Outerlimits rolled in Norway?
06-12-2009, 05:34 PM
#101
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Frank.... You are 200% Correct.... At the end of the day its the guy behind the wheel that is ultimately responsible for the control of his boat and the safety of his passengers...
First off I feel for
everyone involved and pray for a quick recovery.
But I have to agree. A boat builder can build a boat that can run excess speeds and so can a car builder. It is the DRIVER that must know when, how and if conditions warrant the speed. When I ran the Sarasota Poker Run with Gene Weeks with the Donzi 38ZR with 700s, I knew the boats capabilitys, speeds and conditions. If I let my thrill of racing take over I would have taken the boat to 115 in 3 to 5s I have no fear and can handle a boat at those speeds. But I had 3 passengers in the back that one was from Mercury Racing, My wife that puts here trust in me, and a woman that Gene Weeks knows from the boating community. With all the boats running we watched some Yahoos flying with more air under them that was an accident waiting to happen. One guy in a cigarette actually lost his hatch!
With Conditions in hand we ran 95-100 sometimes less and sometimes more. But you can almost feel the boat getting harder to steer so you back off.
As far as a 95ft boat wave " How could you not see this" If the Nor-Tech on front of you went airborne its time to pull the throttles back and take the wave at the correct angle.
When we were in 1000 Islands in a didtance was a Tanker I knew what water that boat was pushing, I was running 90 and pulled back to 50 and let me tell you AIR was putting it mild, at 90 I would have lost the boat. Running anything at hi speeds takes skill, thought and respect. You can't point the finger at the manafacture unless it was a boat defect but Drivers error totally different. I pray for all involved.
everyone involved and pray for a quick recovery.
But I have to agree. A boat builder can build a boat that can run excess speeds and so can a car builder. It is the DRIVER that must know when, how and if conditions warrant the speed. When I ran the Sarasota Poker Run with Gene Weeks with the Donzi 38ZR with 700s, I knew the boats capabilitys, speeds and conditions. If I let my thrill of racing take over I would have taken the boat to 115 in 3 to 5s I have no fear and can handle a boat at those speeds. But I had 3 passengers in the back that one was from Mercury Racing, My wife that puts here trust in me, and a woman that Gene Weeks knows from the boating community. With all the boats running we watched some Yahoos flying with more air under them that was an accident waiting to happen. One guy in a cigarette actually lost his hatch!
With Conditions in hand we ran 95-100 sometimes less and sometimes more. But you can almost feel the boat getting harder to steer so you back off.
As far as a 95ft boat wave " How could you not see this" If the Nor-Tech on front of you went airborne its time to pull the throttles back and take the wave at the correct angle.
When we were in 1000 Islands in a didtance was a Tanker I knew what water that boat was pushing, I was running 90 and pulled back to 50 and let me tell you AIR was putting it mild, at 90 I would have lost the boat. Running anything at hi speeds takes skill, thought and respect. You can't point the finger at the manafacture unless it was a boat defect but Drivers error totally different. I pray for all involved.
06-12-2009, 06:53 PM
#102
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Excellent point, feasible design, and afforable in the scheme of the boats exceeding $500K already, Reggie has had the air-systems and escape hatches for years in his raceboats. There was article years ago in PowerBoat Magazine about a race, when he upset a raceboat with his son with him, his son kicked open the hatch, they both escaped without a problem, other than a wet boat, and no checkered flag. It will come to this for those 120+ mph pleasure boats.
Mrs. Patri Yacht, This is one of the safety precautions that can be implemented. It would take the pleasure of pleasure boating (for me) but it might save a life, and or reduce injury, in the event of failure/crash.
Mrs. Patri Yacht, This is one of the safety precautions that can be implemented. It would take the pleasure of pleasure boating (for me) but it might save a life, and or reduce injury, in the event of failure/crash.
Last edited by Smarty; 06-12-2009 at 07:36 PM.
06-12-2009, 10:22 PM
#103
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Smarty,
First off, the bustle is a molded peice that is strictly cosmetic, the fact that that was removed with that level of impact is to be expected.
The transom, drives, and hull all remained in tact, the majority of the deck and hull damage was caused by extracting the boat from the water while it was full of water.
First off, the bustle is a molded peice that is strictly cosmetic, the fact that that was removed with that level of impact is to be expected.
The transom, drives, and hull all remained in tact, the majority of the deck and hull damage was caused by extracting the boat from the water while it was full of water.
Pantera
Donzi
Magnum
Cigarette
Boston Whaler
Phantom
I have operated those brand boats (but I like Skater) but if I am fair and balanced when it comes to factual observation and experience when it comes to any brand (based on what I see and experience), as you are you brand loyal to OL and have been there and done that in an OL - therefore I see where you are coming from.
I am against people getting hurt when they go boating, I am sure you will agree with me on that point.
Stephen
PS I deleted all of my prior posts, I like OSO and OL, nuff said - be safe enjoy your summer
Last edited by Smarty; 06-12-2009 at 11:09 PM. Reason: Be safe, enjoy life it is too short to dicker over who or what is to blame
06-18-2009, 10:17 AM
#106
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Charter Member
Seriously, why do you hate on stepped boats so much? They are simply an advanced design, that require an educated driver to operate, just like any race car?
Do you have the opinion that someone who regularly drives a Suburban, should be able jump in, and be able run an Indy car safely at it's top speed?
I'm seriously just asking, I'd try to PM, but my others get returned to sender, lol.
Last edited by BLee; 06-18-2009 at 10:27 AM. Reason: more bad spelling
06-18-2009, 10:25 AM
#107
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From this post on page one.
06-18-2009, 01:40 PM
#108
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Stepped boats, from the very beginning (pre-1910), were known to be enigmas with respect to handling. When Chris Smith (eventually known for Chris-craft) first built a stepped boat in 1914, he put on just one step, instead of a series of steps all others were using at the time (and OL uses today). He found that if the step was at or just forward of the CG, the boat was very stable dynamically. Some may find it interesting that this is exactly the same design philosophy used on the Howard 28 that has been praised for its handing, even though its relatively small and even with very high HP and speed (over 120 mph!).
So while the OL boats are unquestionably well built, they do utilize the same basic step design as has been recognized for a century as resulting in unpredictable handing including porpoising and directional problems.
So while the OL boats are unquestionably well built, they do utilize the same basic step design as has been recognized for a century as resulting in unpredictable handing including porpoising and directional problems.
06-18-2009, 02:15 PM
#109
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Stepped boats, from the very beginning (pre-1910), were known to be enigmas with respect to handling. When Chris Smith (eventually known for Chris-craft) first built a stepped boat in 1914, he put on just one step, instead of a series of steps all others were using at the time (and OL uses today). He found that if the step was at or just forward of the CG, the boat was very stable dynamically. Some may find it interesting that this is exactly the same design philosophy used on the Howard 28 that has been praised for its handing, even though its relatively small and even with very high HP and speed (over 120 mph!).
So while the OL boats are unquestionably well built, they do utilize the same basic step design as has been recognized for a century as resulting in unpredictable handing including porpoising and directional problems.
So while the OL boats are unquestionably well built, they do utilize the same basic step design as has been recognized for a century as resulting in unpredictable handing including porpoising and directional problems.
I would challenge the statement about unpredictable handling, porpoising & directional problems. I can only speak for the OL, but I have over 1000 hours behind the wheel of various Outerlimits, and I have not experienced any of the above characteristics. In fact I have had to make several high speed turns in our 51 quad step to avoid some partially floating debris, as well as navigate some pretty tight and windy chanels, and the boat has always done what expected, and did not feel loose at all. The difference is I knew how the boat liked to be trimmed and set up.
Getting back to what BLEE previously stated, these boats are very similar to high horsepower performance cars, I would not expect to go into a turn in a Ford GT or a Porsche GT2 with my foot to the floor and expect it to turn with out any consequences, you need Knowledge, Common Sence, and respect for what you are driving / operating.
That being said, the unfortunate accident had nothing to with the boat being a stepped bottom or a coventional bottom, The accident did not occur as a result of turning, in fact all of the details are just merely speculation, as those involved in the accident have yet to comment other than to report that they hit a big wake.
Let's focus on the well being of all involved before we start re-inventing the debate on steps versus no steps.
