View Poll Results: Would you buy an "Old School Carbon" boat?
I would buy a carbon lightweight Old School boat
40
61.54%
Nope..Glass and steps for me
5
7.69%
Nope...Carbon and steps for me
10
15.38%
Nope...Glass and Old School for me
10
15.38%
Voters: 65. You may not vote on this poll

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Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

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Old 07-01-2005, 05:19 PM
  #31
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Arrow Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

..so far 80% want an Old School boat of which 20% are fine with glass but the rest want it in a space-age composite light-weight material.

Any manufacturers listening?
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Old 07-01-2005, 05:36 PM
  #32
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Exclamation Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

Back in 1992, Craig Barrie built and atempted to race a VERY light 38 Cigarette. We heard that it had run 110 in Biscane Bay. At the time, the fastest big V's (Apache 41) were lucky to hit 100.

So we thought he would smoke us, and everybody else.

He didn't make one lap in the 3-4's at the OPT race in Chicago, because the thing wouldn't stay in the water. Bounced around like an out-of-control cork. A totally worthless POS in anything more than dead calm.

He said that it was an "interesting" experiment. but that there's a point of diminising returns with weght reduction.
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Old 07-01-2005, 07:40 PM
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Arrow Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bouyhunter
Give me a light but strong layup, 24 degree, old school flat deck design, no steps, no pads, no BS. Follow it up with moderate power (600's or there about),
Drives WITH Tranny's ( I loved the TRS I had - great around the docks)

I mean, as long as we're dreaming...
In some industries customers dictate what is manufactured.....who blew the whistle anyways and said stop producing Old School anyways?
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Old 07-01-2005, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ApachePete
Back in 1992, Craig Barrie built and atempted to race a VERY light 38 Cigarette. We heard that it had run 110 in Biscane Bay. At the time, the fastest big V's (Apache 41) were lucky to hit 100.

So we thought he would smoke us, and everybody else.

He didn't make one lap in the 3-4's at the OPT race in Chicago, because the thing wouldn't stay in the water. Bounced around like an out-of-control cork. A totally worthless POS in anything more than dead calm.

He said that it was an "interesting" experiment. but that there's a point of diminising returns with weght reduction.

If that truly is the case then I think if Cigarette re-incarnated one boat...say the 38' TG in OLD SCHOOL hull and with a carbon hull...but not a super light weight boat...it might be something that would sell like hotcakes.

A boat with T-600's that goes 80-85 mph.
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Old 07-01-2005, 08:38 PM
  #35
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Default Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

Hydrocruiser,
Before I counter your point I need to say I support the concept of non-step mildly high tech construction with medium power.
But.............
If so many are for that design why did it take so long to sell the Lucky Strike Cigarette ? It was kevlar w /carbon and 525Sc power.
Why doesn't the real nice Scarab in Calofornia sell ?
Yes they're used but well maintained and price correctly.

It seems to me there are a number of used boats that fit this concept but cannot sell.

ed
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Old 07-01-2005, 09:47 PM
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Default Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hydrocruiser
Baja's have a flat-pad...but nothing radical
I have owned three Baja's and none have had a pad.

The new 30 Outlaw just introduced last year does have a pad. As you said, nothing radical.

My 36 Outlaw is true Vee all the way and rides like a Cadillac.

"No Steps, No Pads, No Beak, No Bull"!!!!!!!!!!!!

Baja did a 100% total carbon fiber 40 Outlaw that was at the Miami boat show this year. With staggered 850's it is running in the 90's with no steps and no pads.
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Old 07-01-2005, 10:09 PM
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Arrow Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnum27
This is a great poll...it is the exact dilemma that we are facing now with building the old boats (24 & 28) again from the molds my dad bought from Don A. back in the 70's. Should we use the most modern light materials or put steps in? Tough decision and I must admit I am torn on which way to go...

For me I would rather have a a straight vee with a Kevlar carbon fiber layup instead of a stepped hull in a boat that is under 30+ feet in length. Boats that size I don't feel get the full benefit of steps unless they are 35 feet or more in length. When it comes to a 24 or a 28 foot boat, I think a straight vee with maybe a notched transom is the way to go. But that is just may opinion and you know what they say about opinions.
In that size steps would only break up the lines. Prior to steps coming into fashion I think Mercury had the 330 and 375 HP/TRS engine/drive offerings and that was close to about it.

Now that you can go up to 1075's... power is plentiful...remember about 10-15 years back 330 TRS combos were plentiful and a lot of power from independents was not all that reliable and if they were you had to go Arneson.

With that 24'er a 600 HP Merc would light it up and the 28'er with a 1075 would be a blast.

I would however like to see mass production of high tech hulls and some weight reduction and you know me..I never really did latch onto stepped hulls.
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Old 07-01-2005, 10:14 PM
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Arrow Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dock Holiday
I have owned three Baja's and none have had a pad.

The new 30 Outlaw just introduced last year does have a pad. As you said, nothing radical.

My 36 Outlaw is true Vee all the way and rides like a Cadillac.

"No Steps, No Pads, No Beak, No Bull"!!!!!!!!!!!!

Baja did a 100% total carbon fiber 40 Outlaw that was at the Miami boat show this year. With staggered 850's it is running in the 90's with no steps and no pads.
The 30 Outlaw with a mid-back flat-pad is nothing radical. The boat with T-375's can hit mid 70's and you can hang turns all day long. Plus it costs about 115k for a true 30'er. I think it represents a great value.

That carbon 40' Baja is exactly what I am talking about. If you went down to T-600's and 80's I would be happy. It's really the kind of thing I am hoping will remain around. Any idea on price?
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Old 07-01-2005, 10:20 PM
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Default Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hydrocruiser
That carbon 40' Baja is exactly what I am talking about. If you went down to T-600's and 80's I would be happy. It's really the kind of thing I am hoping will remain around. Any idea on price?
I have talked to several guys from the factory and I here that JUST the carbon fiber was close to $200K.

If that is true then this boat would not be a good value for the dollar.

Check out this 40 with triple 600's that we ran with in Jacksonville. They are in the upper 80's!

One VERY sweet ride.
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Old 07-01-2005, 10:20 PM
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Arrow Re: Would you buy an "Old School" carbon boat?

Powerboat Magazine July 2005 Pg.32

Article on Larry Smith..

Larry's take on boat racing is not favorable anymore...he says
"...and it's become stepped hulls with stern drives on courses with tight turns. The way they load and unload in turns, you have a lot of trouble."
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