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-   -   Diesel-Powered 52-foot Outerlimits Hits 94 mph (https://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/general-boating-discussion/275800-diesel-powered-52-foot-outerlimits-hits-94-mph.html)

hogie roll 05-05-2012 03:11 PM


Originally Posted by 89scarabIII (Post 3679846)
Diesels are meant to be inline engine, much more reliable, cummins was a good choice lots of guys converting ford to cummins for the reliability.

The only benefit is that they are naturally balanced. Theoretically that MIGHT add up to a marginal improvement in the life of accessories due to reduced vibration. But in practice, it doesn't make a difference.

At Cat we use 90* V's instead of 60*. A 60* would be perfectly balanced in a V12 configuration. But with the 90* we can have better harmonics in V8, V16, and V20 configurations. It's a compromise.

hogie roll 05-05-2012 03:13 PM


Originally Posted by jmoore1225 (Post 3679802)
why are there not higher HP diesels for the marine world? H*ll a duramax or 6.4 powerstroke can easily put 550Hp+ to the wheels w/ just a tune?

Banks marinizes duramaxes. Bust out your wallet and build one :D

Steve 1 05-05-2012 03:17 PM


Originally Posted by Michael1 (Post 3680133)
So does a 90* V8 with a 90* crank.

I hate to say it, but this inline-6 is better than V8 is urban legend. I spoke to a Cummins engineer once, and asked him about why they use I6's instead of V8's. His response was "packaging", and slight cost reduction. There have been V8 diesel marine engines over the years by Catapillar, Cummins, and others, that ran just fine.

Michael

V8 ??? Do not make me laugh,Here you and your so called Cummins Engineer correct this then:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight-six_engine

and have them remove this :
"An inline six engine is in perfect primary and secondary mechanical balance, without the use of a balance shaft. The engine is in primary couple balance because the front and rear trio of cylinders are mirror images, and the pistons move in pairs. That is, piston #1 mirrors #6, #2 mirrors #5, and #3 mirrors #4, largely eliminating the polar rocking motion that would otherwise result. Secondary imbalance is avoided because the crankshaft has six crank throws arranged in three planes offset at 120°. The result is that the secondary forces that are caused by differences from purely sinusoidal motion sum to zero.

An inline four cylinder or V6 engine without a balance shaft will experience secondary dynamic imbalance, resulting in engine vibration. As a general rule, the forces arising from any dynamic imbalance increase as the square of the engine speed — for example, if the speed doubles, vibration will increase by a factor of four. In contrast, inline six engines have no primary or secondary imbalances, and with carefully designed crankshaft vibration dampers to absorb torsional vibration, will run more smoothly at the same crankshaft speed (rpm). This characteristic has made the straight-six popular in some European sports-luxury cars, where smooth high-speed performance is very desirable. As engine reciprocating forces increase with the cube of piston bore, straight-six is a preferred configuration for large truck engines.[6]
"

and put your V8 there instead ,with its two banks of 4 cylinders !!!! The V12 which are a pair of 6s connected at the crank are not good as well in your head.

BTW The Cummins Indy car was a straight 6 Also.

Comanche3Six 05-05-2012 04:18 PM

[

Originally Posted by Steve 1 (Post 3680152)
V8 ??? Do not make me laugh,Here you and your so called Cummins Engineer correct this then:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight-six_engine

.



That was a great read! Thanks!

hogie roll 05-05-2012 08:25 PM


Originally Posted by Steve 1 (Post 3680152)
V8 ??? Do not make me laugh,Here you and your so called Cummins Engineer correct this then:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight-six_engine

and have them remove this :
"An inline six engine is in perfect primary and secondary mechanical balance, without the use of a balance shaft. The engine is in primary couple balance because the front and rear trio of cylinders are mirror images, and the pistons move in pairs. That is, piston #1 mirrors #6, #2 mirrors #5, and #3 mirrors #4, largely eliminating the polar rocking motion that would otherwise result. Secondary imbalance is avoided because the crankshaft has six crank throws arranged in three planes offset at 120°. The result is that the secondary forces that are caused by differences from purely sinusoidal motion sum to zero.

An inline four cylinder or V6 engine without a balance shaft will experience secondary dynamic imbalance, resulting in engine vibration. As a general rule, the forces arising from any dynamic imbalance increase as the square of the engine speed — for example, if the speed doubles, vibration will increase by a factor of four. In contrast, inline six engines have no primary or secondary imbalances, and with carefully designed crankshaft vibration dampers to absorb torsional vibration, will run more smoothly at the same crankshaft speed (rpm). This characteristic has made the straight-six popular in some European sports-luxury cars, where smooth high-speed performance is very desirable. As engine reciprocating forces increase with the cube of piston bore, straight-six is a preferred configuration for large truck engines.[6]
"

and put your V8 there instead ,with its two banks of 4 cylinders !!!! The V12 which are a pair of 6s connected at the crank are not good as well in your head.

BTW The Cummins Indy car was a straight 6 Also.

A V8 only suffers from the same characteristics as a 4 cyl if it uses a flat plane 180* crank, like a ferrari. 90* crankshaft V8s are smoother than V6s and significantly smoother than I4s.

Steve 1 05-05-2012 09:17 PM


Originally Posted by korvetkeith (Post 3680278)
A V8 only suffers from the same characteristics as a 4 cyl if it uses a flat plane 180* crank, like a ferrari. 90* crankshaft V8s are smoother than V6s and significantly smoother than I4s.

Pairs of 4 bangers in a vee , then you need ; Cross plane cranks with the heavy counterweights and or external balance , No thanks , Not even in my truck , got rid of the last V8 diesel years ago , These inline 6’s do just fine even on very large Cats I am bidding now, plus they fit well !!

Michael1 05-05-2012 10:47 PM


Originally Posted by Steve 1 (Post 3680152)
V8 ??? Do not make me laugh,Here you and your so called Cummins Engineer correct this then:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight-six_engine

and have them remove this :
"An inline six engine is in perfect primary and secondary mechanical balance, without the use of a balance shaft. The engine is in primary couple balance because the front and rear trio of cylinders are mirror images, and the pistons move in pairs. That is, piston #1 mirrors #6, #2 mirrors #5, and #3 mirrors #4, largely eliminating the polar rocking motion that would otherwise result. Secondary imbalance is avoided because the crankshaft has six crank throws arranged in three planes offset at 120°. The result is that the secondary forces that are caused by differences from purely sinusoidal motion sum to zero.

An inline four cylinder or V6 engine without a balance shaft will experience secondary dynamic imbalance, resulting in engine vibration. As a general rule, the forces arising from any dynamic imbalance increase as the square of the engine speed — for example, if the speed doubles, vibration will increase by a factor of four. In contrast, inline six engines have no primary or secondary imbalances, and with carefully designed crankshaft vibration dampers to absorb torsional vibration, will run more smoothly at the same crankshaft speed (rpm). This characteristic has made the straight-six popular in some European sports-luxury cars, where smooth high-speed performance is very desirable. As engine reciprocating forces increase with the cube of piston bore, straight-six is a preferred configuration for large truck engines.[6]
"

and put your V8 there instead ,with its two banks of 4 cylinders !!!! The V12 which are a pair of 6s connected at the crank are not good as well in your head.

BTW The Cummins Indy car was a straight 6 Also.

Steve, I think you have now officially lost your mind. Keith and I are trying to explain V8 engine balance to you. Since you won't listen people who actually have designed engines for a living, then finish reading the chapter on engine balance on your own where they discuss cylinder counts above 6.

After that move on to power pulses per crank revolution.

Michael

Steve 1 05-05-2012 11:18 PM


Originally Posted by Michael1 (Post 3680355)
Steve, I think you have now officially lost your mind. Keith and I are trying to explain V8 engine balance to you. Since you won't listen people who actually have designed engines for a living, then finish reading the chapter on engine balance on your own where they discuss cylinder counts above 6.

After that move on to power pulses per crank revolution.

Michael

NO, YOU Lost your mind !! Coming in with this crap AND Miss my point by a Damn Grand Canyon ! OL I am very sorry about this drift OFF Topic here , That beautiful Boat you built and this plunge into V8's for some nonsense.

BTW Mikey1, I design and build Boats that these motors have to power, That said I have been thinking about a 38 foot inline 6 Boat with 2JZ Engines .



Let’s see firing in a V8 Cheby Crossplane ; 1 = L , 8 = R , 4 = R , 3 = L , 6 = R , 5 = L , 7 = L , 2 = R
Firing LRRLRLLR Banks , there is your sound now ,a flat plane like a Ferrari they alternate banks.

Mikey1, I have the solution to your power pulse Problem , How about a V8 Two stroke diesel ??





==

hogie roll 05-05-2012 11:58 PM


Originally Posted by Steve 1 (Post 3680365)
NO, YOU Lost your mind !! Coming in with this crap AND Miss my point by a Damn Grand Canyon ! OL I am very sorry about this drift OFF Topic here , That beautiful Boat you built and this plunge into V8's for some nonsense.

BTW Mikey1, I design and build Boats that these motors have to power, That said I have been thinking about a 38 foot inline 6 Boat with 2JZ Engines .



Let’s see firing in a V8 Cheby Crossplane ; 1 = L , 8 = R , 4 = R , 3 = L , 6 = R , 5 = L , 7 = L , 2 = R
Firing LRRLRLLR Banks , there is your sound now ,a flat plane like a Ferrari they alternate banks.

Mikey1, I have the solution to your power pulse Problem , How about a V8 Two stroke diesel ??





==

2JZGTE's and Cummins QSB's are good motors. If I had a choice I'd take a duramax or scorpion over the Cummins though.

Matt Trulio 05-06-2012 01:30 PM


Originally Posted by Dean Ferry (Post 3679853)
Impressive!

Matt, do you know the displacement weight?
Thanks,
Dean

According to Mike Fiore, the 52 SL weighs 15,000 pounds, dry.


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