Aluminum Offshore Boats - Research
 

Just found this forum through a gent who found and bought a classic aluminum offshore boat (thread in classic forum).

I have a real speed gene somewhere in me and have wanted for years to make a deep-vee offshore boat from aluminum alloy. 34', 24 degree deadrise, lots power, etc...

Until I found this great forum i couldn't really get any information on aluminum offshores since all of the forums I knew of were focused on fiberglass boats (CC, Pilothouse, etc) but not "Go fast" boats.

Anyone on here who has pictures, history, links I would appreciate any and all.

We're in the process of finalizing the design of a 34' offshore CC and will be building a couple of prototypes this winter.

I think that we could learn a lot from you folks...

Sincerely,

Jay Perrotta
President and Owner
Black Lab Plate Alloy Boats
Rock Salt Boats

Search the forums for Liquid Technolgy

Jay
Good luck on your project! Do you have any schematics or basic drawings of your boat? It would be interesting to see what you are doing! Are you going to use honeycomb panels or use ribs? Did you see the unfinished alluminum project on this website? I think it was 40 ft and built with honeycomb bottom, lots of room inside. I think they are trying to sell it? It is a beautifull boat.
jim

Jay, I saw your boat at the Annapolis show. Looks like you build a really nice, tough boat. Good luck on your project and please keep us informed, innovation in the sport lives here :D

Thanks for the replies - appreciated.

F311 - The liquid Technology boat was amazing - couldn't find a website for the company - any ideas?

1965 Thunderbird - New boat's first look:

http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.c...ine_1971_17551

Marylandmark - With guys going 100 miles offshore fishing seems like you might want to spend less time running and more time fishing.

Insptech - Innovation. Just finding this forum is like finding a treasure. There is so much information and knowledge here - amazing. I'm just doing a lot of reading - thank you for the kind words on the boats. Certainly not beautiful or excessively fast but not meant to be. I have a bad speed gene in me (probably the Italian) and have the desire to do go far, go fast, over the horizon series of boats.

Again any information or pictures of classic or current aluminum offshore powerboats would be greatly appreciated.

Jay Perrotta
President
Black Lab Plate Alloy Boats

Hy-Lite Powerboats Inc." Custom Aluminum Powerboats" in Leamington , Ontario, Canada have made some High Performance Offshore Powerboats from aluminum and have used the services of World Renowned Boat designer Michael Peters. You can view their web-site and read what they have done with aluminum. www.hy-litepowerboats.com

Alu boats from the Land of the Vikings.
 

There's quite a few alu performance manufacturers in my home country Sweden. Here's a few of the ones I like. Hope they'll give You some inspiration. I also include a couple of pictures from the very successful Boghammar Marin, they built small alu racing boats in the mid 60's. They had a 34 degree transom but because the engines got mounted so low in the hull the actually had very good stability believe it or not. If they hadn't got engine trouble they would have done well in the Bahama 500 race that the 32' alu Thunderbird won, now they had to retire. That little boat could go through anything. They built it from 5mm alu and they are actually in process to restore it. See the pictures.
http://www.vectormarine.se/indexeng.html

http://www.anytec.se/sub/boats/eng/index.shtm

I really like the Anytec 960 CAB
http://www.anytec.se/sub/boats/eng/960cab.shtm

The Vector 28 is also a very good riding one.
http://www.vectormarine.se/28fceng.html

Alu high tech.
 

Forgot to post the link to Dockstavarvet. They do all the high end vessels for the Swedish State. Most of their vessels are built in alu. Other more exotic materials are incorporated for the military spec boats. The most famous is the 90 series fighting vessel.
http://www.dockstavarvet.se/index2.p...ubpage=summary

First picture below is from Boghammar. It was a high speed recognasence vessel. A delivery of these were sold to Iran before the revolution, but unfortunately for us Americans the new regime used these as high speed attack boats on our ships in the Persian Gulf. The 27' Magnum that Boghammar bought and got the right to produce got longer and longer and You can see the 35' below, however those where allways fiberglas boats.

nick named tin boats
 

Jay, My name is Jay also and I love Maine too. I live in MA spent some schooling years in Maine and frequent the Sebago area. Anyways if you want some great info on aluminum hulls get in touch with some of the most informed experts on OSO. I hope they will not mind me suggesting them. User names: Black Tornado,littlenige,Ryan Beckley and 7Xchamp to name a few. This group knows their stuff and lots of history too ! Or ck.under some posts: "What happened to all the TIN boats, Cougar 41",and others. Ask about Cougars and CUV hulls to name 2 among others or ask about "Chairman of the Board" or some of Al Copland's race boats. Cats are the rage now. Why not build 1 or 2 diff. lengths. Would sure be cool. Best of luck, Jay;) 33 Sutphen offshore hull twin all Merlin 540's 625hp nat. aspirated.

[QUOTE=blacklabmarine;2326449]Thanks for the replies - appreciated.

F311 - The liquid Technology boat was amazing - couldn't find a website for the company - any ideas?


Here you go. call and ask for Wayne or Bob 541.660.1443

http://www.riverwildboats.com/racing.html

Search Companiesin Europe.
Many Al boats. THere is a race from England to France. Most of the OS boats are like submarines. 60'+ alum.
Good luck with your designs.

Liquid tried the aluminum thing with no success. It's just not weight or cost competitive with FRP. If I remember, the first boat Liquid built was run, then scrapped. The owner posted that they got the bottom wrong and the work required to fix it would be more than starting from scratch.

What a unique idea- building a hull desighn from scratch!

What are you talking about?

http://www.liquidtechnologiesllc.com/default.asp

A 44' was run at several Poker Runs around the country this past summer.
Here is their demo boat in the OSO classifieds.
http://www.offshoreonlyclassifieds.c...o18044-en.html

Not being able to sell a boat wouldn't exactly fit the definition of "success".

I applaud their effort. It's probably too unique for the market though. If Bob Saccenit can only sell one from his new venture and Craig Barrie can only sell a few Dragons, companies like this have real challenges.

i rember seeing a bad ass aluminum race boat, name was "riveted" saw it in sandusky ohio back in 97 i think?

We ran (2) different aluminum hulls as "Riveted" 38' Cougar and a 42' CUV - no problems - I can see cost and fabrication time as the draw back in todays market - Re sale on a one off boat will be the scrap value of the aluminum at the time, but that is not a bad thing - this tin can may be the only boat that EVER will increase in value -

Thank you all for the replies and information - incredibly interesting.

Maryland - my reply must have been ill-worded. I understood exactly what you were saying and completely agree - I apologize for any inadvertant offense!

Larslindroth - appreciate the Scandanavian stuff - some of the best aluminum bottoms I've ever seen. Topsides definitely reflect a different sensibility.

1CE - Good to see a fellow New Englander - where do you run that boat?

James - who made your two boats? Cougar? CUV?

Thanks again - I've been reading the site and have learned quite a bit already...

Jay

J, do not what to fill your thread w/stuff but u-asked, mostly go out of Boston North and South, Capecod to the Islands, Fallriver-Naragansett Bay, Merrimack River to NH and South to Cape Elizabeth. She is on and off the trl. (no trl queen here). I also used to do Winni and Sebago but not as of late (noise laws) re-read my 1st post get in touch w-the guys I mentioned they have a wealth of knowledge as do many others on OSO. I believe alot of aluminum hulls were built in Europe: CUV's in Italy and Cougar's in England. Ask about Bobby K's "SYSTEMS" for example too. Good place is as u-mentioned: Classic's forum and others. Also Look under the classified sections for some excellent examples of FRP boats ck.under Skater,Motion,Ocean Express or MTI to name some. As the others have said prod.costs etc.and todays market may make it unfeesable. Do your best due dilligance good luck. JW "I"CE SCREAM" my boat's name. PS luv to see your shop some time. In my bus.our truck bodies are made from alluminum.

Jay

Cougar was built in Southhampton England and the CUV in Viareggio Italy - before you go looking further I might warn you that the pound is trading 2x the dollar and the Euro is almost 1.5 the dollar -

Construction on both was welded stringers and diaphrams and riveted skin - weight was consistant with a glass boat for the same period -

to be built
 

James, Thanks for the info and I remember your boats ":eek: Riveted" Way kool ! Did u-prefer 1-over the other const.wise and how were they powered ? Anyway Jay Perrotta want's to possibly build an aluminum v, If I were to say------I'd say go Cat, but if it's a V why not a 26 degree bottom with all the newer style steps and vents etc. just my 3-cents. JW :D

The cougar was a 38', and was the former "Dirty Laundry" Boat. We powered it with Keith Eickert 900's EFI's the boat ran as "open class" -500 inch, 12:1 motors with Big Chief heads. We won the National Championship in 1996 with that boat - and here is a tid bit that even Ryan Beckley does not know - so how then could Alcone run the # 1 number in 1997 ????? - Fact is we sold it to him the # 1 plate

CUV was the former "Ohio Steel" boat, We first ran it as "open class" with KE 900's then we switched to Superboat with KE 1200's with one of the first double whippled charged engines - lot's fo blower issues back in the day - CUV was a much better ride and faster hp/weight ratio -

No construction complaints with either boat - both took a pounding and only occational would a rivit pop - Probably replaced 20 rivits in 5 years as a result of stress -

Aluminum is a good conductor of noise - both boats were increadably loud inside when compared to other similar size boats - I drove fiberglass cats and even Al Coplands 35' wooden cat with 750's - Even with an open top V the boat will be louder with both vibration and noise than a similar glass boat -

The upside to an aluminum boat is that you never need to run a ground wire -

j.p.
 

James keep it goin you been there and done it thanks,jw-- hope j.p. follows along !:D

info.
 

guess he does now :rolleyes:

dirty laundry
 

James, Did Joe M. have a 50' later on or am I mixing this up w-spirit of the amazon. Wish there was a detailed history book on this stuff. Has anyone fully documented or tried to on this subject matter ? thanks jw PS very noisy I heard that !

Joe Mach had several boats, his badd ass boat of the day I believe was a 47 CUV with (4) KE 900's running through two arneson drives - This is the boat that Joe Flipped over in Lake St Clair MI, I think that was Joes last race - Boat was purchased by a local Miami guy (mike) and is/was used as a pleasure boat around Miami.

Joe had a boat in between the Cougar & CUV that was a 42 CUV it later ran as Endangered Spicies - Clay Wilson/ Errol Lanier ran it

The 38 cougar that started life as Dirtly Laundry, then became Riveted, races as an Open Class boat, that included a trip to Mar Del Plata Argentina for an SBI race years ago. ( FYI, one of the racers was Daniel Sciolli, he later went on to become the Vice presindet of Argentina) The 38' eventually went to Texas and was last seen having turbines put in the boat -

The 42' CUV - Started life as Ohio Steel with John Raben and Hurley Stepp, Became Riveted as an Open & Super boat and was sold as a pleasure baot August 2001 and was last seen in Baltimore MD.

Boats both boats had arneson ASD6 drives and were powered by Keith Eickert Engines - Competion in the day was Sloppy Joes ( Mike G) Alcone (Matt & jerry) Drambuie ( Forrest & Johnny) Reggie ran a cat with Mike S, La Grande Argintina with Fabo & Sciolli ,Jaws etc.. fun stuff - The CUV also made a trip to Mar Del Plata Argentina for a race, and in those days we had races around Paridis Island in the Bahamas - running under the old bridge that connected Paridise the the main land WFO was exciting -

The aluminum boats could have been made lighter as technology changed and requirements change, but the fabrication and skill level required to build one off boats is expensive.

One of the best features of an aluminum raceboat was the fact that there was no tooling. We made every boat different (and hopefully better) than the previous one. When we were doing 38' class one cats at Cougar, you could buy a Kevlar 37 1/2' racing Cigarette hull for 24G's. Our class one cat was 85 G's bare. Peter at Skater has mastered the art of building different boats in the same mold. Very smart guy..............

I thought I'd read some where that Al Copleand (or a contemporary) was replacing sections of hull plate and many, many rivets, almost every race on a Cougar? But it sounds like James had a much easier time of it. What's the maintenance cycle like on an older aluminum race boat?

I came very close to buying a 38' CUV v-hull last year and the stories of replacing rivets and chasing leaks made me nervous... Still one of the coolest boats around in my mind.

There's a bare aluminum cat sitting on a Myco in a storage field here in Ft Myers if anyone wants one. Does anyone local know who's/what it was when it was racing?

The only rivets are in the sides and deck on a Cougar. The bottom, tunnel and transom are all welded. Copeland's 50' four engine Cougar rode so well in the cockpit, that you could beat it to death and never know it.

Our 40' Caricoff was built in 1973. Been racing it for over 25 year with no major damage. Here is a photo of the original configuration and current configuration which ran in P-3 class in 2005. With 750 Sterling and a weight of 9000lbs. it will still run mid 90's all day long.

I too had herd stories of rivits pooping out - I went wild purchased 100 rivets and still have 75 left over - We did havea few Incidents where we played bumper boats or stuff the boat and had to replace a panel. It was not difficult but for damn surge there are a lot of Rivets in each sq/ft of boat - Brownie is correct - all the important wetted surfaces are weled and rivet leaks are not an issue. Any person with a hammer and rivet gun can fix, repair or modify and aluminum boat and till not compromise the structure, it will take an expert to do the same with a plastic boat - We washed the boat down with a hose after each race and had few or no corrosion issues -

Man, I feel like a rube saying what I said without a specific quote. I know I read it somewhere... Just wish I knew where!

Thanks for the info though! As I've said before, you guys that were actually there... You are all an invaluable resource to the rest of us.

And to be frank... I kick myself for not buying that CUV when I had the chance!

The best safety feature of an aluminum boat is the fact that they never have catastrophic failures. They will bend, but they never shatter.

What kinds of speeds did the Liquid Technologies see in the poker run boat??

It's beautiful

Good point Brownie - at the end of the day we all want to come back home after a boat ride -Even in the aluminum boats I put screens and water diverter plates in front of the occupants in case of a tear - a plastic boat as we have all seen can come apart much faster -

BLACKLAB, Where did u-GO !

Let see some pics of it. Im looking for one

Is it the bare aluminum 50ft Cougar sitting on a custom red tilit trailer? If so this boat is Dean Clausen's (Owner of the Bravo Shop). I don't think he wants to sell it but everything is for sale for the right price.

Hope this helps
Don

Man that is a good looking boat, Can you post more (and bigger) pictures we can save?

That would be it. I'd forgotten whose it was, thanks. Do you know the history on it?