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What is happening to my paint??

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Old 04-14-2004, 10:23 PM
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jeff bratton
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acid rain?
 
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Old 04-14-2004, 10:25 PM
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Take it back!! On them!! I can't see that Cigarette wouldn't stand behind this being the premier boat builders that they are.
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Old 04-14-2004, 11:21 PM
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When it was wet-sanded and buffed, it went away? Correct? Doesn't necessarily sound like a delamination problem to me. The wet-sanding being able to remove the blemish suggests that the problem is on the outer surface of the clear, and not embedded in the e-coat.

I go for several weeks sometimes before clearcoating, and have never had a delamination problem.

My first guess, (and your close up photo was great, by the way) is that maybe there wasn't enough catalyst in the sector of this clear session, resulting in a weak catalyzation. It's hard to say without seeing it in person and performing a couple of tests on it. This is an easy mistake to make. If this is the only area that it is happening to it may be because of a repair or touch-up that was performed after the main paint job was done.

This can usually be rectified by reclearing over that area with a fresh, correctly mixed clear session.

I'll try and forward this thread to my paint rep from BASF, tomorrow, and see if he has any ideas on this.

Dave Hunter is an exceptional, professional painter. Have you contacted him personally? Either way, I'm sure that Cigarette will work with you to rectify the problem.
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Old 04-15-2004, 06:28 AM
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Looks Like not enough hardner was mixed in the clear... do you know what paint product they used??? spies-ppg-dupont ect ...we use spies at my shop if ever a paint issue they send a rep and they have always stood behind the product..Im with Mitcher t ..does look like a topical condition moisture related..
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Old 04-15-2004, 07:43 AM
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Man that is very sad to see. However they can fix it and it will be good as new when you are done. Hang in there.

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Old 04-15-2004, 07:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by lotoparty
if they remove the clear , shoot the 222 , then re-clear would that fix the problem?
the problem is that when the clear is removed , most likly the base colors will get hit and need to be re-colored. i would be concerned that this is just the begining of this problem and that the clear will do this in other areas. bottom line- needs to be stripped and re-colored and cleared. for that kinda coin i would demaned a loaner boat while this takes place


as far as "e-coat" that only applies to metal not fiberglass. it is a part of the paint process on vehicles, not boats.


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Old 04-15-2004, 08:37 AM
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I should clarify a little, the past two times the boat went back to Cigarette the problem wasn't as bad as this....it had slight clouding but definitely noticeable....this time it is much worse....I almost think that this may have been an area that was re-cleared with subsequent problems of its own....Has any one else had problems with shrink wrap reacting badly to their paint??? Or do you think that this was not the problem to begin with but rather something in the paint process gone wrong...either in material or technique????
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Old 04-15-2004, 08:38 AM
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It could also be that they simply applied too much heat when the shrink wrapped the boat causing the clear and paint to adhere to the plastic (perhaps in conjunction with the other factors mentioned above). When it was removed it may have also removed some of the paint with it.

Sorry to see that on such a good looking paint job!
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Old 04-15-2004, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by LPA2106
222 is the right number...mid-coat adhesion promoter...
222 is nothing more than a lacquer based product like glue. does not have any mechanical or chemical adhesion properties and there for just lays between the the two layers a band-aid at best. 222 was designed for the old days when urethanes were first coming out and they couldn't get the clears to stick to the factory clear coats. If you ever try to sand mid-coat it will ball up right off of the surface therefore no permanent adhesion. Lacquer base products have no place in todays hi tech finishes period.

mid coat adhesion 222 ( JUNK )

later

spitfire,

it's hard to actually say without seeing it in person but i would thank that if it's doing it in the same spot as the last time that there is something under the base coats in that location. you don't indicate that the paint is loose just discolored, leads me to believe something is bleeding back through. maybe a repair in the gel that did not cure properly. all repair material or paints or fiberglass resins or gel coats have vapors that evaporate from the material in the drying process. If not fully cured before the next layer the vapors get trapped and will eventually work there way to the surface. The clear coat urethanes or a tough paint and don't allow the vapor to penetrate out and so they are trapped and will usually cause the cloudy look you got. You mentioned that you waxed the boat within a short period of time after the last repair that is a NO NO. wax acts as a barrier and wont let the vapors out of the clear and the same thing can occur cloudy the clear. I think your problem is under the clear. Wait 60 days before wax next time.


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Old 04-15-2004, 09:52 AM
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Not to highjack the thread, but how long should you wait before applying wax?
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