The adventure of my tub is now over
07-22-2002, 06:15 PM
#31
Toxic FORMULA
Platinum Member
Take a weekend or two off. Enjoy yourself
Remember that old saying "Quitters never win and winners never quit" Stand back take a couple of deep breaths and give it hell again. Your too close to stop now. I know I sound like a cheerleader but remember the tougher the fight ,the sweeter the victory.And above all , if you do give up till next spring (which you won't , right ?) for God sake don't forget to winterize it.
Check with the engine builder...cry on his shoulder a little...can't hurt
A friend of mine is in the engine building business and he's given people breaks in the past. He also sez the last time he walked on water it was frozen...In other words he can make a mistake too! He's doing a pair of 540's for me but they WILL be dynoed before they go in the boat.
Hang in there there's still three months of boating left one the Delaware
Remember that old saying "Quitters never win and winners never quit" Stand back take a couple of deep breaths and give it hell again. Your too close to stop now. I know I sound like a cheerleader but remember the tougher the fight ,the sweeter the victory.And above all , if you do give up till next spring (which you won't , right ?) for God sake don't forget to winterize it. Check with the engine builder...cry on his shoulder a little...can't hurt
A friend of mine is in the engine building business and he's given people breaks in the past. He also sez the last time he walked on water it was frozen...In other words he can make a mistake too! He's doing a pair of 540's for me but they WILL be dynoed before they go in the boat.
Hang in there there's still three months of boating left one the Delaware
07-22-2002, 06:56 PM
#32
Team Dysfunctional
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I feel for you. I spent 2 years working on my boat and have a total of two hours running time each season. Last year I blew the bottom end . and this year after having the motor professionally built I got water in the oil after only two hours running time . And to top it off the I didn't get anyway near the speeds out of the boat that I expected. What are you going to do . am I angry ....No . Just disappointed. Its a boat and they are all head aches. Don't let it take over your life. if you need to, take a break from it and take your time working on it over the winter. I hope I will still have some time to enjoy it this season when it is fixed so I will make the best out of it. In the mean time I just sit at home board out of my mind waiting for it to be fixed. I think I will be looking forward to winterizing it knowing that I will be able to start running first thing next season. There's always next year.
07-22-2002, 07:11 PM
#33
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Hey Jason -
The NJPPC Philadelphia Poker Run is the weekend after next (August 3). Hop a ride with somebody, and we'll help you drown your sorrows at the post-run party on Saturday night. Chances are you'll also meet some poeple who can help you out.
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07-22-2002, 07:30 PM
#34
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Jay,
Take some time off. Maybe a week or two. Then get someone new to look at it. The engine builder would be the first place to start, or find a GOOD technician to come and look at it. You need some new blood in the engine compartment, someone with a fresh outlook on this situation ! Dont give up !! I just finished almost the same job as you this weekend and it was a great feeling to get out on the water. It did not go smooth! I took my twin 330's apart, ported the heads, replaced the cam, intakes, lifters, valve springs, & rejetted the carbs. I've worked at a Ford dealership and Ford motors for 17 years and when I installed the cams I did just what Boot did. I installed the timing chains as you do on a Ford motor. WRONG ! Motors started & ran like crap & bent all the intake valves. Pulled the heads again & replaced all intake valves and head gaskets again. Splashed the boat for the first time and on my first wide open pass I lost all oil pressure in one motor and it started to knock. Went back home pulled the motor out it , it had some type of oil pump failure. Replaced pump, had crank turned .010 under replaced 2 rods, resized others, bought another new cam, the old one had bearing material ground in it, Crane must love me, 3 cams so far this summer, sent the block out to be cleaned & checked. Reassembled it, put it back in the boat, and yesterday I cruised around Lake George all day. It was a great feeling. You have that to look foreward to. I started this project the last week in April and worked on it weekends and after work on weekdays, sometimes until 2:00 in the morning, for almost 3 months, so I know what your feeling. Don't give up. Take a break, enjoy some of the summer, then go back after it. I felt like quitting a few times also, but now I'm glad I didn't. Thank god I have an understanding wife ! If I can help give me your e mail address and I'll send you my phone number & we can talk.
Bo
Take some time off. Maybe a week or two. Then get someone new to look at it. The engine builder would be the first place to start, or find a GOOD technician to come and look at it. You need some new blood in the engine compartment, someone with a fresh outlook on this situation ! Dont give up !! I just finished almost the same job as you this weekend and it was a great feeling to get out on the water. It did not go smooth! I took my twin 330's apart, ported the heads, replaced the cam, intakes, lifters, valve springs, & rejetted the carbs. I've worked at a Ford dealership and Ford motors for 17 years and when I installed the cams I did just what Boot did. I installed the timing chains as you do on a Ford motor. WRONG ! Motors started & ran like crap & bent all the intake valves. Pulled the heads again & replaced all intake valves and head gaskets again. Splashed the boat for the first time and on my first wide open pass I lost all oil pressure in one motor and it started to knock. Went back home pulled the motor out it , it had some type of oil pump failure. Replaced pump, had crank turned .010 under replaced 2 rods, resized others, bought another new cam, the old one had bearing material ground in it, Crane must love me, 3 cams so far this summer, sent the block out to be cleaned & checked. Reassembled it, put it back in the boat, and yesterday I cruised around Lake George all day. It was a great feeling. You have that to look foreward to. I started this project the last week in April and worked on it weekends and after work on weekdays, sometimes until 2:00 in the morning, for almost 3 months, so I know what your feeling. Don't give up. Take a break, enjoy some of the summer, then go back after it. I felt like quitting a few times also, but now I'm glad I didn't. Thank god I have an understanding wife ! If I can help give me your e mail address and I'll send you my phone number & we can talk.
Bo
07-22-2002, 08:41 PM
#35
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Hey Jay... I have been following your progress little by little over the months.. All the stuff you post and the pics were great, everything was coming together.. I have been in your spot a few times.. Whatever don't give up, I have always found if you take a week or two off from working on the boat, you come back with a clear mind and a mission to finish.. It takes time to reach perfection, so don't rush, just do it right... The first time you get her done and in the water its all worth it.. maybe a little tear from your eye in happiness.
Look at me I have $300 to my name, a **** truck and live at home... But i do have a nice little boat that makes lotta noise I work on it every week to keep it running, a few weeks ago it was a broke piston, a couple weeks before that it was a oil pressure problem, weeks before that it wouldn't start... and this week I am putting a new oil cooler on and fixing a few other things... to own a boat you have to realize that it takes hard work and time to maintain them... Your doing great in my book, just take a break and come back to the boat in a week or two.. a few days back and you will hear that rumble of twin big blocks... 
Good luck
Travis
Look at me I have $300 to my name, a **** truck and live at home... But i do have a nice little boat that makes lotta noise
I work on it every week to keep it running, a few weeks ago it was a broke piston, a couple weeks before that it was a oil pressure problem, weeks before that it wouldn't start... and this week I am putting a new oil cooler on and fixing a few other things... to own a boat you have to realize that it takes hard work and time to maintain them... Your doing great in my book, just take a break and come back to the boat in a week or two.. a few days back and you will hear that rumble of twin big blocks... Good luck
Travis
07-22-2002, 11:50 PM
#36
Charter Member #232
Charter Member
Not sure if anyone has said this, but maybe you need to shim the starter. Also MAKE SURE your starters are Marine!!!! DO NOT go with automotive ones or your engines not starting could be your last worrie. Hang in there bro. Take a break and go back at it when you and your wife are ready.
Jon
Jon
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07-23-2002, 12:33 AM
#37
Charter Member #232
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AFTER you take some time if you want to head up this way I would be happy to help ya get this sucker running. I have what ya need to get the motor out of the boat and also run it on the floor. Let me know. We can have the engines out of the boat quick and get them right back in. If you can get up this way so that we can have Friday to get the engine and two starters out then I can get them rebuilt for you for SUPER cheap. Your starters are not your proble. I also have lots of wire and such laying around. If you want to test the starter that continues to turn over then pull the smaller wire off the starter and see if it continues to do this. I have seen this happen before when the Plug going onto the engine melted or broke down and caused a short.
Jon
Jon
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07-23-2002, 01:12 AM
#38
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Jay-
You can't keep stealin all my bad luck!
This sounds like a timing problem- very likely your cams are not timed right or there is a mistake in the ignition sequence/timing.
The other thing that comes to mind is worn cam lobe(s)One symptom of a bad exhaust lobe is sputter/burping out the carb.
Ya gotta have Compression, proper valve operation, spark, and fuel. And Timing. The best approach at this point is to check for all and assume nothing. The first group of tests you can perform cost little (except $2.00 worth of hardware) and will tell you a lot.
*****************compression****************
A)- Remove all spark plugs from motor. Do a compression test and log all cylinder pressures. Disconnect ignition and go Wide open throttle while doing this.
B)- If compression is low on any cylinder, rotate crankshaft clockwise from front and watch intake rocker untill it closes. continue to rotate until both intake and exhaust are fully closed. Careful, because the next step will shove the piston to BDC.
C)- Pressurize the cylinder with about 150 lbs air using a compression tester hose. Snap-on makes a hose that can be used to do this. It has a schrader valve that must be removed first. Check for air coming out of exhaust or intake. Either one means that valve is bent or stuck. You can also make one with a pipe nipple, gutted spark plug body and a brazing rig.
***************** valve operation*******************
A) Rotate crankshaft and look for rockers that are not opening fully. If you have a bad cam lobe, the adjustment will be waaayyy loose. If you find one, adjust it and check for lift. If the lift is still not good, its cam time.
B) Look at pushrods, etc, and just look the valvetrain over REAL good.
******************ignition*******************
A) The third element is ignition. Make sure you have strong spark at the plugs. If there is any doubt, I would also try to locate an HEI system just to compare. Also, it is very easy to load up new plugs, so be prepared to clean them.
*********************timing***********************
A) All the stuff has to happen at the right time. I would review all timing related items such as cam and ignition timing. I have installed distributors 180 out, and it makes a racket.
********************fuel***********************
A) Fuel problems can be checked for by dumping some gas down the intake.
If none of this yields anything, I would pull the intake manifold and check lifters, cam, etc on a component basis. Remove the Rocker arms and check the cylinders for leakage again.
You can't keep stealin all my bad luck!
This sounds like a timing problem- very likely your cams are not timed right or there is a mistake in the ignition sequence/timing.
The other thing that comes to mind is worn cam lobe(s)One symptom of a bad exhaust lobe is sputter/burping out the carb.
Ya gotta have Compression, proper valve operation, spark, and fuel. And Timing. The best approach at this point is to check for all and assume nothing. The first group of tests you can perform cost little (except $2.00 worth of hardware) and will tell you a lot.
*****************compression****************
A)- Remove all spark plugs from motor. Do a compression test and log all cylinder pressures. Disconnect ignition and go Wide open throttle while doing this.
B)- If compression is low on any cylinder, rotate crankshaft clockwise from front and watch intake rocker untill it closes. continue to rotate until both intake and exhaust are fully closed. Careful, because the next step will shove the piston to BDC.
C)- Pressurize the cylinder with about 150 lbs air using a compression tester hose. Snap-on makes a hose that can be used to do this. It has a schrader valve that must be removed first. Check for air coming out of exhaust or intake. Either one means that valve is bent or stuck. You can also make one with a pipe nipple, gutted spark plug body and a brazing rig.
***************** valve operation*******************
A) Rotate crankshaft and look for rockers that are not opening fully. If you have a bad cam lobe, the adjustment will be waaayyy loose. If you find one, adjust it and check for lift. If the lift is still not good, its cam time.
B) Look at pushrods, etc, and just look the valvetrain over REAL good.
******************ignition*******************
A) The third element is ignition. Make sure you have strong spark at the plugs. If there is any doubt, I would also try to locate an HEI system just to compare. Also, it is very easy to load up new plugs, so be prepared to clean them.
*********************timing***********************
A) All the stuff has to happen at the right time. I would review all timing related items such as cam and ignition timing. I have installed distributors 180 out, and it makes a racket.
********************fuel***********************
A) Fuel problems can be checked for by dumping some gas down the intake.
If none of this yields anything, I would pull the intake manifold and check lifters, cam, etc on a component basis. Remove the Rocker arms and check the cylinders for leakage again.
Last edited by Bulldog; 07-23-2002 at 01:15 AM.
07-23-2002, 01:56 AM
#40
VIP Member
Platinum Member
lots of good advice here I would take a week off for sure
those starters are easy to have rebuilt by a shop and u can
ask them to put heavy duty parts in the windings are a little heavier but will produce more torque
I usually rebuilt my own starters and alternators
also like someone said check the gauge and condition of all the
starting & batt cable's you want good current flow to the starter
also never crank a starter for more than 10-20 sec without giving
it a 2 minutes to cool down some.
like some people said this may not be the reason u cant start them but it does sound like those starters have been taking a beating
ps Im getting a little afraid now to do the big block bravo conversion on my 25' cause I have a very bad temper
I live about 4 hours away if u need a hand
those starters are easy to have rebuilt by a shop and u can
ask them to put heavy duty parts in the windings are a little heavier but will produce more torque
I usually rebuilt my own starters and alternators
also like someone said check the gauge and condition of all the
starting & batt cable's you want good current flow to the starter
also never crank a starter for more than 10-20 sec without giving
it a 2 minutes to cool down some.
like some people said this may not be the reason u cant start them but it does sound like those starters have been taking a beating
ps Im getting a little afraid now to do the big block bravo conversion on my 25' cause I have a very bad temper
I live about 4 hours away if u need a hand
