Purple hornet,
If the marketing was so good they would have sold more boats. I would think that after a few years of declining sales they would realize that sponsoring all the boats, paying for multiple front page adds, and producing videos, does not work anymore. If the boats are the best they would sell themselves...like skater, mti, outerlimits ect...
With all the money they likely spent on crap they could almost run for a year.

RaggedEdge,
If it was like your example I would agree but...fountain seems to have had several problems:
http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ain-stock.html

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...introuble.html

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...-s-future.html

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...nancially.html

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ot-pretty.html


You have to wonder how they purchased baja with no money or somehow was able to get a loan. They already new the market was turning to crap yet:
http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ired-baja.html

Had to get bailed out by Merc:
http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ks-reggie.html

It appears that fountain always escapes bankruptcy! Except this time.

All the statistics that you have posted are the result of the start of the economies down fall, from the gas price jack up. Maybe buying Baja was a bad idea but who thought the economy would have kept falling and falling. Show me where other boat companies have gained in that time frame or any other business besides repo companies.

Here are some stats

The fourth quarter of 2008 finished with an increased rate of decline on sales volume. The total fiberglass market for all lengths was down 40.2 percent on 9,421 units for the quarter.
These statistics are based on registration data from all 50 states. This is the second consecutive year with the entire country reporting.

I agree it was during the downturn. I cant see the future but... even I could see the economy was crap and it did not look like it would recover anytime soon. Seems they took a gamble and continued as usual.

I may be wrong but it appears that Skater, Nortech, Outerlimits and a few others seem to be expanding there product lines and selling boats or restoring existing customers boats. Especially Skater!

Those three companies combined don't build 350 boats a year. They also cater to the super high end client, not the upper class. apples and oranges in my book.

He said:
"Show me where other boat companies have gained in that time frame or any other business besides repo companies."

I didnt see anything about who builds the most boats!

Fountain builds several poker run boats with similar price tags and are competing for the same customer. If fountain only sells a small portion of boats to the super high end client then Fountain should have focused marketing on the upper and middle class. Instead they will soon be building less boats than one of the companies.

In a what seems very ironic statement now post # 251 in the fountain aqires baja thread by fountianracing65 (I do not know how tied to the company this person is) It is said "who knew fountain had so many CFO's" because everyone was bashing the purchase of baja saying it wasn't that smart of a decision. Maybe they should of listened to some of those CFO's.

Like said the comparison to these three is not apples to apples. Their customers are on a different level than the average Fountain buyer. The super well off, though hurt by the market and general downturn like everyone, still have the income level to support their passion for a perf boat, be that improve it or buy a new one. The Fountain buyer is more likely to be faced with trying to keep what he has, or even sell it off, in order to maintain his home and base lifestyle in these times. Talk to marine dealers, most will tell you that their higher end products are not suffering as much as their average joe products. Even the average joe that is ok right now and may have a little cushion sitting somewhere likely is being very cautious. Fountain is an upper level production boat, and has been hit hard. Baja is a step down and I would think it has taken an even bigger hit. If you followed the Fountain site you would have seen them start to go after the "Freshen Your Boat" work a while ago. Great idea, problem is the guys likely to upgrade an older boat don't have any money right now either.

No money = No sales, No sales = No money. You can only run around that circle for so long. I still think Fountain will somehow survive, different deal, but still here.

Just wait until Barry gets into the pockets (and is there ANY doubt that he will?) of the owners that can have New Skaters, Cigs, and OLs and we shall see who is left building boats in the USA.

I see a future for these marks,


















in Saudia Arabia, or perhaps Baharain.

Well maybe thats part of the problem people and businesses living and operating well above their means. What happened to saving some money and buying something.

Right up there with the Schwartzcraft............. ;)

T2x

If everyone saved to buy a $200-400 thousand dollar boat, there would be no boat industry!! Plus, If I had say $250 grand available in one chunck to buy something, it certainly wouldn't be a boat. I'd finance the boat and leverage the $250k.

I'm NOT Talking about a Fountain.Just the way people are talking about it.The situation

Say if YOU had something redone by a business and they didn't do the job right,treated badly ,talked down to,The Rebuilt product came in damaged because of no packaging,doubled the quote and didn't tell ya untill charging your CC,She told you if you don't pay the full amount you want get your product back,accused you of lying about being warranty work,You had the receipts that proved the previous shoddy work done, and picks of damage to the boat,them saying they didnt do the work.They charged you the labor and materials that was warranty, that they said they would pay for including shipping.Charge you labor that they didn't do,That you had already done before shipping it back.There was Nothing you could do about it,Then something bad happens to this person/business, How would you feel?


Would it be petty to you?

I bought a two year old boat and paid cash for mine. Paid cash or 0% financing for both my wifes and my new trucks. Waited untill we had enough cash flow and bought a left over new payloader. Paid my house off in 5 years. Maybe Im fed up but I was always told that you dont need to be 30 days away from bankrupcy just so you can have the biggest and the best to impress nobody. My business has been hit very hard by this econmy and I sure as hell would have had to file myself if we had all our equipment and property financed. Ill tell you what sometimes I think I am the stupid one because I pay my bills instead of just sticking someone else for it and filling. And if you dont have 250k im not really interested on your ideas of leveraging or investing it.

X2.....

I generally avoid paying finance charges on women too.

The right answer is different for EVERY scenario - exercising fiscal responsibility is the important factor, not how you do so. I have several toys and I keep all of them on an equity line. Doing so with my boat has allowed me to enjoy several summers of boating while in my mid-twenties - youthful years, that you can never get back, and you can never relive - I can't put a price on that but I sure as hell know it is less than the 2.5% my after tax borrowing rate is on my line.

Have I paid some interest, absolutely, have I made a lot of friends through boating, absolutely, do I have tons of memories with my wife, brother, and friends that I otherwise wouldn't have - ABSOLUTELY. So waiting until I was older to buy my boat just so I could pay cash wasn't necessarily the right thing for me to do. Just because people borrow money to enjoy life doesn't mean they are either upside down, moments from bankruptcy, or inclined to EVER miss a payment or stiff the lender - that is a broad generalization you were hinting at.

Good points as long as it is done with the fiscal responsibility you speak of and not off the backs of others through the bankrupcy court. Sorry to get off topic.

where is dean? the economy is doing great!!!!!!!!

I agree with you. Enjoy yourself, just don't feel sorry for someone when the leverging doesn't work out. Reggie is a cool dude, if it is made to happen, he will continue on.

:party-smiley-004::chick:

Well, excuse the phuck out of me, Mr. Righteous!!:rolleyes:

Sorry it wasnt directed as an attack. Simply a belief that never to take financial advice from someone without any money, relationship tips from somneone who cant keep a mate, or business advice from a drunk in a bar whos unemployed, you get the idea.

I didn’t think that the number of posts on a message board qualifies anyone to become an expert on any subject.

Yes, I do have a “good friend” that is in an industry that is struggling through no fault of their own.

The difference between my friend and Reggie is that they have not spent money that they did not have. Reggie has been using money received from lenders and people that have invested into his publicly traded company and my belief is that he did so irresponsibly. As the CEO of a public company his ultimate responsibility is to the shareholders, whom I believed he failed.

It is not Reggie’s fault that the economy tanked…however the boat business, like the US and World economy is cyclical. He should have seen this coming a mile away.

Perhaps “con-man” was a bit out of line, but to me with all of his show-boating, slamming other manufactures and then promoting FPB stock in all of his advertising, Reggie has placed himself in the company of other Wall Street weasels

I have always respected Reggie, his boats and what he has done for the sport. That is why I am so disappointed that he has brought this company to bankruptcy. I guess that is what happens when you run on the Ragged Edge.