Panther

You misunderstood my point... My perspective is if you drive/race/build your product you are in tune with what needs to be done to make it better. If you don't....you need to rely on engineering logic and/or other people to do it for you....

Amazing how off topic this thread has gotten...as all Apache threads do...

Like Ed Cozzi said.... You get what you pay for....

Comanche3Six

Thank You

cosmic12

After reading this, and I have to admit its been a good time I looked around the classifieds and they really arn't priced much higher than most of the others when you look at the hardware involved. ( ck the 41 Shogren has) And while we are at it can someone explain to me why any if not ALL the builders or for that matter Merc gets the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ that they can get for the products that for the most part have no warr, little or no service to speak of and they just keep charging more and more. I just don't understand any of it, and it seems to me that they are just priceing the small to middle income guys out of the sport........ Its not just the Apache's.

Panther

I believe that I already answered that question......

To reiterate..do you own or are you going to buy an Apache?

Chris Sunkin

I'm not sure how you quantify success. Whatever McManus is doing, presumably it's satisfying to him. He's not building any boats and most likely avoiding all the hassles and money-losing that comes with the territory. My guess, based on what you can see and other's suppositions, is that he's making a living doing refits and such to existing Apaches. I've seen what he charges for his work and it seems like he's always got work so maybe he's smarter than the rest of us. I know Saccenti has had plenty of ups and downs since the split with Kramer's and that the latest Chief incarnation resulted in one boat being built, despite the name recognition and all the commotion surrounding him going back to building boats. Now, if I were in the market for a new boat, I'd sure as hell rather it be built by Bob than Mark.

In the end, it's a crowded marketplace these days in the $500K custom boat business.

Chris Sunkin

Mark is a nice guy and apparently an astute businessman. He's just not the guy that pops to mind when one thinks of Apache- not the old-school, glory days of Apache. Bob Saccenti on the other hand is what I think of. He's one of the godfathers of the offshore boating industry. I think about him building those magnificent 41's and those absolutely outrageous 47's and then winning all thsoe races.

When someone sends me a video where T2x is saying "...the magic throttle arm of Mark McManus...", then he'll be Apache to me.

McManus didn't start Apache nor did he ever have any vision beyond what he's doing today. He's a guy who, regardless of the version of the story you subscribe to, ended up with what was left of Apache after the government disposed of it. That doesn't make him a bad guy. It doesn't qualify him as a legend either.

Comanche3Six

When I think of Mr Apache, I think of Ben Kramer.
Unfortunately, when I think of the murder of Don Aronow, I also think of Ben Kramer.

Bob Saccenti was the best rough water throttleman I have ever seen.


Just who did build all those magnificent 41's and 47's?

Panther

Chris, you say it much more eloquently than I can.... At least one person knows the story..

Holy crap, speedo and I agree on something!

First ones were built by Bob and his team....they put the name on the map.


So anyway.......anyone remember the "Apache - What's in a name thread from years ago?" Even when the man himself told the story some still refused to believe it...

That's all I have to say about this...it's exhausting....I'm gonna go back to enjoying life and taking rides on my Apache!

Comanche3Six

Are you sure?

Comanche3Six

Beautiful powerboats!