Legal Advice Needed
 

Hey guys I have a few ideas to better some of the items we use in our boating life style.I need to know how to I bring these ideas to reality and what is the legal way to keep my ideas from getting copied?How do I go about a patent?Manufacturing ect. Any help would be greatly appreciated.I'm sure a few or you guys have been down this road and I hope you could shed some light on it for me.

Thanks Nordic95

yeah me too, start up cost I think at a min, is a grand or two I opened my mouth about a idear in the carpet trade and asked to many people what they thought. guess what its on the market about 12 mons later.:signs069: art

not sure if this helps,but in the book business,you send your '''idea" back to yourself via registered mail,and do not open it,that way if someone steals your idea ,you have proof(postage stamp with date)that you had the idea first,just write down your idea with drawings,go to the post office and send it back to you,DO NOT OPEN IT ,then send your idea to someone you think could run with it,hope i am being clear just got back from a charity golf outing....free beer

I heard of this also,just wasnt sure if they was one way to document it leagaly or not.How do I go about looking for a manufacturing company once I document the idea?

Nordic95

Too late, I already have your "idea" in production!! Thanks for the tip!!!

The mailing the thing to yourself can help but you still need to get a patent from what I have been told. There have been times were people come up with the same invention with out the knowledge of the other then it becomes a mess...... The problem that you have is enforcement can be expensive....

Jon

Congrats on the new idea! You first need to start with a good attorney. I have a business attorney that also does patents. A good attorney can help you with a business plan to protect you and your invention. You might even consider contacting my attorney if you're ready to pursue the idea. Their firm works all over the US and they have logged thousands of cases. I also know a lot of guys in manufacturing and might be able to steer you in the right direction. Get in touch sometime and I'll see what I can do.

Donnie

You need a Patent Attorney. They will review your idea against any similar patents and do all of the paperwork to register your patent. Last I heard, about $5,000 - maybe a bit more now. If is was cheap, I'd have 50 patents by now! :D

Good Luck!

Mark

go to the NOLO website; much info in intellectual property law and all the tools to do as much if not all yourself. good luck - jeff

Just read today that it takes an average of $500,000 to enforce a patent in court.

Have you used them before?


Thanks Nordic95

No, I haven't used them, but I will in the future. I just spent $7K to get a name protected with the United States Patent and Trademark office. After seeing what was involved, I will be wiser next time. You are doing the right thing in protecting your intellectual property. The "send a letter to yourself" syndrome sounds great, but doesn't hold up in court. Enjoy

The easiest and cheepest way to protect your idea is a provisional patent. this version of patent was created for the little guy. you can write it yourself, including description, drawings, etc. and send it to the patent office with return addressed post card. This gives you "Patent pending" status with the date of your mailing

you then have 1 year to decide if it is commercializable and before 12months is up, file a regular filing ( $10k approx o rless if a patent attourney gives you a "littel guy break")
you keep the original filing date.

now the regular filing may result in no patentable claims, but you were protected for a year, and get the early date if there are claims that are patentable. you can still make and/or sell your idea either way and hopefully the patent pending status convinced copiers to look fro somethign else to copy

I did it myself. bought a book from waldens book store and followed the process.
the cost to file this provisional by yourself is less than $100

you can then talk with contract manufacturers, having them sign a simple non disclosure agreement first, and get quotes to manufacture your product. or you can license the patent pending idea to an existing company in the market.

they may agree to a licensing percentage contingeant on you obtaining a patent, or simply pay a fair commision for you bringing the idea to them.

if you have more questions, email me

Ramb
Rob

[email protected]
M.S Mechanical Engineering
Chief Engineer, Adv Prod Development
Johnson Controls

Did you get my certified letter, I copied you on it.
Lets get Anthony to make a prototype before we completely cut him out :chimp:

Yes I heard that a patent pending is the best....once you have a patent I believe company's can look up all the info, and just change a minor piece and then they are around the patent....also have everyone you discuss your project to, sign a non-disclosure.....I also believe marketing the item is the hardest part is making it successfull...If you need some CAD (Drawings) work done let me know....

In my business we have a lot of issues with intellectual property. The fastest, cheapest, easiest thing to do is write out your idea into a process format. (manufacturing process and use process) Usually a network diagram or swimlane chart with an attached written description. Then get that copyrighted.

the copyright isn't as good as a patent, but its quick and easy and will hold up in the court of law. From there you can work on getting the patent, but the copyright will give you some protection in the mean time.

One of the issues with a "patent pending status" is that you expose your idea to the world. Another is that you start the meter running on your 12 months......sounds like a long time, until you start watching the calender!!

Letter to yourself is bad idea.
 

I have several patents.
Is your idea a business model or an actual object?
The letter to yourself can actually play against you in a court of law.

Best thing is to go to www.uspto.gov and try to find something similar by searching "patents". There is also a "manual of classifications" that you can type in key words and it will search all the classes and subclasses of inventions.

For example, "propellers" will give you a good starting point.
Another example would be "carpet", or "tool" or "food processors". You can also do "Boolean" search or "Advanced" search. Really slick. If you are unsure of the ending of a word, use a truncated version with the wild card $. Example propeller$

Once you find something similar, then refine your searches until you find something really close to your idea. It may already have been invented, and you will be disappointed but save a lot of work and money. Also, it may just be a bad idea.

I had a man ask me about using air pressure fluctuations in a building to work as an intrusion alarm "burglar alarm". I told him it won't work. Why? Because every time the wind blows, or someone starts a ventilation fan, you will get a false alarm. Besides, even if it does work, it is at best, "control by inference". And there are some very good and cheap sensors that work by infrared, ultrasound, pressure sensitive floor mats, etc. He really had a long face. I told him to be happy, that I had just saved him about $10,000 in cash and hard work.

Many years ago, the patent search was very tedious. But now with the online searches, you can do it all in a couple of days.

The second step is to draw some very good sketches. Eventually these will have to be converted to real drawings, but unless you can visualize and sketch it, nobody can help you.

Write up what your idea is and reference your novel ideas to the items on the sketches.

Then you are ready to talk to a patent attorney. Avoid the "get rich from your ideas" firms. They will milk you and leave you with a long face.

A good attorney is essential and he must be skilled in that aspect of the law as it is highly specialized.

Defending an invention in court is very expensive, but the Supreme Court has handed down some decisions in the last 5 years or so that are friendly to the small inventor and will really slam infringers.

I don't think a foreign patent is worth chasing. There is no justice in foreign courts for US citizens.

The trouble with a provisional patent is that you can't add refinements without loosing much of your priority date because that added material is considered new material. So do your homework now and do it as thoroughly as possible. Don't put it off for the year of grace because it just muddies the water too much.

Non of the above is legal advice, just my opinion based on experience.

Call me if you want to talk. Don't call Tues, July 31

Jim
512 577 7374 let it ring a long time.

Hey dont you have some thing better to do,like "BUY A BOAT":D Besides,Kendall already told me all my idea are stupid:throw: So now I will start all over:signs069:

All kidding aside I really do have a few ideas and I need to figure out on what to do with them.This legal sh!t is a pain in the @ss.I'll keep taking advice and make a few calls,hopefully I can figure it out.

Nordic95

A patent is only as strong as you are. If you spend a bunch of $$ getting a patent, all you have is a civil claim to that intellectual property. If someone else wants to put your product into production tomorrow, all you can do is sue them. There is no Patent Police to help you. Now, if you're a billion-dollar coprporation holding the patent and another company wants it, you'll probably receive an offer of negotiation from them. On the other hand, if you're Joe Schmo, you probably won't even get the courtesy of a notice that they'tre producing your product. On the other hand, you may also get pre-emptively sued. I have a close acquaintance & business associate that had a great idea of which he received a patent. Took several years and the patent alone cost him about $35K. Spent about twice that on engineering consultants. When he started shopping it to the industry looking for someone either to produce it or licence the design, he found someone very interested in it. So interested in it that they dug through everything they had ever designed and patented until they discovered several areas of their designs that were analogous to what he'd done. Then, they sued him for patent infringement. They also petitioned the USPTO to rescind the patent based on infringement on their designs that the Office overlooked. His attorney basically told him he'd be wrapped up for 5 to 7 years and spend $250K to $500K if the manufacturer wanted to hang in. It was a minimum of $25K just for the initial engagement and counter suit filing. The manufacturer now produces the product and my pal is out $100K and several years of his life.

It's a sad story but it happens all the time. I don't want to be a wet blanket on your idea but it's probably best if you hear this stuff now before you mortgage the house & cash in the kid's college funds. I'm not suggesting you don't move forward, I'm only suggesting you investigate all the possibilities. If your industry segment doesn't have some large, predatory corporation for you to worry about, you may be just fine. It's always better to be prepared. Good luck!

Wise counsel CS