Rik (arneson)
 

Stupid question man, but for the life of me I wish someone could explain why no manufacturers will go with arneson's right from the start .... ? Can't they just buy Merc motors & junk the bravos & XR 's . I wish they would get together & start doing that . If RF is listening & they started doing that I bet they would sell even more boats , or greedy Merc would cut you guys at arneson a deal & together make a reliable brutal engine/ drive package that would be close to perfect . You guys are giants in the industry & with great American products , if that ever comes to the table it would be the one of the best things to ever happen in offshore power boating . Perhaps a stupid question like I said & bigger than deserving a reply ? But I think it would be hard to deny that it would sell a lot of boats & who wouldn't love a package like that

Works well for me on my 50 Nor Tech with trip Yanmar diesels and Arneson ASD 8's. Almost 700 hrs now and never a drive failure. Very reliable package.

Bob

Luv hearing them kinda hours pushing that 50 footer with the torque of the diesels & 700 hundred hours and no problems . Thanks Bob the builder & best of luck with the ASD 8's

700hrs and never a failure is something not commonly heard in the boating industry......

Change your location u wannabe Canuck.:lolhit: Also, guys with psi blowers never hear of lots of hours against 6s:coolcowboy:

Rik is a great guy and could give a much better answer but my guess


Mercury PACKAGES engines and drives, so they can FORCE the manufacture to buy 2 Products instead of one. Then they make even MORE money selling parts when the products break. Can't blame them.

We all can agree Arneson drives are Amazing. There are a TON of boats running them, we just don't hear about them much because the owners are ON THE WATER enjoying boating, not broke down with the Bravo Blues typing on OSO trying to figure out a way to Jigger Rig a better drive setup.

Look at all the Go Fast Yachts across the world, its INSANE how big and fast these boats are, all with Arnesons, not with Mercury 6 or 8s. I think a lot of people forget about these type of boats. Plus European offshore powerboats are MAJORITY Arneson. Europe obviously knows more then America, they have Go Fast Diesel boats (still have no clue why we don't) and the Majority of European cars are DIESEL!!!! We all Know Diesel vehicles get more fuel economy, last longer, and burn cleaner.

Thanks Bob for sharing your amazing results! I talked to Wild Trips 50' Hustler during Boyne Thunder Poker Run and he also has ZERO problems with his Triple Arnesons behind 800hp N/A big blocks!

- in Europe you will not find lot of speed boats. They are there, but not common. You will never find 100 performance boats in the same time in Adriatic for example. Far away from this number!
- Lot of them have Arneson drives, it is true.
- please do not mix cars with boats. When driving your car you have lot of acelerations and there is diesel much better than gasoline engine. But in boats you have almost always constant throtle and there diesel los lot of advantages against gassoline. It have better fuell efficinecy if you look only power, but they are much heawyer than good gassoline engines. Only in compare with few decades old technologie on american bigg blocks (Sorry, but true.) it is diesel competitive device. Engine market it is more or less closed market and you have two or perhaps thre wery strong players and this fact kill all reall progress on engines. It is pretty and bad for all boating industry, that there is not oppen competition like on cars industry.
Good gassoline engine it is much lighter than the best diesel with same power and this lightenes bring advantage to gassoline in boating. On the end you have better mileage with good gassoline than with diesel, if you install them in good boat. Airplanes are good advice what to do (They must be light and effective,). Only 200 km from my home it is probably the best producer of small one propeller aircrafts in the world and they use only good gassoline engines. Diesel engines are to heavy on this moment and on good boats it is the same.
- when you made fuell compare diesel with gassoline, you must compare pound/pound and not gallon/gallon!

i have the 39 nor tech double yanmar anytime u wanna sell your boat please message me thanx
tolga

Good replys guys & don't get me wrong or take it wrong , we know any of the ( Number Drives ) from Mec are proven and hold up strong , just as here for example all the posts about the Bravos & XR 's are only a matter of time before failure for offshore high horsepower performance boats . And there is other good drives out there as we all know . ( Kinda sucks to think as smart as we are & most of ya are a lot smarter then me ) but if this dummy and thAts me can figure out its unacceptable to have to hear about how gentle ya gotta take off or don't get the throttle just right for prop bite on re-entry & a racing throttle mans perfect RPM is necessary or its gonna be a drive catastrophy much sooner than later & buy whatever motor you want from the factory as long as its Merc .... Yea yea ... possibly now Illmor & that's a good start in a good direction for us . BUT WE NEED MORE CHOICES & why wouldnt the factory want it also ( let em compete for warrantees & we win again ) they do too with more sales . Fully aware its big business & Merc is the top dog , we don't have much choice , but do we ? Imagine if we stuck together ( why not ) were all here together on OSO , we could change the market . I'm mainly just trying not to compare as stated by others ( cars to boats , ) & i domt want to hear it either so i will make it quick & painless so here goes .... were sorta stuck with Merc for the most part from the factory end right from the get . Deep pockets or not we all have the sport in our veins , and the monopoly is just sending us all the way of the farmer & the current state of the country . Quite a few of us & our parents and grandparents stuck to the Chevys , Fords , Chrysler ...... And when the inevitable happened the foreign company's changed it all and is still forcing us to change but , at least we have choices & we don't all drive ferrari's & Hummers . I just can't figure out why we don't change it & that can be done & only we would benefit and one monolopy wouldn't , the boat manufactures should all still be able to improve on all our favorite brands & again we all win . Listen to how we all joke and kid here about our favorites , we love the sport & in end love em all from Apache to Wellcraft , but given no choice but one or two boat brands to choose from we would really have something to ***** about then huh . So we might not be able to change the cooperate farms overnight giving us factory food water & air , not to mention the price of ga$ , but as a small group of powerboaters who love the sport .... I bet when things start to pick up hopefully sooner than later & factory's start coming instead of going , we could change a whole lot real quick with our buying power over the almighty cooperate giant . I directed this at Rik ( don't know him or have any affiliation with him or Arneson what so ever ) because he cuts through the sales bull and states facts , he has proven time and again about the cost of ASD's and who can argue the reliability compared to the bravo or XR , again the Merc number drives are proven also but not cheaper & they come with the (PACKAGE ) were for the majority stuck with . By far the majority of us run Merc power & for the most part we all gotta admit dam reliable , great motors . If the reliability lasted as long as a Bravo or XR I think we wouldn't as a whole accept that for very long . Like I said at the beginning for once I might really be asking THE stupid question ? But if factory's weren't monopolized by Merc & followed for example lets say Illmor who are now giving us a choice or imagine a choice of an ASD & a #6 drive with a factory Merc power package straight from the factory . The manufactures make their boats better & compete and we have choices that benefit us as well as them as far as boats & if motors & especially drives followed , we all win man . We're a little group as a whole and where & how we spend our big money could be done easy and by forcing that , we get choices . And think how happy thread highjackers can be then with more choices to senselessly bash the hell outta each other . So have at men , but before we do that let's think about sticking together and forcing a change before we fight like brothers usually do . If we don't we are stuck & it's going to be funny to hear the fights starting about the paint on your boat because all the motor and drive packages will all be from the same team of corporate fat cats . Lets bring some choices back , they are taking more & more everyday & pieces of America with it . Off my soap box now boys & girls . This dummy with a stupid question can't get an answer without you . Semper Fi , all out.

Hello;


In my oppinion it is not good time to do something revolutionary. It is simple to small market in boat industry on this moment. Old traditionally companyes with low credits and other debts will probably survive, but for new one or really new technologies it is to less space.
In past three years we develop good 29 foot fast cruiser (More comfortable performance boat with beths...), but we stop it, simple we have no customers there for his type of boats. We install good engines, surface drive and all this bring as lot of benefits, like:
- on 29 foot boat we have more living space like orher at more than 38 foots.
- at 30 mph we made more than 5,3 mile per galon
- at 40 mph we made more than 4,5 mpg
- maximum speed round 75 mph
- service interval for engine more than 100 hours or five years! Exactly we do not know yet, but this is minimum.
All this with light self marinized 380 hp gassoline engine and surface drive! And important thing it is, that we first developed engines and build boat round of this. It mean lighter and better construction of all together.
Change only drive or only engine on boat maded with old technologie will help, but not a lot.

But like I write before, it is wrong time for succes on the market which is go down to zero.

ASD-8 is a much stronger driver than what is being discussed.

Steve

Miss Geico runs Mercury Racing 1650's with surface drives... (I know not a production boat)
But still, it proves that all the Noise Mercury makes about running their power and drive packages - is just that, noise.

Boat Manufacturers can do whatever they want. You want a 525EFI/ASD-? package, they will do it for you. You are the one writing the check.

Two things:

If Merc produced an Arneson like drive that never broke, what would their pricing be like seeing as they would not be selling anymore parts to fix broken bravos??? I'll bet if merc produced a drive comparable to an Arneson it would make guys beg to have Riks pricing back.

This leads me to my next question. Has mercury ever approached Rik to buy out Arneson or any of its product lines??

The last thing Mercury wants is a better product. They have put a lot of time and effort to engineering a product that fails exactly where and how they want. :D


If Merc purchased Arneson i can guarantee you'd probably never see one again. Marketing pretty much ruins most true innovation anymore

I've had my ASD-7M's on my Nor-Tech for five years now and have had zero problems.... If I were ever to build a new boat they would definitely have Arneson's on them. Rik's after sale support is second to none and the quality of product speaks for itself... Jim

The biggest problem you face is Warranty. Merc does not want to warranty their Motor when it is attached to another manufactures drive and Vise Versa. It would turn into a blame game if something were to go wrong.

Skater will build one if you want. We have 2 338 Fatboy's built now with Arneson drives, both with custom power. Could put Mercury power easily.

ive got a 98 side by side 42 fountain, how would they work on a boat like that,?

Thanks for the thread!!

Honest answer is politic's to a large degree and lack of an engine package from Arneson. It takes seriously deep pockets to develop and bring to market a complete engine package, compound that with a complete engine line up and the cost rocket up even higher. At this time we cannot offer a one stop engine/out drive package. We do have customers that use Mercury engines with out drive units as well as Ilmor engines with our drive units and of course the aftermarket engine manufacturers as well.

The fact that the Arneson Surface Drive's have benefits is often over shadow'd by the boat manufacturer needing to make a sale and make one as easy as possible. We totally understand this and accept this as short of offering an engine package ourselves there is little we can do about it. This is why with the diesel engine market we have a larger presence with the diesel engine companies only making an engine, they need a partner from the rest of the propulsion package. Hence we make a great marriage partner for those applications.

Arneson offers ten different size drive units, ranging from our smallest ASD6 to our larges ASD18 which is rated at 40,000 ft/lbs of input torque. Our smallest drives, ASD6, #7M and ASD8 are offered in a drop box version for gas/petrol engine applications. These are also fully RH or LH rotation with reduction built into them as well.

Rik

Yes, Arnesons have been installed upon Fountain Powerboats for nearly as long as Fountain has been in business. Beginning with the 10M and 12M boats to the current 42' and 48' models.

Your 42' side by side is an easy application.

Rik

I think you and Eddie should team up.....I hear that Louies boat is a rocket!

Louie's boat is extremely quick and Eddie says it tracks straight and turns on a dime...

My 32 tracks straight and turns on dime

Shhhh..... Your starting rumors that all the experts claim is not true!! :D

That's putting it mildly. That thing is stupid fast.....and it's still got a ways to go.


I have NEVER been in a cat that handled like that. We did things in that boat that I wouldn't even consider in other boats.....like taking a 60* corner on a 75 yard wide river at over 160 mph. And did like it was nothing. If you would have told me earlier that day that we would be doing that, I would have told you to F off. After we did it, I just wanted to turn around and do it again.......and we did. That boat with those drives (and my engines :), is an absolute home run. I can't wait to get it to the Shootout and let it stretch it's legs. Gonna be fun.
Eddie

I would say its more the drives....and not so much the engines....:evilb:

I would have to agree :)

It sounds like a NHRA dragster and throws a rooster that will make your shorts move!!

Hopefully we can get some propellers for Louie that will work for the shoot out... Taching out 41's is beyond expectations.

Is this the boat that came past me on the Kenosha poker run and went by so fast it almost spun me around?

Kris Vogt

Yep.....

Ya that was him

I would have to say Yes. From what I understand, it went flying past a bunch of boats. That kind of stuff happens when the owner drives it like a rental car :)

However, in Louie's defense, you can't help it. The boat/drive combo is such a dynamite setup that you can't not run the crap out of it. It is an incredible piece that just begs to be run. After we put it through it's paces and put it back on the trailer, I was looking in the tunnel to see if there was a pin hanging down like a slot car. I've never been in a boat that handles like that. Everyone involved should be very proud of what they created.
Eddie

Somebody in my boat saw him coming from way back and got all of our attention, so we just watched with jaws hanging open as he flew past. The only comment after that was: if he it a big wave that thing is going to be in orbit.

But was it LOOOOUD?

Been following this thread. Which boat was his from the pictures that are posted of the poker run?

I never saw any photos of Louie's boat posted anywhere from that run.

Ah. Thanks.