Raylar- Nothing but problems
08-03-2010, 10:03 PM
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Raylar- Nothing but problems
Yes, This is my 4th post. Yes, my past 3 were in the past week about this same topic. Yes, I have been a member for 3 years and have never posted before. O.K., now the start of my story.
Early last summer I was exploring options for adding some power to my boat (242 Baja). I ended up trying to decide between installing a used 525 Merc or doing the Raylar kit to my 496 Mag with 110 hours on it.
I did a lot of research online and could not find much information or problems with the Raylar packages. I talked to ray a few times and read all of the information on his website trying to make an informed decision. All of the marine tech's I talked to told me not to do it, and they had never heard anything good about trying to modify the 496.
The things that absolutely sticks in my mind are Ray saying that the kit is a " simple, reliable, easy to install systems that just bolt on fun and simple plug & play”.
And ". if your kit is properly installed on your engine and your engine is serviced according to the manufacturer's recommended service requirements and the engine is not abused or used in a racing or competition use then engine life will be equal to or greater than if it were still in a stock configuration"
I found both of these statements to be absolutely false. I would challenge anyone who has done a kit to come on here and say it is a bolt on "plug and play" kit.
I would also challenge anyone to explain how you could take a stock 496, increase power and compression, and take the RPM's up from 4900 to 5400 and increase the life of the engine.
I am still writing the whole story to share, but wanted to get the start of the story out there since I did give my opinion on a different thread that I would not touch anything from Raylar. My 1st motor exploded a piston with 115 hours on it, the very 1st time I took it over 5100 RPM's.
The full story is coming. The ending is either bad or very bad depending on Ray. To be fair to him, I am going to tell everything no matter what he does on the warranty of my 2nd motor that he built.
I'll start the story tomorrow from the time I decided to install the Raylar kit instead of putting in a Merc 525. (ouch)
Early last summer I was exploring options for adding some power to my boat (242 Baja). I ended up trying to decide between installing a used 525 Merc or doing the Raylar kit to my 496 Mag with 110 hours on it.
I did a lot of research online and could not find much information or problems with the Raylar packages. I talked to ray a few times and read all of the information on his website trying to make an informed decision. All of the marine tech's I talked to told me not to do it, and they had never heard anything good about trying to modify the 496.
The things that absolutely sticks in my mind are Ray saying that the kit is a " simple, reliable, easy to install systems that just bolt on fun and simple plug & play”.
And ". if your kit is properly installed on your engine and your engine is serviced according to the manufacturer's recommended service requirements and the engine is not abused or used in a racing or competition use then engine life will be equal to or greater than if it were still in a stock configuration"
I found both of these statements to be absolutely false. I would challenge anyone who has done a kit to come on here and say it is a bolt on "plug and play" kit.
I would also challenge anyone to explain how you could take a stock 496, increase power and compression, and take the RPM's up from 4900 to 5400 and increase the life of the engine.
I am still writing the whole story to share, but wanted to get the start of the story out there since I did give my opinion on a different thread that I would not touch anything from Raylar. My 1st motor exploded a piston with 115 hours on it, the very 1st time I took it over 5100 RPM's.
The full story is coming. The ending is either bad or very bad depending on Ray. To be fair to him, I am going to tell everything no matter what he does on the warranty of my 2nd motor that he built.
I'll start the story tomorrow from the time I decided to install the Raylar kit instead of putting in a Merc 525. (ouch)
08-03-2010, 10:52 PM
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Yes, This is my 4th post. Yes, my past 3 were in the past week about this same topic. Yes, I have been a member for 3 years and have never posted before. O.K., now the start of my story.
Early last summer I was exploring options for adding some power to my boat (242 Baja). I ended up trying to decide between installing a used 525 Merc or doing the Raylar kit to my 496 Mag with 110 hours on it.
I did a lot of research online and could not find much information or problems with the Raylar packages. I talked to ray a few times and read all of the information on his website trying to make an informed decision. All of the marine tech's I talked to told me not to do it, and they had never heard anything good about trying to modify the 496.
The things that absolutely sticks in my mind are Ray saying that the kit is a " simple, reliable, easy to install systems that just bolt on fun and simple plug & play”.
And ". if your kit is properly installed on your engine and your engine is serviced according to the manufacturer's recommended service requirements and the engine is not abused or used in a racing or competition use then engine life will be equal to or greater than if it were still in a stock configuration"
I found both of these statements to be absolutely false. I would challenge anyone who has done a kit to come on here and say it is a bolt on "plug and play" kit.
I would also challenge anyone to explain how you could take a stock 496, increase power and compression, and take the RPM's up from 4900 to 5400 and increase the life of the engine.
I am still writing the whole story to share, but wanted to get the start of the story out there since I did give my opinion on a different thread that I would not touch anything from Raylar. My 1st motor exploded a piston with 115 hours on it, the very 1st time I took it over 5100 RPM's.
The full story is coming. The ending is either bad or very bad depending on Ray. To be fair to him, I am going to tell everything no matter what he does on the warranty of my 2nd motor that he built.
I'll start the story tomorrow from the time I decided to install the Raylar kit instead of putting in a Merc 525. (ouch)
Early last summer I was exploring options for adding some power to my boat (242 Baja). I ended up trying to decide between installing a used 525 Merc or doing the Raylar kit to my 496 Mag with 110 hours on it.
I did a lot of research online and could not find much information or problems with the Raylar packages. I talked to ray a few times and read all of the information on his website trying to make an informed decision. All of the marine tech's I talked to told me not to do it, and they had never heard anything good about trying to modify the 496.
The things that absolutely sticks in my mind are Ray saying that the kit is a " simple, reliable, easy to install systems that just bolt on fun and simple plug & play”.
And ". if your kit is properly installed on your engine and your engine is serviced according to the manufacturer's recommended service requirements and the engine is not abused or used in a racing or competition use then engine life will be equal to or greater than if it were still in a stock configuration"
I found both of these statements to be absolutely false. I would challenge anyone who has done a kit to come on here and say it is a bolt on "plug and play" kit.
I would also challenge anyone to explain how you could take a stock 496, increase power and compression, and take the RPM's up from 4900 to 5400 and increase the life of the engine.
I am still writing the whole story to share, but wanted to get the start of the story out there since I did give my opinion on a different thread that I would not touch anything from Raylar. My 1st motor exploded a piston with 115 hours on it, the very 1st time I took it over 5100 RPM's.
The full story is coming. The ending is either bad or very bad depending on Ray. To be fair to him, I am going to tell everything no matter what he does on the warranty of my 2nd motor that he built.
I'll start the story tomorrow from the time I decided to install the Raylar kit instead of putting in a Merc 525. (ouch)
I had to modify my oil fill neck a little. The fuel system mod on the BCK-103 Kit is straight forward and pretty much assumed once you see where the kit is going.
It's only a matter of time before anyone has issues with anything if you wanna be honest. I will agree that once you sign off on modifying any engine you own it as I have and many others before and after me.
Let's take a poll on how many guys have put a Whipple on a stock 496 and blew it to shreds. Not trying to debunk you or change your opinion. Just saying there is no "trouble free" fast boat no matter how much research you do.
How long did you hold it open? How long are your wot passes typically? Have you shared your RPM history AFTER the kit was installed?
Who installed it? Did they follow all instructions? Was it a shop or done at home?
Just curious - Sorry to hear.
08-04-2010, 07:31 AM
#3
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
How many times do we read not to build
496 s and they will last along time problem
free just service them well . I have 740 hrs
on twins and they run just fine.
Trouble free motors , ( if hands are kept out of them )
496 s and they will last along time problem
free just service them well . I have 740 hrs
on twins and they run just fine.
Trouble free motors , ( if hands are kept out of them )
08-04-2010, 08:21 AM
#4
Registered
Life is tough with high perf engines. Even Mercruiser has issues with theirs. Ask the guys with 525's about their headers and ruined engines from the water ingestion. That being said, I hope Ray helps you out. He has a good reputation and probably wants to keep it that way. However, if your engine is out of the warrenty period, he is under no legal obligation to do so. Good luck.
08-04-2010, 08:28 AM
#5
Charter Member #232
Charter Member
Hawks407 it is very lame to start a thread like this and not do so with all the details. I will give you a few hours to make your case but if you don't come in and explain CLEARLY what happened to you we will have to delete the thread.
__________________
Put your best foot forward!
Put your best foot forward!
08-04-2010, 08:40 AM
#6
Banned
Yes, This is my 4th post. Yes, my past 3 were in the past week about this same topic. Yes, I have been a member for 3 years and have never posted before. O.K., now the start of my story.
Early last summer I was exploring options for adding some power to my boat (242 Baja). I ended up trying to decide between installing a used 525 Merc or doing the Raylar kit to my 496 Mag with 110 hours on it.
I did a lot of research online and could not find much information or problems with the Raylar packages. I talked to ray a few times and read all of the information on his website trying to make an informed decision. All of the marine tech's I talked to told me not to do it, and they had never heard anything good about trying to modify the 496.
The things that absolutely sticks in my mind are Ray saying that the kit is a " simple, reliable, easy to install systems that just bolt on fun and simple plug & play”.
And ". if your kit is properly installed on your engine and your engine is serviced according to the manufacturer's recommended service requirements and the engine is not abused or used in a racing or competition use then engine life will be equal to or greater than if it were still in a stock configuration"
I found both of these statements to be absolutely false. I would challenge anyone who has done a kit to come on here and say it is a bolt on "plug and play" kit.
I would also challenge anyone to explain how you could take a stock 496, increase power and compression, and take the RPM's up from 4900 to 5400 and increase the life of the engine.
I am still writing the whole story to share, but wanted to get the start of the story out there since I did give my opinion on a different thread that I would not touch anything from Raylar. My 1st motor exploded a piston with 115 hours on it, the very 1st time I took it over 5100 RPM's.
The full story is coming. The ending is either bad or very bad depending on Ray. To be fair to him, I am going to tell everything no matter what he does on the warranty of my 2nd motor that he built.
I'll start the story tomorrow from the time I decided to install the Raylar kit instead of putting in a Merc 525. (ouch)
Early last summer I was exploring options for adding some power to my boat (242 Baja). I ended up trying to decide between installing a used 525 Merc or doing the Raylar kit to my 496 Mag with 110 hours on it.
I did a lot of research online and could not find much information or problems with the Raylar packages. I talked to ray a few times and read all of the information on his website trying to make an informed decision. All of the marine tech's I talked to told me not to do it, and they had never heard anything good about trying to modify the 496.
The things that absolutely sticks in my mind are Ray saying that the kit is a " simple, reliable, easy to install systems that just bolt on fun and simple plug & play”.
And ". if your kit is properly installed on your engine and your engine is serviced according to the manufacturer's recommended service requirements and the engine is not abused or used in a racing or competition use then engine life will be equal to or greater than if it were still in a stock configuration"
I found both of these statements to be absolutely false. I would challenge anyone who has done a kit to come on here and say it is a bolt on "plug and play" kit.
I would also challenge anyone to explain how you could take a stock 496, increase power and compression, and take the RPM's up from 4900 to 5400 and increase the life of the engine.
I am still writing the whole story to share, but wanted to get the start of the story out there since I did give my opinion on a different thread that I would not touch anything from Raylar. My 1st motor exploded a piston with 115 hours on it, the very 1st time I took it over 5100 RPM's.
The full story is coming. The ending is either bad or very bad depending on Ray. To be fair to him, I am going to tell everything no matter what he does on the warranty of my 2nd motor that he built.
I'll start the story tomorrow from the time I decided to install the Raylar kit instead of putting in a Merc 525. (ouch)
08-04-2010, 08:44 AM
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08-04-2010, 10:22 AM
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I installed the Raylar 103 kit in my boat last summer. I had a local boat shop pull the motor and then had a local Mechanic install the kit. They worked together to get the motor back in the boat, and we were all there when they fired it up. As sood as it started, it idled terrible and an alarm would sound after about 30 seconds if it stayed running that long. We called Ray and he said we must have hooked a wire up wrong or done something else wrong. This was @ 10 am on Friday morning.
They both spent most of the day checking and re-checking everything on the motor. They talked with Ray multiple times with him insisting that nothing he did could have caused it. Finally after spending an hour on the phone with him at @ 7pm when we were ready to give up he suggested swapping the ecm with one off of a 496 HO. He had insisted all along that it wasn't possible that the ECM could have been the problem, it just doesn't happen.
When we put the ECM off of a new 496 HO the shop had there, it immediately fired right off and ran great. It was running very rich, but I wasn't worried about it at the time. I talked to Ray and he said to send him the ECM back and he would reprogram it again. He never offered even an apology for basically telling my guys that they had screwed something up. He also offered nothing for the additional 20+ hours of labor I had to (I wouldn't of actually had to, but I wasn't going to penalize the local guys for Ray's mistake) pay for trying to figure out what was wrong.
I was just happy to have a boat for the weekend because we had plans and I didn't want to tell the kid's we couldn't go. I did tell the boat shop owner that I would limit the operating time as much as possible since I was using his ECM off of a brand new boat and it would register the hours. He was going to overnight the ECM back to Ray and Ray was going to reprogram it and overnight it back so I had it the next weekend when we had plans again.
We took the boat out Saturday and Sunday, but basically just out to the beach and back because I wanted to keep the hours down. I never did open it up because Ray said to take it easy the first couple of hours. I loved the way it sounded . Sunday afternoon we took it back to the boat shop with the plans that they were going to change the oil, look things over, and put the ECM from Ray in when it got there Wednesday or Thursday.
When the ECM didn't show up Wednesday, I called Ray and he said that it was going out today. When it didn't show up Thursday, I called and he said it just went out and gave me the tracking number. I talked to the boat shop and begged one more evening of use on their ECM since we had planned on boating to dinner. We went out to dinner Thursday night and then Friday morning I pulled the boat out and headed to the boat shop. On the way I called Ray to ask him about the new ECM and to see if there was anything we could do about all of the soot on the back of the boat from it running so rich. He said that the new ECM wouldn't change anything, and if it was too bad we could turn the fuel pressure down a couple of PSI.
When I got to the shop they had the ECM there and we swapped it out and started it up. It ran great and was not running nearly as rich. They said it was a good thing because they were not going to lower the fuel pressure.
We put the boat in again Saturday morning and loaded it full of kids and headed to the beach. I took it easy all of the way to the beach 25 or so minutes and figured I probably had @ 4-5 hours on the motor by this time.
On the way back from the beach, I was following some friends in a different boat and decided to open it up a little and pass them. This was the first time I had a chance to open it up WOT. I was able to get up to about 4900 RPMs but I wasn't too worried about it since we had a full tank of gas, 8 people, and way too much stuff in the boat. We ran it WOT for maybe 30 seconds before the evil eye from my wife made me back off.
On sunday morning I got up early and snuck down to the boat. I had a couple of different props I had available for testing and was exited to try them out. It was a perfect morning and very quiet on the river. I idled out from the Marina to the lake then got up on plane and headed towards the main channel. When I got out there I fired up the GPS to get some true speed numbers and then opened it up. I was recording the speed and rpm's at each 500 rpm increment until 5000 and then I opened it up to see what it would do at WOT. I was running full out for about 30 seconds when the motor nuked. It was the first time that the motor had ever been above 5000 RPM's and I was at @ 5300 when it let go.
I am not a Mechanic, but I new instantly the motor was junk. It siezed up and the coolant all drained into the motor. I towed the boat back to the boat shop feeling sick.
I called Ray first thing Monday morning and told him what happened. He basically said a piston must have let go, it happens. It was a very strange and different conversation from anything we had had to this point. I asked him what he was going to do for me, and he said nothing. He said that his kit didn't do anything, it was just a bad piston that let go. I asked him about his numerous statements about how his kit's don't cause any problems, and actually make the motor stronger. He insisted that it was absolutely not his problem. I think I would have been o.k. with this if I knew the risk going in and if he had been upfront about it.
When he told me that it was just that motor's time to go, and I said that's funny that it was the first time I took it over 5000 RPM's and had never had a bit of trouble, I think he honestly felt bad.
I asked him if there was any thing he could do for me, and he offered to sell me one of his bulletproof blocks at a reduced price and rebuild the motor for me (at only 80$ an hour instead of his usual rate). I couldn't come up with another motor at this time, so unbelievably I took him up on his offer and sent my motor off to him.
He emailed me about a week later with "Your exisitng 496 short block was destroyed by the cylinder #1 piston failure!
The number one piston totally self distructed and the connecting rod and pin broke completely thru the side wall of #1 bore and the top of the connecting rod wedged up against the top of the punched out bore wall and locked the engine up and destroyed the block."
He was going to build me a brand new motor from the bottom up, with a full warranty since he was doing it all.
Engine 2 story next.
They both spent most of the day checking and re-checking everything on the motor. They talked with Ray multiple times with him insisting that nothing he did could have caused it. Finally after spending an hour on the phone with him at @ 7pm when we were ready to give up he suggested swapping the ecm with one off of a 496 HO. He had insisted all along that it wasn't possible that the ECM could have been the problem, it just doesn't happen.
When we put the ECM off of a new 496 HO the shop had there, it immediately fired right off and ran great. It was running very rich, but I wasn't worried about it at the time. I talked to Ray and he said to send him the ECM back and he would reprogram it again. He never offered even an apology for basically telling my guys that they had screwed something up. He also offered nothing for the additional 20+ hours of labor I had to (I wouldn't of actually had to, but I wasn't going to penalize the local guys for Ray's mistake) pay for trying to figure out what was wrong.
I was just happy to have a boat for the weekend because we had plans and I didn't want to tell the kid's we couldn't go. I did tell the boat shop owner that I would limit the operating time as much as possible since I was using his ECM off of a brand new boat and it would register the hours. He was going to overnight the ECM back to Ray and Ray was going to reprogram it and overnight it back so I had it the next weekend when we had plans again.
We took the boat out Saturday and Sunday, but basically just out to the beach and back because I wanted to keep the hours down. I never did open it up because Ray said to take it easy the first couple of hours. I loved the way it sounded . Sunday afternoon we took it back to the boat shop with the plans that they were going to change the oil, look things over, and put the ECM from Ray in when it got there Wednesday or Thursday.
When the ECM didn't show up Wednesday, I called Ray and he said that it was going out today. When it didn't show up Thursday, I called and he said it just went out and gave me the tracking number. I talked to the boat shop and begged one more evening of use on their ECM since we had planned on boating to dinner. We went out to dinner Thursday night and then Friday morning I pulled the boat out and headed to the boat shop. On the way I called Ray to ask him about the new ECM and to see if there was anything we could do about all of the soot on the back of the boat from it running so rich. He said that the new ECM wouldn't change anything, and if it was too bad we could turn the fuel pressure down a couple of PSI.
When I got to the shop they had the ECM there and we swapped it out and started it up. It ran great and was not running nearly as rich. They said it was a good thing because they were not going to lower the fuel pressure.
We put the boat in again Saturday morning and loaded it full of kids and headed to the beach. I took it easy all of the way to the beach 25 or so minutes and figured I probably had @ 4-5 hours on the motor by this time.
On the way back from the beach, I was following some friends in a different boat and decided to open it up a little and pass them. This was the first time I had a chance to open it up WOT. I was able to get up to about 4900 RPMs but I wasn't too worried about it since we had a full tank of gas, 8 people, and way too much stuff in the boat. We ran it WOT for maybe 30 seconds before the evil eye from my wife made me back off.
On sunday morning I got up early and snuck down to the boat. I had a couple of different props I had available for testing and was exited to try them out. It was a perfect morning and very quiet on the river. I idled out from the Marina to the lake then got up on plane and headed towards the main channel. When I got out there I fired up the GPS to get some true speed numbers and then opened it up. I was recording the speed and rpm's at each 500 rpm increment until 5000 and then I opened it up to see what it would do at WOT. I was running full out for about 30 seconds when the motor nuked. It was the first time that the motor had ever been above 5000 RPM's and I was at @ 5300 when it let go.
I am not a Mechanic, but I new instantly the motor was junk. It siezed up and the coolant all drained into the motor. I towed the boat back to the boat shop feeling sick.
I called Ray first thing Monday morning and told him what happened. He basically said a piston must have let go, it happens. It was a very strange and different conversation from anything we had had to this point. I asked him what he was going to do for me, and he said nothing. He said that his kit didn't do anything, it was just a bad piston that let go. I asked him about his numerous statements about how his kit's don't cause any problems, and actually make the motor stronger. He insisted that it was absolutely not his problem. I think I would have been o.k. with this if I knew the risk going in and if he had been upfront about it.
When he told me that it was just that motor's time to go, and I said that's funny that it was the first time I took it over 5000 RPM's and had never had a bit of trouble, I think he honestly felt bad.
I asked him if there was any thing he could do for me, and he offered to sell me one of his bulletproof blocks at a reduced price and rebuild the motor for me (at only 80$ an hour instead of his usual rate). I couldn't come up with another motor at this time, so unbelievably I took him up on his offer and sent my motor off to him.
He emailed me about a week later with "Your exisitng 496 short block was destroyed by the cylinder #1 piston failure!
The number one piston totally self distructed and the connecting rod and pin broke completely thru the side wall of #1 bore and the top of the connecting rod wedged up against the top of the punched out bore wall and locked the engine up and destroyed the block."
He was going to build me a brand new motor from the bottom up, with a full warranty since he was doing it all.
Engine 2 story next.
08-04-2010, 10:33 AM
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Sorry to hear your having troubles. You don’t say whether you installed the kit or bought a complete engine modified by Ray. From your post it appears like you did the work yourself. Yes they are bolt on kits, but you must have the proper abilities/tools for installation. As with modifying anything if it isn’t done properly it will fail. Did you check your fuel pressure and air/fuel ratio when the installation was complete? Run a 525 or ANY motor lean and it will fail in short order, but you cant blame the manufacturer for poor tuning. As with anything go-fast if you want to modify for more power you better learn how to install, tune, and maintain properly or be willing to pay someone with these skills.
I am very happy with my experiences with Raylar and the parts he sells. My boat is run at WOT for long stretches with no issues. It sucks that you had a problem and are going through a learning curve. I have been there done that with a few hotrods myself back in the day. Once you get your issues corrected you will have a great motor and I wish you the best of luck.
I am very happy with my experiences with Raylar and the parts he sells. My boat is run at WOT for long stretches with no issues. It sucks that you had a problem and are going through a learning curve. I have been there done that with a few hotrods myself back in the day. Once you get your issues corrected you will have a great motor and I wish you the best of luck.
