 months before the Formula guard ran out. Took it to the Formula dealer expecting to pay for the fix myself, which was over $500. Formula dealer at LOTO looked up my hull ID, called Formula and everything was covered no questions asked. That was in 2013 though.

I am guessing that was Formula Boats of Missouri. If so, those guys rock!!!! Great people there and great service. From sales all the way to service and the gas docks!!!!

I wish I lived closer so they could have done the repairs on mine.

Yeap. It was Formula Boats of Missouri. A guy from mid Illinois I know, Joe Gibbs runs the place. They are a great dealership, and Joe is very fair to deal with. I was glad to see Formula has started using Verados on their new boats. That means Formula Boats of Missouri will have VRod technicians moving forward.:drink:

The folks at Formula Boats of Missouri are amazing. I will certainly be buying another boat from them....350CBR!

Please know....I am very thankful for the ideas and directions to tackle and determine the root cause of my failure. I will certainly be checking the injectors and probably running at least the 89 octane to prevent any possible detonation.

Also, Formula as a builder is incredible and the people there are great! The quality is second to none and I love my boat.

The concern was and is Formula Guard. It sucks that it has the Formula name on it as it is an outside company. While they (AMT AKA Formula Guard) did pay a claim as Mentalpause stated, I had to cover the cost of about $9,000 for an engine repair. I wish AMT (warranty company) or Merc would back the product. AMT basically said "not our problem" and found a way out. With all those exclusions....it is a miracle they have ever paid a claim.

Great forum and thank you all for the great input and feedback!!!

I put two different claims into Formula Guard. One claim they paid and one claim was partially paid. I called the Adjuster at Formula Guard to hear the explanation of why the other pieces of equipment where not covered. It seemed like, over the phone, if he was having a good day, he would cover it, Bad day, not. No explanation was given to me other than they didn't cover it. Naturally I looked at the exemptions and didn't find my problem listed.

I also called Formula. The rep for my area there is like pulling teeth for help also. Wish I could talk to an engineer instead of a-go-between,

My old lady and I love the boat, don't get me wrong. But if customer care falls flat, no matter how great the boat is. It will be the way of the Dodo.

Basically you're at there mercy.