advice on boat 35-45 boat purchase ?
 

I am looking for some sound advice on purchasing a boat.
I have been researching for a couple years, watching the market and trying to get ride time in also. I have researched the history and tried to absorb as much as possible to narrow my search.
I have narrowed down to Active Thunder, Sonic, Black Thunder, Fountain, Scarab, and Cigarette. I would like to try to stay in the 38-45 foot range. This seems to fill the bill for me. But some of the Sonics have impressed me.
What I have found is the Cigarette being old models from 86-93. The Fountains and Scarabs from 87-98. Sonic, Active Thunder and Black Thunder 93-98. I did find a 38 hustler slingshot but it is going to be a stretch to buy. Most are around 38-40 foot. A couple in the 42-45, mostly Scarab and Fountain.
What I have found is; Active Thunder, Black Thunder, and Sonic seems to be the better buy. I could be wrong, but this why I am here. I will be cruising mostly, a couple pokers runs, and nothing too crazy. I live in Kentucky, but might head to Florida for pokers runs. Maybe to relocate also.
I do apologize for being long winded, I am just trying to be thorough. Any help would be much appreciated.

Fountain or formula would be my call. Formula more creature comforts. Fountain more speed. Both great boats. I know you didn't list formula was just throwing it out there. I would also add cig even though they are generally pricy in comparison but nice boats.

I looked at some formulas, but did not strike me. The formulas I have found seemed pricey compared to other boats makers that are larger and more to offer. But this is a ever changing market so who knows what will come up for sale tomorrow. I love a hustler but only found one 38 close to my price range and I am reaching, lol.

I've got a 2003 hustler KE LIMITED (one piece hull) Talon 377 with KE 900 HP motors, bam transmissions, merc 6 dry sump outdrives. Will let it go for $124,000, maybe less... 174 hrs on boat and drive train. PM me for pics and videos if interested.

I did find that scarab and fountain did not make their own hulls after 93 ? If so, who made their hulls for them ? are these hulls good still ? I also was reading active thunder, black thunder and sonic were well made, and with high quality components ?
I am new to the boat world and do not have as much knowledge like the people on here. I am finding there are smaller boat makers that make nice if not nicer boats then fountain, scarab, and cigarette. If so, it would only make sense to buy the smaller production higher quality boat over a name brand boat with lower quality. I am just trying to get help and knowledge to make a wise solid investment in a nice boat.
As with any industry good people move around and start new companies or go to work for another business. So I am open to suggestions and to gain more knowledge in the performance boat industry.

All of fountain hulls were made in fountain plant by Reggie and company until he went bankrupt. They are not in production right now but no reason to be a deterrent unless you wanted new with a factory warranty. Your talking mid nineties so no warranty there anyhow. Wellcraft sold to genmar at some point. Not sure of details. They discontinued the scarab as a go fast and made it just a center console fisher. Both are very good hulls that produce speed. Both have held world record speed numbers at some point in the 80s and 90s. Solid boats.

I researched like you, 12 years ago, decided on Sonic for cabin size and ride (call me old school but I love the arch too)Top speed
was not my main concern, getting wherever I am going quickly and safely and having a nice place to crash at days end were (are) my concerns. Spent up to 5 days on it. Still have the boat and still very happy with it.
People who own larger boats have ridden on it and been very impressed with ride quality.
I've ridden on other boats and can't believe the difference in ride. When it gets rough you will be able to keep up with larger faster boats. IMO they are also undervalued compared to other brands, you get a lot of boat for the money. Food for thought not chest thumping or flaming anyone else's brand.

Cool, thanks ICU. I have found a couple fountains; two 47's and a 42 for stellar deals. I also found a 43 scarab for steal also. I know cigs are nice and found a couple late 80's 38s and 42s but more in cost. Hustlers are wicked but Hustlers are usually out of my price range.
I was leaning on the 47 fountains and the 42. Before I shell out that amount I wanted to make sure these were the good years (I assumed but not good to assume) and not the declining years were quality goes downhill. Also, I did not want to rule out any other boats like Sonic, Active Thunder, or Black Thunder since I have come across a few that seem like a good deal.
ICU, I will keep my eyes peeled for a Formula also. Thanks again for the help

That is what I have been finding on the Sonics. A really big bang for the buck. I tend to really research more then the average bear. I have found some Sonic 38-42's and I am really impressed, especially for the price. Thanks for the help.
I am on the same page with you about concerns. So I decided to ask the people here for help and input. Especially before paying for the boat. Thanks sonic it most definitely helps me.

Rtc make sure you get on every model you are considering. Walk around it, get in te cabin. Fountain had a straight hull then a single step then a double all good boats. However fountain isn't the roomiest boat out there. They are quality and built for high speed. Many others give more room and creature comforts. Researching on the net is good for market prices but make sure you find some close to et on board and ride in. Get a feel for. Even though all brands listed are high performance and will go fast they all do different things well. You'll find some who will say "so and so" is best boat hands down. In reality we all have different boating needs and things we want on our boats.

Of all the brands you mentioned scarab, fountain and sonic I have heard nothing negative about consistently. The others at, bt and hustler I've heard of but no nothing about.

Others will chime in with more info but most will agree to go actually et on some that will narrow your list down, then sea trial and you will narrow your list even more.

If your main concern is overnighting and nice ride, and you can afford the fuel, then a Black Thunder can't be beat... It takes a ton of power to push average speeds but my god the room in those boats is unreal. You have quite a variety of boats listed, everywhere from low and fast to big and comfy.

Of the boats you listed I'm assuming your budget is in the 50k range +/- 10K??

If I was spending MY money I'd be going the CIGARETTE route. The Top Gun's of that era are at the bottom of their depreciation curve, have a decent cabin with wrap around seating, enclose head, cooler and sink and v-berth bed. My wife and I stay on our Cafe a number of times a year (at least we did before the little one was born). It probbaly has the LEAST headroom of all the boats you've listed.

My second choice there would probably be formula.

Black Thunders have huge cabins, but the looks aren't for me.

Fountains will be marginally faster than the others, but again the looks aren't for me.

To me, the Sonics are probably a nice compromise between good astethics, and quite useable cabin.

I wasn't aware that AT made any boats old enough to be in your budget (unless I've mis-guessed your budget)

The hustler's have less freeboard. Nice looking boats, but less freeboard, for what it's worth.

I have been boating since I was 6. Outboards, inboards, and I/O or outdrive. Present stable is listed below my avatar.

Without fail, my advice to you is to do this:

1) Do NOT be in a hurry.
2) Join a local boat club if they will let you or at least hang around and go to their meetings so you can meet members, buy them gas and beer, and go for as many test rides as you can. They will expose you to boats for sale and have an interest in not screwing you since you will be hanging around.
3) Get to know the area marine mechanics. Visit them. Absolutely vital. Ask at boat club meetings about their successes and failures. You can get a good used boat at a great price and spend some more at a good mechanic to be sure its going to run well and be reliable. Remember, its not important that they run fast, its important that they run.
4) Do NOT fail to get a survey and a mechanical check before you buy anything. Money well spent even if you have to do it several times. Remember, engine/oudrive repairs and replacements are your biggest source of expensive trouble. Better to buy an original factory setup with no major repairs and 300 hours than "only 25 hrs just rebuilt!!!" hurriedly by some no name shop just to get the boat to market.
5) Do NOT be in a hurry. All the boats discussed are good. Get the one you like. I have personally ridden in several different Formula, Sonic, Baja, Fountain, Black Thunder, Scarab, Warlock, Sea Ray, Cobalt, Marlago. All major names are good. There are some fine deals out there in this economy if you take the time. :)

You need to match your boat to your needs. If you are looking for speed and a smaller cabin, Fountain great handling. Cigarette, iconic brand, great lines and one of the best rough water rides, how rough does it get in Ky, you did say maybe Fl. Cig, no boat holds its resale value, but Cig, is one of the best at that. Black Thunder, my friend has one, we call it the floating condo. Tons of cabins space and aminities, its a pain to trailer because its so big. One of the brands you mentioned that has most of these qualities is the Active Thunder, decent cabin space...not huge, great ride, doesnt take tons of power to push it, great lines, and the Manufacture is still in business. Pat builds a great boat, hence the following affectionately called the "cult" they are active on this board and can answer any questions you may have about the boat. Sydwayz is on the board and works with A/T and would help as well.
My last piece of advice. Dont buy what you can afford to operate, buy what you can afford to fix.
They all break at some point. Its part of boating, fuel will probably be your cheapest expense.
Good luck.

Awesome, thanks for the info. This is what I really have come to enjoy about the boating world. Everyone is real cool, helpful and always fun to hang with. For a couple years I have been making local connections, cruising and actually wrenching on the boats with a good tech to learn the ropes. I am trying to find more people in the Louisville area to get first hand experience on other boats I have listed.
I have been taking time and using the economy to my advantage to find the best deal. I listed those boats since some I do know the quality and some I do not. But all of them I have found are good deals and in my budget. I had prior knowledge of fountain and cigarette. But I had to dig up info on sonic and black thunder. These are the boats that have appealed to me from astethics, engines I am well versed in, and cabin comforts including a/c.
The Scarab I will probably scratch since I only found one and I feel so so about. I really like the Sonics and the Black Thunder for the room and bang for the buck. The Cigarettes are nice also, just not as many. Though I found a super clean 38 cig and smoking deal on. The Fountains are more abundant so there are more deals. But I do get that small quarters feel from the 38's, not on the 47's and 42.
I have time, I am just starting to get really serious. I still have to get more ride time so I can truly feel and make the final call on which best suites me. With you guys helping, it makes it a lot easier since you have way more experience on then me.
Thank you again for the help.

I like that, buy what you can afford to fix. I have been learning that last year or so since I started wrenching on them. that is why I am staying in the cash price range. No payment and money left over to set aside for repairs. After being in the auto industry for 20 years I most definitely agree, they do all break at some point.

Boats break everytime u run them, very harsh enviroment.

RTC- Whatever you do I would avoid a triple engine boat. They are a lot more headaches. Having the third engine increases the chances of mechanical failure by more than just a 1/3 factor. It also increases the maintenance headaches.

The posts above are giving you good info, you really need to get onboard some boats and figure out how much cabin room, etc you want.

Good luck, and remember advice on OSO is free and worth every penny!

Wannabe

Give us more info on how you plan to boat?

Family/kids?
Will you get the itch to go really fast
Tow vehicle
Swim
Party
Overnight on the boat
Budget

Very smart to buy cash and have money ready to fix it cause they all break

I am avoiding the triples for just that factor. I do know from wrenching the cost factor is why I am trying to stay away. But three big blocks, they sound so beautiful. Plus the price is so cheap for that 47 and 42 hard to say no, lol. But I keep adding up motor costs so I keep passing the triples up.
I got spoiled riding in that 50 hustler. So I am trying to downsize into my price range, lol. For size and comfort, that is why I like the black thunder, sonic, cigarette and scarab. The fountain seems more closed quarters for me.
I have time, plus with the economy I am sure I will get one to fit my bill. I keep finding some real good deals. I am trying to keep a decent amount money set back for upgrades. So when it breaks I can upgrade to the nicer newer model of whatever breaks, lol.

There is always a party when boats are involved, lol. Fast yes. No family. party yes. crash on the boat definitely, yes. budget is a secret, lol.
As far as a tow rig I have Cummins 12 valve that I have tuned up. It is a monster. I pulled a 45 cabin cruiser and never felt it behind me.

Hey Darr,

How have you been?

RTC74

pm me if interested. Have 97 sonic 35ss. My personal boat. For sale. Very reasonable.

NO ARCH.

I appreciate all the help and advice on my boat search. I think Cigarette Top Gun is going to be my choice. I plan to visit and possibly relocate to Florida. That is what helped me to decide all with other factors. Cigarette is a awesome well built boat and best in rough waters compared to my other choices. After reading more info, it the best choice for me. I like the mid to late eighties models best.
If I had more cash I would purchase the boat that I have wanted since I was a kid. Apache 41 or 47. Seeing Bob Saccenti and Ben Kramer flying through the air was a awesome sight. But I do not have that kind of cash to spend now. Besides they are hard to come by.
Thanks again and hopefully I will see you out on the water this summer.

The post 1990's cabin in the TG is better in most people's opinion (with the built in sink, table, wrap around couch, etc...)

Good Luck in your search.

:party-smiley-004::poopoo:

:popcorn:

Can't believe it took three pages! Lol

price could be anywhere between 20,000 and 200,000 hard to help if pricing is a secret....

:funnypost::ban:

I had questioned this guy last week when he was posting on 3-4 different threads and saying he was sold on different boats in each thread at the same time. I called him out and he went away.

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ns-please.html

Maybe I'm being a little judgmental but doesn't this thread sound similar to that linked above ?

Its so tough because we all want to help each other out but its annoying if it Darr or anyone thats just messing around. Then we don't know if calling them out scared them away cause its really Darr or some Jackwagon or they think we are A-holes for treating them bad?

At least he didn't say "price range-secert"

This guy started a thread in the at section kinda sucking up to them with the whole at's are awesome blah, blah, blah... I found it kind of odd because it was the same day that pat had invited someone down to be his personal gust at the Miami boat show that kind of had a similar thread started. He said he was looking at two boats and want a suggestion of a surveyor, i suggested to him to pick a boat then find a surveyor in the area to look at it. He then jumps all over me saying all kinds of random stuff that didn't make sense. Seemed like he had a angle on the thread to me... The thread was closed by mods for some reason.