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Old 11-10-2005, 02:32 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

ah man!!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron P
I spoke to lifeline today. They aren't CG approved because they offer custom sizes and colors. The CG will only approve life jackets that are made in an identical fashion and size. The Cg wants to know that the stitching will be the same on every jacket.

I also spoke to Stearns about the SOS Suspenders. They are CG certified but never intended to be worn in boats that run over 10 miles per hour. They are made for people like fisherman and sailboaters that would otherwise not wear any protection at all.

If you went before a court and showed an orange five dollar CG approved horseshoe or a $300 custom made Lifeline, which do you think the jury would say is the better piece of equipment to be worn in a 70+ mph boat?
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:34 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Zastrow
I read the article to be very negative towards fast boats period. What sticks out in my mind was no passing the pace boat. For safety I have five point harness seat belts and Lifeline jackets. When it is rough I slow down. Some Poker Runs I have been in front, some not. Often times the passengers dictate how fast I will go. I will ask at least every 10 minutes if they are OK with everything. I have had one passenger actually fall asleep on the last leg of the Windy City Poker Run in the back seat with belts on going 110mph.

One thing I do notice that can be improved on is the quality of lifejackets some of these peolpe wear at Poker Runs. Some are junk. Those belt/inflatables are crazy. Leave those to the fisherman who falls off his fishing chair. The ski vest is only slightly better providing you only travel 36 mph. $100-500k of for a boat and $30 for a life jacket???

Brad...it is great to see you do it right......you have proper equipment and good sense in operating your machine.......MANY DO NOT however do this.......and SAFETY....SAFETY .....SAFETY is not a negative attitude towards fast boats. It should be monitored and enforced.....it only takes a few BAD APPLES to ruin things for everyone. Some ideas passed across thus far are for being able to participate in certain classes within a Poker Run are years of performance boat experience and or the certification of a recognized performance boating school like TRES MARTIN's to be able to run in the un-restricted class. Even armature auto racing has classification guidelines governed by experience, skill level and racing school certification. Just some ideas on the table. How would you feel if you are running 30 feet away from the boat next to you at 110 MPH and find out later the guy driving just picked up the boat a week ago and never had driven a boat over 60 MPH in all his years of boating? One bad judgment on his part could lead to a very sad ending for both of you.
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:37 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron P
I spoke to lifeline today. They aren't CG approved because they offer custom sizes and colors. The CG will only approve life jackets that are made in an identical fashion and size. The Cg wants to know that the stitching will be the same on every jacket.

I also spoke to Stearns about the SOS Suspenders. They are CG certified but never intended to be worn in boats that run over 10 miles per hour. They are made for people like fisherman and sailboaters that would otherwise not wear any protection at all.

Ah....these are facts, not opinion.
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:41 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

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the funny thing is I think both you and Rat missed a message
oh i got the point...ron refered to pr's as races! which may influence how ins co's look at them. do you feel that does this community a good turn? sure i think saftey could be improved by people wearing lifeline jackets. sure the really fast boys should have onboard air etc etc. everyone here knows this look at the thread about ol rollover everyone was talking about saftey. i just dont think the way ron got his point accross is going to benifit this community...think about it
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Old 11-10-2005, 02:59 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

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Ron happens to be a friend of mine and is an x-racer and avid power boater. He has been on numerous boats in XS of 150mph
then ron should know that a poker run is not a race and state that in his rag...because a few big dogs want to run hard out front its a race? bullchit, everyone runs as hard as they see fit, there may be one or two events that give credit for first to the bridge, ( but they are an exception to the rule)...so that makes this a race? are the boats going 10/10ths around the corners? hell no! the fact that ha called them a race will hurt us all and the sport we love! good job ron, you are a writer and should choose your words a little more wisely. using a little forethought when you chose your words for this article would have gotten your point accross without hurting this sport! if the guy had used more forethought at the poker run he may not have rolled his brand spankin new o/l
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Old 11-10-2005, 03:01 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

Its not my opinion that matters. Its what comes out of the Miami meeting that matters.

Ratman, someone from NJPPC should be in attendance at the meeting. If Dave wants to come and have his voice heard, he's more than welcome. EBM won't be anything more than a facilitator at the Miami meeting. Its your show, we're just supplying the room and coffee.
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Old 11-10-2005, 03:26 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

Quote:
Originally Posted by ratman
because a few big dogs want to run hard out front its a race? bullchit, everyone runs as hard as they see fit, there may be one or two events that give credit for first to the bridge, ( but they are an exception to the rule)...so that makes this a race?


forethought at the poker run he may not have rolled his brand spankin new o/l

AS THEY SEE FIT ?

Good or bad judgment.......seat time......experience.......as you can see by your statement........brand spankin new boat

POOR JUDGMENT

NO SEAT TIME

LITTLE EXPERIENCE


Lucky no one else got hurt that day.....and...... I understand that the proper EMS and Divers were not in place to handle the crash..........DO YOU GET IT NOW


...as for race........no not really a race but almost all poker runs have some aspect of a high speed sprint whether its bridges......first to the pin and so on.......people like bragging rights.......I think that is what Ron was trying to get across in the article.

some standars need to be in place for everyones safety........not as a "SEE FIT" thing so everyone is safe at the runs.
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Old 11-10-2005, 03:58 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

could the article have been worded a little differently...YES
could a few statements or comments have been added or deleted YES
could this help the boating industry in the future YES
could it also hurt the boating industry YES
so i'm just going to hope that it has a positive outcome for us all. there are plenty of intelligent people involved in this sport and i'm sure there are some not so intelligent people as with anything. bottom line is i know right from wrong, i know my limits, i know my comfort level. have i ever pushed the envelope a little further than need be yes, but not when it could harm anyone else.

Last edited by berns29scarab; 11-10-2005 at 04:03 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 11-10-2005, 04:39 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

Quote:
Originally Posted by berns29scarab
could the article have been worded a little differently...YES
could a few statements or comments have been added or deleted YES
could this help the boating industry in the future YES
could it also hurt the boating industry YES
so i'm just going to hope that it has a positive outcome for us all. there are plenty of intelligent people involved in this sport and i'm sure there are some not so intelligent people as with anything. bottom line is i know right from wrong, i know my limits, i know my comfort level. have i ever pushed the envelope a little further than need be yes, but not when it could harm anyone else.
Yes....and in IMHO the future is a bit uncertain...NO GUARANTEES how this will go. BUT........I believe if we sit back and do NOTHING as more incidents happen it will HURT the industry......SO, on that note......Doing something is better than doing nothing at all.

LOOK - - - EBM knew this would be a controversial topic but felt it needed to be addressed.....that takes GUTS. They contacted and emailed the article to many many people connected to the sport before they ran this article and everyone was in favor of publishing it.
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Old 11-10-2005, 04:46 PM
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Default Re: Extreme Boats Magazine Poker Run Article

Quote:
Originally Posted by LIOPA
AS THEY SEE FIT ?

Good or bad judgment.......seat time......experience.......as you can see by your statement........brand spankin new boat

POOR JUDGMENT

NO SEAT TIME

LITTLE EXPERIENCE


Lucky no one else got hurt that day.....and...... I understand that the proper EMS and Divers were not in place to handle the crash..........DO YOU GET IT NOW


...as for race........no not really a race but almost all poker runs have some aspect of a high speed sprint whether its bridges......first to the pin and so on.......people like bragging rights.......I think that is what Ron was trying to get across in the article.

some standars need to be in place for everyones safety........not as a "SEE FIT" thing so everyone is safe at the runs.
What do you mean standards or do you mean laws? Would you inforce them? How would you inforce them.....poker run jail? Is this going to eliminate any PR related injuries or deaths ever? You can not effectively have EMS or divers at every PR venue. Our run covers 100's of square miles of open ocean!

Have we had a death? No.
Have there been injuries? Yes
Will there be a death or injury in the future? Who knows....we can only continue to have rules, provide guidance and educate prior to the run.
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