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Old 04-12-2017, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Jupiter Sunsation
No not at all. My point was more towards the 3 non alcohol related crashes. Brad Smith, Mike Fiore and Jim Melley/Garth Tagge all had plenty of experience but were pushing these boats to the limit with fatal results. 2 of the crashes were during somewhat controlled conditions so that "random cruiser wake" excuse isn't in play. No booze, no cruiser wake, not novices operating........what is left as the excuse?
all these high dollar boats are getting/are way to fast,,so no excuses,,but when you add alcohol to the mix all bets are off.
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Old 04-12-2017, 11:07 AM
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Your train jumped the tracks.

Very fast boats.
Choppy, nasty water.
Bright sunset in your eyes. (assuming you own a decent pair of sunglasses)
Alcohol.

Now which one do you remove from the list to probably reverse the end result of that tragic day?

Originally Posted by Jupiter Sunsation
No not at all. My point was more towards the 3 non alcohol related crashes. Brad Smith, Mike Fiore and Jim Melley/Garth Tagge all had plenty of experience but were pushing these boats to the limit with fatal results. 2 of the crashes were during somewhat controlled conditions so that "random cruiser wake" excuse isn't in play. No booze, no cruiser wake, not novices operating........what is left as the excuse?
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Old 04-12-2017, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Jupiter Sunsation
I certainly wouldn't promote drunk driving but "What would be your standpoint on the 3 other fatal catamaran crashes?" All three cases the individuals had thousands of hours of experience, no booze and still had the same result.

Your argument blames booze in this case (which I don't disagree as a contributing factor), in the 3 cases I mentioned "What becomes the blame then?" 2 of the 3 were on video and the crashes were shockingly similar in appearance. Is there something wrong with admitting the boats have simply gotten too fast? Nascar realized this with their sport and went the route of restrictor plates to slow them down and keep them under control.
There are dozens of other fatal crashes, some involving catamarans:
Kevin Sellars
Flash Gordon/Myra Gibson
Big Thunder
Joey Gratton

Often seen as common denominators:
-Ego
-Alcohol

Even though this article is written for automobiles; I firmly believe this applies to boats as well:
http://driving.ca/auto-news/news/why...a-car-accident

"incidents" happen because someone makes a mistake.
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Old 04-12-2017, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by ActiveThunder
Your train jumped the tracks.

Very fast boats.
Choppy, nasty water.
Bright sunset in your eyes. (assuming you own a decent pair of sunglasses)
Alcohol.

Now which one do you remove from the list to probably reverse the end result of that tragic day?

You could pick any one. There is not a SURE one that automatically reverses a tragedy.


We get your point but you are take a large presumption to assume that if your take the booze away that they 110% survive this or the accident does not happen at all. Sorry but that is just not a sure bet or factual statement.
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Old 04-12-2017, 12:04 PM
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Agreed. But I said 'probably'.

Originally Posted by Nate5.0
You could pick any one. There is not a SURE one that automatically reverses a tragedy.
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Old 04-12-2017, 12:20 PM
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Even stone sober it was not a wise decision to be running over 100 mph in that area of the lake on that weekend at that time of day. Way too congested with normal lake traffic. There have been times at half that speed that we've had issues navigating the water safely there due to unpredictable actions of boaters (jet skis, pontoons, cruisers, etc.) that will do a sudden "left turn Clyde" on you without so much as a glance over their shoulders. As someone stated previously, it is only a matter of time before the injuries/fatalities involve innocent bystanders. Not sure how familiar with the lake they were and at this point it doesn't matter. Bad decision(s) equated to an accident and they paid the ultimate price. I love to see the big cats ripping up and down the lake but you have to pick and choose when it is somewhat safe for both you and your fellow boaters you share the water with to let it eat.

RIP.
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Old 04-12-2017, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by jusabum
When its all said and done, remember the owner of this MTI was a grown adult. He was old enough to make his own decisions and obviously made some good ones over the years, and possibly one last bad one. He possessed the wherewithal to purchase a high speed boat and in all likelihood, he was aware of prior accidents in similar boats and knew the risks of operating a boat like this...there is no such thing as 100% safety in a boat that is designed to go fast. As long as there is a demand for these boats, they will be built...Godspeed.
I couldn't have said it better. Seems like some posters on this thread are suggesting that there should be laws or mandated limits on top speed capability / installed horsepower / boat design.

Bull****. We are all grown adults, and we are all fully capable of deciding what risk level we are comfortable with taking on. I don't need anybody telling me what is "good for me", especially not the government.
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Old 04-12-2017, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by ActiveThunder
Your train jumped the tracks.

Very fast boats.
Choppy, nasty water.
Bright sunset in your eyes. (assuming you own a decent pair of sunglasses)
Alcohol.

Now which one do you remove from the list to probably reverse the end result of that tragic day?
Pat your tripping yourself up.......In my 3 boat crash example alcohol was not a factor, yet all three had fatalities.

No Alcohol.....

Very fast boats
Choppy, nasty water (not much of a factor in 2 of the crash videos)
Bright Sunset......surely not a factor in the Fiore full canopy crash.

Now what is left to remove from the list to probably reverse the end result of that tragic day?
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Old 04-12-2017, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Knot 4 Me
Even stone sober it was not a wise decision to be running over 100 mph in that area of the lake on that weekend at that time of day. Way too congested with normal lake traffic. There have been times at half that speed that we've had issues navigating the water safely there due to unpredictable actions of boaters (jet skis, pontoons, cruisers, etc.) that will do a sudden "left turn Clyde" on you without so much as a glance over their shoulders. As someone stated previously, it is only a matter of time before the injuries/fatalities involve innocent bystanders. Not sure how familiar with the lake they were and at this point it doesn't matter. Bad decision(s) equated to an accident and they paid the ultimate price. I love to see the big cats ripping up and down the lake but you have to pick and choose when it is somewhat safe for both you and your fellow boaters you share the water with to let it eat.

RIP.
Recall we would always see David Scott and JT making those runs at 7-7:30 am when nobody else was on the water.
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Old 04-12-2017, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Sydwayz
There are dozens of other fatal crashes, some involving catamarans:
Kevin Sellars
Flash Gordon/Myra Gibson
Big Thunder
Joey Gratton

Often seen as common denominators:
-Ego
-Alcohol

Even though this article is written for automobiles; I firmly believe this applies to boats as well:
http://driving.ca/auto-news/news/why...a-car-accident

"incidents" happen because someone makes a mistake.
I left the racing examples out, those guys are running literally 10/10ths, pushing the equipment as hard as they can. But if you want to add in the racer fatalities, it isn't booze that is killing those guys, not choppy nasty water, not sunsets.........it is the very fast boats.

I don't care how shiny the plastic trophy is, I have no interest in it or dying so the next race will be done in my memory. Those guys don't go out there to die, but sadly the odds sometimes take their toll.
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