Overpriced and over the top customer service:party-smiley-004::lolhit: I don't get it I can't treat my customers this way in fact I have been going further over the top these past few weeks to spread the word of great service (not that I have not in the past, just going over the top) to build more business and save for the next boat:lolhit:. Not to mention I quoted a job and got the job done and they asked if the total was the same I was shocked! I said yes I quoted you a price and it stays that way!!!!

Not defending Mike or his company but I would think the turmoil in the boat business has affected the operations at McCleod. Lack of demand and the fact subcontractors are less likely to take orders on credit or orders that are not paid in full prior to processing (completely the opposite of what standard practices were only a couple years ago) has probably disrupted day to day operations.

Think about his business model from 2005, 500-700 pairs of bolsters could be ordered from boat manufacturers, materials could be ordered on credit and he would only have to pay the labor (his employees) and overhead. Boat companies pay him and he pays off the suppliers then keeps the profit for himself.

Now, MAYBE 50 pairs of bolsters, materials must be paid for C.O.D., overhead is the same as 2005, employee payroll is down. Now is operating at a loss if the overhead stayed the same from the high of 2005......and their is no light at the end of the tunnel!

Understood, but why make your customers part of the problem? Simple communication solves most issues. A phone call or email stating that the order is a bit late but still under production would alleviate a problem on the other end. However, if anybody ever asked me to pay for a service in full prior to building the product would just get a "no thanks" from me. It's just an indication that there's problems with that company, been there done that...never again.

I too know nothing about Mike or his company's operations but believe his problems are probably worse than your example. He is likely an excellent designer/builder of these seats/interiors.......but a lousy businessman. When his business drops, he doesn't alter his personal finances and soon he's sucking money out of the business to pay for his customary way of life...eventually even the business runs out of money and customers start seeing the effects.

It's unlikely there was any intention of screwing customers, but desperate people do desperate things. When I see someone doing these types of things it suggest to me that they are in deeper than the rest of us realize.

I dont know where his at now ,when I said last I heard that was back in september of 2009,
thats when I got a price for 2 front bolsters for my Powerquest,$6.800.00 Plus the cost of the frames:eek:

I've met the guy on several occasions. I know how he handled the task of designing the interior for the F-4. Don't be making excuses for him. He's a world class tool.

T500s/Indy

I totally understand how he can fix the customer service issues by simply picking up the phone. In my example I suspect he is the captain of the Titanic right now and he is re-arranging the deck chairs despite the ship taking on water! :eek:

Knot

I suspect he may have an "artist" complex being the all knowing designer..... Tough spot to put yourself in for sure. I hope he didn't let go too many key employees that remember how to sew and return phone calls. It could have spawned some new aggressive competition with in-house experience!

We seem to have the same opinion....and I like that Titanic reference, sounds appropriate.

Word on the street is that next week may come to quick for this "BOAT" to stay afloat and employees are owed a lot of money. Mike needs to go back to the old days when I (only employee) worked for him doing interiors in a small rented garage back in 1977.

Mike does has a lot of talent ..........but his people and business skills are way off base.

Not good for anyone if this proves to be true, I don't like to start rumors but we have heard this same thing in the past and he is still in business and I hope he pulls out of this and gets things turned around.

Brian, I never got that message...

If this is the Donzi that I think it is.... That thing is fast. I was out over the weekend and think I saw that Donzi do a pretty quick "fly by" on Sugar Island......



SOrry for the hi-jack..

Brian at what location did your customer stop by, it sounds like where his shop is in question, is he still out by you?

I sell industrial filters and I get back to everyone the same day or at worst the next, and if it is some custom job I let people know I am working on it and the progress. Artist, smartish who the fruck cares, if you take someone's money to do a job, it's a sale it's a business. If you can't talk to customers and get a job out then I don't care how creative you are, in my book you are a smuck with some drawing skills. People,,,, we are talking about boat seats here, not fricking art work.

While we are on the subject of art and great design, we have a BT and I am not sure if it was his idea or BT, but that back bench is the most ass-in-ine idea I have ever seen. You have to get everyone and everything out of the way, which means everbody and every cooler has to move up to the front behind the front seats, that's so you can slide the bench all the way forward (in towards the cabin, and then tip it up towards your chest.) I curse evertime I have to retrive anything from that area. Who knows who came up with that design, but if it was BT, he should have (in a creative way) talked them out of it. I know without a doubt for a heck of a lot less money I could have designed something just as attractive but a lot more user friendly.

IMHO You can count on Brian for spot on information in this matter and frankly if I was him I would be alot more #$%@?%%@ If I was the thread starter I would not wait any longer and get some type of stop against him via your CC good luck

Donna glad to hear from you... been a long winter. As usual you are spot on with your post. Mcleod is still in Taylor on Northline road but I was told that a Bank note was left on the building over the weekend. If I were owed anything at this time I would be doing all I could to collect either product or monies back and trust nothing I was told.

Donna I think you were looking for "assinine" idea. That has to be his idea since Sunsation has the same design on their rear seats. It is ok, I keep fenders under the rear seat so it is time to get up and move around anyway.

Almost doesn't matter.....bankruptcy law allows the creditors to demand the return of any money the failed company paid out in the 90 days prior to filing bankruptcy....to be re-distributed to the creditors (who mostly will be government/tax offices).
I got hung on that one last year. We cut-off a customer we felt was going under, they begged me to do a couple last jobs if they paid up-front. Did the job and got our $22K.....5 weeks later they folded. 2 YEARS later the federal courts came after that $22K and our lawyer told us we had no case.....had to give them that $22K!!! :angry-smiley-038:

LOL yes you are correct but I was trying to really get my point across:drink: We store all our fendors on the floor if we are on a poker run for that reason. We sometimes have 8 people on board and getting them all to move WAY up front can be a pain. I loved the way our 40' raised deck scarab was layed out, much more user friendly

[QUOTE=brian41;3113874]Donna glad to hear from you... been a long winter. As usual you are spot on with your post. QUOTE]

Now if Ian would only tell me that during an argument......

are you doing the spring run, we plan on it, I am looking forward to spending the weekend at the Toledo Yacht club, I suspect we will be there both Friday and Sat. nights.

What?????? :eek::eek:

Don't worry Donna, I'll always tell you that you are right:drink::evilb:

The courts call it preferential payments

Back when I was still selling to the auto industry I had a company I sold stampings too They were into us for $400,000 so I worked out a plan with them to pay us $25,000 a week, plus the cost of whatever we shipped that week until they were caught up. I stopped and picked up the checks every week for three weeks. On the forth week they told me that they could not pay me and that I was getting a letter about why the next week. Well the letter was about a meeting with all creditors to talk about this company getting ready for a banko. I attended the meeting and we went into negotiations (They owed 15 suppliers a total of 27 million dollars) well the company ultimately went banko. Soon I got the call from the bankruptcy court stating that they wanted the $75,000 I had collected even though they were still into us for over $300,000. I was told it was considered preferential payment and they demanded it back. We had to pay the money back to the court :(

Jason I thought that might be you, do you still have the PP, if so I hope you bring it to Lake Erie this year, seems like we have not be able to finish a run with you yet

Look it up, Boatme posted the name I couldn't remember "preferential treatment". My reaction was a little more antimated than yours!!!.......and I hope there weren't any customers in the building a the time!!!

Trust me when i heard this i was plenty animated

There is just no way to show me jumping up and down and screaming on the internet LOL

I thought that was a MI law or a state by state thing, but it also happened to a friend of mine that was in the filtration business. I know he was trying fight it because he was a distributor and he sold the goods at a very small margin and most of the money the belly up company paid him was paid to the manufacturer of the filters. I will have to ask him how it panned out because it was over $50,000.00 The reason for the law is that companies that knew they were going under would often pay friends or shell type companies where they could get a lot of the money back after the bankrupcy was completed. With so many businesses going under in MI I can imagine that a lot of companies have incurred this and probably from more than one company. I recenly left my salary and small comission job to become an independent rep, many people said I should be a reseller instead of working on comission. This is one of the reasons I will not do it. If I sell $10,000.00 worth of filters I get paid $1,000.00 if i bought and resold them, I could possibly get a bit more, but then I would be on the hook for collecting the money to pay the supplier, if my customer went belly up, it would all be on me. It's a shame really, every business buys from at least some small mom and pop shops so you wonder how they could survive when they get stuck like this.

Well it has happened Mike Mclown has lost his mind. Today I get a call from his lawyer telling me Mike wants to sue me for the interior you know the 8K-10K-12K deal. I tell his lawyer bring it on as I will counter for the work on his Chevelle, 5 years of hoist storage and an open bill on his delivery truck. He owes me but I already know that well has run dry. Anyway his lawyer and I had a good laugh and agreed there was no merit to his accusations and he would not pursue it any further. I also told him about the "Donzi gone to the moon interior" that if he also had that cases I would be on the side of the defense with about 20 other people. Seams he can not make enough money taking others boaters money and not delivering product to keep his head above water now is trying to sue everybody. He should know how it works he has been sued by most of the venders, machine shops and boaters he does business with.

TO ALL OF MIKES LAWYERS GET A BIG RETAINER MIKE HAS MENTAL AND MONEY ISSUES.

UPDATE: I know this thread has gone all over the place and there are stories coming out of the woodwork about work and pricing with McCleod but I am here to report a successful completion of services. VERY LATE, but I did get my bolster skins from Mike after much discussion and delay. It was touch and go for a while, his daughter picking up and leaving with no responce to vmail or email. Someone on this board in the town Mcleod is in offered to call or stop by the office to see what the deal was. He got Mike to call me, offer a few excuses but in the end got the work done and shipped out to me. A week long project paid in full upfront turned into a 2 month ordeal.

Anyway, thanks to all of you on OSO that had info, offered advice and assisted in getting this done. Not sure I would go as far as recomending McLeod but they did finally get this job done and they look great. In reading this thread it looks like there are quite a few open issues here, I wish everyone good luck in getting them resolved. This is the first and last time I will EVER pay for anything in full upfront. Makes me wonder what the hell I was thinking in the first place!

Now, if I could just get my local interior guy off his a** to complete the install......this BS never ends I tell you...

Glad things finally worked out for you.

Yeah Donna it's me. I most likely won't make it down to Erie on the PP till the LEOPA fall run but hope to see you and Ian on st. Clair. Do the run with us to Pepper Joes for Toms birthday run:coolcowboy:

On the "preferrential payments" thing what if you tell the bankruptcy court you simply don't have the money? In Mark's case he got $75,000, what if he simply paid all of his outstanding bills with that money?

Most small businesses don't keep 75K in their checkbook so if the money is gone could you argue A. the money was indeed a legitimate debt and B. if you are forced to repay it then it puts your company in jeopardy of bankruptcy as well!

The entire explination is to long to explain this Scott,
Unfortunatly in order to maintain running a business like we did, servicing the auto industry, it was a sticky wicket and cost less than litigation and the blackballing that can be done to a supplier in the auto industry so we did pay it back

SOme time i will share how it all worked with you over a pop or three :)

I saw this thread, Rob and I remembered that. That was pretty ****ty. Sad when you have to get a lawyer involved for something they could have done correctly so easily.