Injector cleaners as maintance service?
 

"BUP" on here (Screen name) has many threads on this topic

long story short, bench flow test is the only true-fire method of cleaning...a lot of people use the products listed but they can also loosen the particulates (Tank through to injector pintles) and really do a number as it clogs up everything..

I would have a story book to write here but Ill make it as short as possible.

For one how do you change the basket filters if the injectors are never pulled out - and at times the basket filter are dry rotted so they are not filtering anymore and cause huge poorly performing injectors and flow volumes. Restrictions. What a way to run lean.

How does one change out the sealing orings because they can dry out as well over time and cause fuel leaks and or vacuum leaks inwhich cause stumbles and poor idling with hesitation for accelerating. for a jist of info about all that end.

Did one know that a good injector service is cheaper than a carb cleaning and rebuild KEEP in mind both are fuel delivery items carb and injectors

next how does one get rid of the internal fuel pump wear that collects in the injectors -- that material is brass / bronze / alumium and other metals depending on the fuel pumps -- how does one dissolve that with a cleaner ???

How does one get rid of the internal rubber fuel line that deteriorates over time and collects in the injectors and its filters ? Not many boaters ever change that rubber fuel line from the gas tank to the engine side ---- they break down over time. Just like any rubber product, it never lasts forever especially living in a enclosed engine compartment --- think about it, the fuel line has fuel sitting it for 365 days every year so how long does that last. Plus some rubber fuel lines have a inner liner that breaks away. causing running issues that all collects in the injectors . How does one dissolve that by spraying a cleaning solution thru the fuel system ?

Keep in mind the injectors are the end of the line for the all the fuel so all the junk and crap ends up in there at some point and time. And at times cleaners can make it worse by lifting off fuel vanish / stripping internal paint / whatever else that's in the fuel system.

How does one watch spray patterns and spray patterns are extremely important as well for proper fuel atomization - how does one check injector flow volumes and balance of the flow volumes ? Balanced flow volume and the correct flow volumes are so very important. Anyways see where I am coming from --- ONE can not know whats right and wrong when can not see any results. Marine engines are the worst on fuel injectors, ask anyone in that business. I surely can attest to that statement everyday. Just some examples at some point and time the injectors have to come out for testing and examined. Most cleaners are a form of alcohol base anyways.

Forgot one thing as well INJECTORS have the electrical side to them as well that needs to be tested on top of ...Also injectors NEED to seal against fuel leaking as well so do they drip fuel upon start up and or drip fuel just after engine shut off ??

With that said heavy cleaners might be the issue as to why injectors leak - It works both ways for cleaners --- why because cleaners can strip away contaminants in which can cause the pintle to NOT CLOSE against its seat that has lodged. A great example of this is apps with the carter cool fuel cell and the Merc gen 3 cool fuel cell. The internal paint is stripped away faster and in bigger chunks. So much testing involved for next to nothing in price to have injectors serviced..

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. And of course its up to the owner of the boat how well do they want to really maintain their boat and engines.

we now use techron concentrate. It works very well. It wont fix old fuel lines or replace a defective or damaged injector, but it will dissolve particulate and gum and varnish. It absolutely helps improve idle, acceleration and start ups. And of course make sure you run small micron fuel filter.
if you are having issues that makes you think injectors are DIRTY try this. Get a new 10 micron fuel water separator filter for each motor. Then fill 1/2 TECHRON concentrate and 1/2 gas. Start motor and run for 5 mins. I recommend also treat the tank with it periodically. ALSO Keep stabil in fuel at all times.
THIS IS GOOD AND FREE ADVICE👍

I only use Techron. I double dose at least once a year.
was told by a few mechanics that Techron was the only one that worked.

No one thinks about that end as cleaners work both ways. To make a point about that - double dose the cleaners in your gas tanks or fuel cells for all Merc gen 3 cool fuels and the Carter cool fuel cells, Then see how much faster one will strip away the internal paint and really cause havoc along with leaking injectors or very restricted injectors from all that paint you help stripped away.

Also you do know that a lot of the fuel rails and the dampers get corroded internally - cleaners will help lift that rust off not dissolving it. Ill show a few pics how bad they become internally. Most cleaners are a form of alcohol base anyways and snake oils.

How's about Startron instead of Stabil? IN addition I use non-ethanol fuel anyway.

starton is awesome

A oil base is your best fuel additive one can use for marine apps. Why do you think all marine manu s have SB s about laying up their engines in a 2 stroke oil mix with fresh gas. Most are claiming if your boat sits for more than 2 weeks

The best fuel add off the shelf is by CRC bar none for marine apps especially saltwater apps..

An oil base add --- cuts down on fuel pump wear and can keep corrosion at bay plus lubes all moving fuel system parts. . As the fuel evaporates over time the oil base does not. It leaves a protective coating. And the oil base add cuts the fuel evaporation in half.

Whose 2 stroke oil do you suggest and what concentration?

fuel cells with internal paint? That sucks.

What's the name of the CRC product?

Keith

I know lucas is oily to the touch. I used it in my snowmobile sdinjected. Seemed ok but that was just a preseason.
is lucas injector cleaner good?

The old favorite. Citgo (Mystik is same company) sea and snow conventional or semi-synthetic. You are in MI so you should see this everywhere, Mom and Pops, chain stores, Fleet and Farm's etc.

Prob is that some synthetic 2 strokes are known not to cling to parts for long.

I mix it same as my 2 stroke lawn/tree tools. 40:1. I pour it right into an empty fuel water separator. But, my system doesn't return to the tank. Start engine and when you start to see blue smoke out of the tailpipes, the 2 stroke mix is in your carb/fuel injectors/ and rails. Oh and cyl walls. :)

I have done this with my 525's every fall before storing the boat for the last 7 seasons. I coughed a motor the first season that I bought the boat and upon inspection the injectors were badly plugged and corroded. I swapped out all 24 injectors (triple 525's) when we rebuilt the blown motor, and have followed this method religiously since then.

Painted internals of fuel cell?
 

i never heard of that? Is that a typo?

Mercury painted the inside of there CoolFuel fuel system.

I swear by Techron, as a kid i worked at a Volvo dealership in callas, My job was to drain fuel, leave about 5 gallons in it, pour in Techron and drive it hard. Worked 100% of the time and still does with my Nordic and Chaparral.

Most of these are half the cleaners as in the past years. The EPA made all the changes everything over the shelf is weak today for cleaners no question about it.. Examples of this is merc power tune was prob the best carb cleaner and best carbon cleaner one could ever use 12 years ago and back. Today it does nothing. Also Gumout carb cleaners in the 80 s and 90 s was a very strong carb cleaner as well. Currently it does not clean very well . Most professional shops including motorcycle shops went to ultra sonic cleaning parts and fuel system parts because not much is great in the way for cleaners.

The real way to lay up boats plus per all OEMs --- is with a remote gas tank with the soup mix and the run the boat until it is fully warmed up to recommended operating temps. In the winter time that can take 20 mins or even longer depending how cold it is. You need to run the engine long enough to warm up the oil and so forth.

I have been laying up boats since the 1980 s and since 1996 with the soup mix because Volvo Penta came out with that ( service bulletins ) way back then. Mercruiser followed suit years later. Plus merc over doses the 2 stroke motor oil way too much - it can foul out your spark plugs. I never have any issues with laying up boats this way.

In the past year over year we would winterized on an average 400 boats like clock work every year. . That's a lot of winterizations plus to find out what works or does not work . And of course those days are over for getting a ton of winterizations. In the last 6 years the average for winterizations is 30 to 35 per year if Im lucky. Just saying

Also it best to change all your oils with fresh oils for lay ups and DO FUEL SAMPLEs.and fuel samples at the filters ---- all of this just before you winterize for the lay up.

I have posted this info up here many years ago as well.

Wow. Thats stupid. What about fuel tanks?

the epa manted LOW permenation fuel tanks they have an internal base coat since 2010. All manu in the USA are required to use the new epa mandated stuff

A couple hours ago -- oh this 496 boat owner complaint --- hard starts and engine dies after off idle around 2500 to 3000 rpms. . So I tested Fuel pressure first and that was was very high -- why because the injectors were so restrictive. Most would have started changing the fuel pressure regulator and missed the injectors.. Easy fix for me he will be back on the water this weekend. IAC did all that as well. https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...940d5a0f4c.jpg

wow. Thanks for the info....

I will post all the mandated info carbon canisters and new fuel vents and much more. Internally the plastic gas tanks have like a black / grey liner to meet the low perm that the epa mandated for emissions. All the current engines are called EC for emission control. this has taken place since late 2009 and late 2007 for California.

I have a 95 502 mpi that I'm taking the vps off (tired of the vapor lock)and want to have the injectors gone through and checked. Who should I send them to?

Thanks I'll send them to him.
I tried to pm BUP but it told me his index was full. Hopefully he will see this and send me message of how to get ahold of him.

Thanks guys and DD for good words for what I do daily. - yes you are more than welcome to send any fuel related items to whomever. On my end I prob spend way too much with each set of injectors but I am one of those who measures 11 times and cuts once. My goal ALWAYS is to have the spec flow volume rates within those rated numbers and as close to possible perfectly balance in flow volumes across the board. I always try to be at 3 percent and under for that balance.

Many oems say 7 percent is good but again I really strive for 3 percent and under for flow balance. Most people fudge these numbers and WRITE down that all injectors flow the same number across the board . That is a BS report - IMPOSSIBLE to have all 8 injectors or 6 injectors or 4 injectors to FLOW the EXACT SAME PERFECT flow volume numbers for many of the test procedures.

Like I said I try and perform many cleanings & tests to get all the injectors as close to perfect as possible. That is not easy to do with marine fuel injectors but I spend the time and money to make that happen for all sets of fuel injectors as best I can. .

Sorry about the PM box being full I ll have to read a few and delete some. THANKS

Ill add this short story: A acquaintance called me up, bought a twin engine boat that sat for 5 years or so, asked me what Id do with fuel system. Told him pump fuel system dry, add 15 or 20 gallons of clean gas, change filters, run on hose till it quits, change filters again, repeat THEN pull injectors and bring them to me to flow and clean at my shop on my machine. He skipped all that, added a bunch of injector cleaner (boat held 180 gallons of gas), had like 60 in it (I think). Told me boat "ran great",. A week later he was on a fun run , called me up and said he had oil blowing from valve cover breather, melted a piston to ring land. THEN I flowed and cleaned the injectors, the one from the offending cylinder flowed 35% or so low. He had enough bad injectors (502 mags) that I re-wrote his tune and sold him match flowed 60 lb injectors. The price of having your injectors flowed and cleaned by a shop like mine or BUP vs losing a month or all of boating season with a hurt motor is money well spent, Smitty

send me your contact info so I can send them to you