DVD Copy Software Question
 

Any suggestions as to what is the best software or freeware to copy DVD's? Naturally for personal use only.

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

If you are talking about a movie that you buy in the store like the Saprano's or something then there is no way to do it with out very illegal software. There is a kid that craked the old code but as soon as the word got out they now have a new one that to the best of my knowledge has not been cracked.

Jon

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

single or dual layer dvd's?

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

??????

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

the software you want is called DVDshrink . . . and I have used it on just about everything I have and it has worked so far... even with Pirates of the Carribean which is supposed to be difficult to copy

www.dvdshrink.org

if you want more information e-mail me

Ernie

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

A friend does it all the time.
He even copies XBox and PS2 games. Has mod chips in his consoles.

So I can say I KNOW it can be done.

I've never done it. Don't even have a DVD burner.
My kids dump Kaaza rips all the time. Burn their own mixes.

I've got a close relative heavy into the music business. Also got a close friend heavy into the music business. The relative (a studio musician) is very ANTI piracy on all levels. The friend just doesn't seem to think its a big deal.

My relative feels that downloading is causing the collapse of the music industry. He says it is hitting him in his pocket.

I feel that the horrible overpricing of the store-bought music is the cause of the "collapse" if there is one. I feel the overpricing has virtually CAUSED the rampant downloading.

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

DVD Shrink (as TopSpin suggests) is free ware and I've been using it for couple years now. It is NOT illegal and is available all over the web. ver 3.2 is the latest and greatest.

It allows 'ripping' of any/all movies and then you chose what you want to 'back-up' ... full back-up, with all menus, subtitling, special effects, etc. Or you can pick and chose exactly what parts you want.

You can also chose 'compression' rates which vary between #'s 1-10. The more compression you chose, allows you to fit a whole movie, plus special effects, on a 4.7GB(normal size) blank disc. The larger a movie file sizes the more compression you may need to squeeze it on the disc. Or you can chose less compression and take less of the parts. Take only the movie, with no menus, no subtitles, no special effects. It's sort of a balancing game. NOTE: The more compression the less quality of the final backed-up copy.

Overall a great back-up freeware for sure. Once your files are ripped and ready to go (in a target folder) you pick your favorite 'burn' software and burn your DVD. IE: Nero, CD Creator by Roxio, DVD Image Burn, etc etc. There is bunch, you can use any. Enjoy ... If you need help you can PM me :)

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Ok , howz about some help for those of us( me) that are PC knowledgable challenged. I looked at the DVD Shrink site, and can get to the latest version, U.S. 3.2, but there are another 20 download choices to choose from there. http://www.filemirrors.com/search.sr...ink32setup.zip
Don't suppose someone will target 'the' download I need? Thats.

BTW, Windows ME.

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

What's your email address US1 .. I'll send you a zip file ;)

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

PM sent

Thanks,
Jerry

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

:)

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Come on man are you serious? The problem is there is free off the internet and there is cost from the store. They could sell cd's for 2 bucks and people would still rather rip them for free off the net. Have you noticed that as of late the cost of CD's and DVD's has actually gone UP!!! Why do you think that is? I am willing to bet it is due to most of the ripping. It is steeling no matter how you cut it. Petty theft of a artists property. People work hard to get recognition, finally make it, then they get hosed because people download their stuff instead of buying it. Hell even as they are a price of a CD is only about 14 bucks. So about the cost of 7 gallons of gas. Is that really over priced? What about the millions of dollars that are spent to make a movie then we are all just going to ripo them for free? Don't they deserve to make some money? Then there is the issue of due to all the steeling of music those of us that want to buy it have to pay more. You know just like the people making false insurance claims driving up insurance for our cars, health and everything else.

I have a DVD hard drive storage unit that will rip DVD's and it is the ONLY legal unit available. Any other way is NOT LEGAL no matter what they tell you. This unit is http://www.kaleidescape.com It comes at a price of course. It costs 28,000 bucks for a base system. Part of what you are paying for is the license agreement and the ability to copy YOUR OWN CD's. Part of that agreement is that you DO NOT alter the cd at all You have to record all trailers and every chapter of the DVD. DVD's fall under a different catagoy then CD's do. CD's are not copy protected like DVD's are. The breaking of the DVD code means you have broken the law. There is a new law on the books in fact that will make illegal to fast forward through the trailers of a DVD. I think that is totally bogus but I bet it is going to be hear before you know it.

Jon

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Audio, Why do you think they use the term 'ripping' the files?? :) I buy subscription to NetFlix .. pay for the movie to be at the house, the kids watch it .. if they request a back-up of the movie, I try and find the time ;)

NetFlix is way cool BTW for those that have not looked into. 3 out plan. Any 3 DVDs at the house, any length of time, no late fees ... ever. All the new releases. $17.95/mo

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

I'm with netflix also... and I think of it like this..... I paid for the right to view the movie as many times as I please.. and if I like it I can "rip" it and view it again.. I'm not copying all the moves and giving them to friends, so who cares.

plus it is legal to copy a movie that you own as a back-up for your DVD collection. My collection just includes everything I get from netflix :D

I think actors are overpaid for their 'talents' as well as sports players... I think most would agree that if you walked through some of the homes that these people own as just their weekend retreats that they can afford us ripping their DVD's... most of us are going to the theatre and watching the movies also.

the small people in the industry that this hurts... need to gang up on the actors and the actors need to cut their big ticket salaries and let the little guys make some money... when that happens.. I'll buy the DVD

Ernie


by the way I don't believe in downloading DVD's off the internet, I'll atleast rent them... the internet move download quality is way too low :D

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

I offer no argument that downloading (other than iMusic or something) is stealing. Never intended to condone it.

But YES I DO think that $16 music CD's caused the downloading craze. CD's came to us in the early 80's as a format that would LOWER the cost of purchased music and RAISE the sound quality (although the first batch was crappy due to the original mastering being done for vinyl). It was billed by the mfrs as the medium that was going to lower the cost from like $6.99 for vinyl, and $5.99 cassette, TO appx $4 for a high quality compact disc that would not lose sound quality with time or replaying over and over. Guess what? The discs came out at $7.99 and never looked back. After all, the consumer was getting a BETTER product so why give them a break, even though the mfg cost was less than either vinyl or mag tape.

Well, time passes and the cost of producing CD's drops to less than a penny apiece. nowhere was even a fraction of this cost savings passed back to the consumers. Some (not I, but some) guys decided that since you could do an image dump of a CD, tht you might as well rip them to disc. MP3 compression came about, and all of a sudden music became extremely compact and manageable.

Instead of the commercial marketers of music capitalizing on the technology, they left it to the fringe element (pirates) to perfect the system. And that they did.

My kids download illegal music. Most of it is of very questionable quality. Bad compression, crappy source hardware, compression of a pre compressed copy, etc. They make their little mixes. They splice pieces of it together in freeware music editing programs. They add little stuff like DJ talk and such. I did worse when I was in middle school.

They also own a lot of purchased CDs.

Do I feel sorry for the record industry? Sure I do. But I think they brought it on themselves. Not that they did anything illegal, they played very fair. But they were selling something VERY EASILY copied and distributed. More reasonable pricing would have minimized the upside to illegal distribution.

Did Metallica have a valid argument? You Betcha.

But the record companies were too greedy. And when sales dropped, they raised their prices in an attempt to keep the profits up. Sure they are cheaper now. Have to be.

Movies? Best I understand it, is that they have gone to great lengths to make it difficult to copy a movie. But some group of hacks is always going to figure out a way around it. All you can do is feel confident that the main slice of the general public won't be interested in an involved collection of decrypting software and a stack of hardware to circumvent the system. Cause there's always gonna be an element that will copy your work.

If it's data, the hacks will copy it.
If it's technology, the Japanese will copy it.
If it's commodities, the Chinese will copy it.

Rules, Trademarks, Copyrights, etc. They are all there to discourage copying. But somebody will always continue to do it.

My kid asked me about a mod chip for his consoles. I told him nope. He asked about a DVD burner. I told him nope. But he burns CDs like crazy. He makes some pretty good mixes.

Had CD's been introduced at the $4 price they were bragging about? I bet the copiers would have been far less inclined to create their own industry about it.

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

DVD Xcopy Express. Works great for me.

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

JLane ... Loved XCOPY Express too .. but my serial code # expired :(

The legality issue shouldn't even be a topic of discussion here, IMO it's like politics and religion anyway ... ain't no winners :D :D

TopSpin it's funny, NetFlix has me and the kids racing to meet the mailman :D He's clueless lol

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Mcollinst: Say what ya want about the cost but 13 bucks is still cheap. It is not so much the cost of the actuall cd that you are paying for, of course that is neglicable. It is the cost of copy write, legal fees with this entire illegal media swapping industry, and some were in there money for the artist (very little they make their money mostly on touring) and the recording company. Are they still priffitable ya I am sure they are. However there have been a LOT of smaller recording studios that have gone out of business due to the MP3 Industry. There have also been some artists that maybe made it a little farther then they would had they NOT had this part of the industry. However that is music and what we are talking about is DVD. As I said music does NOT have any copy protection on it other then it being illegal to make copy's and give them to your friends. DVD's have anti piracy software on them. Just the fact that you have bypast that software is a huge criminal offense IF you get caught. As of now the movie industry is not pursuing small guys like you and me but they will be soon I am sure as this software becomes more and more well known.

If ya do this and some one steels the drives off your boat I hope ya don't complain as it is NO different. After all the drives are expensive right and if I need one why buy one when I can just go and take it off my neighbors. Is this extream sure it is and I realize that in the case of ripping it your neighbor still has his music to listen to. However the legalities are still the same. You can justify it any way you want. Even with my license that I have purchased making it LEGAL for me to rip them to my Kalidescape I know full well that it is Illegal to rent a movie and rip it to my hard drive. The prices of movies has gone up quite a bit in the last year. Why? NOT because of artists making more money in fact there have not been the huge sallaries paid that they once did, not because the studio's want to make more money, but because of piracy. It is driving the prices up for those of us that want to play by the rules. Do I wish the stuff was cheaper? Sure I do, do I think that 13 bucks is outrageous for a disc, not really, 30 for a DVD movie not really. Hell it costs me over 30 to go to the movies with my wife...... They are working on new DVD software for anti piracy all the time. It costs millions of dollars. This all has to be added into the cost of the DVD's. They will get this so that they can not be cracked. No one has after all figured out the new cable and sat encryp. Then the costs will stay high and justafiably so.

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Oh, bite my butt, Jon. Of COURSE it's different. It's copy theft, not physical theft. That's why it's so prevalent. There's no MATERIAL loss. It's just like you luring my (male) dog into your garage and mating him with your (female) dog before letting him run back home. I still get my dog back, but you get a house full of puppies (to keep, sell, etc.)...

<< remember here that I am NOT attempting to minimize the illegality of it, but am only using illustrations to show WHY I think it's become such a big issue >>

Since the beginning of time, copy protection has been an issue. Patent law, Copyright law, Trademark law, Intelligent Property law. It is big business.

And copying a protected product is theft. No doubt about it. But it NOT physical theft.

So that makes it "feel" less wrong.
That's why the casual copier gets to "feel" like he isn't hurting anything.

Price of music includes the cost of legal fees for litigating against copiers and data streamers? Sure it does. But my stand says that if their pricing had been lower TO BEGIN WITH, that the data streaming issue would never have been so attractive to the pirates. It wouldn't have been as big a deal.

It's like cloning grass. Fescue, for example, isn't a creeping grass. It won't spread on its own. Could scientists actually CLONE fescue? Bet they could. It would be expensive and it would take a while to bring the cost down very much at all but they might eventually be able to get it done pretty cheaply after a few years of revising the process. BUT YOU CAN BUY FESCUE SEEDS FOR NEXT TO NOTHING. So why spend the effort on trying to make cloning it an economically viable process?

So since the music industry priced their CD's too high, it made copying an attractive idea. Much more so than if they had been priced more attractively to begin with.

Music Artists? You're right. Most don't make squat off the sale of the music in stores. That money goes to the Label, the writer, and the publisher. Artists get their bucks from live performances.

Has the downloading craze hurt music companies. No doubt. I hate it.

But I still contend that the cart didn't come before the horse. The music industry created the conditions that encouraged downloading.

I'm finished arguing this. I have no hat to throw into this argument. I have no plans to copy DVD's. I have no plans to copy video games. I have no plans to stop buying CD's. My kids download low quality music, but more times than not, they eventually add the "real" CDs to their "wish lists" and they get bought in the longrun anyway.

Jon, I'm proud that you're a hard-liner. It's a good stand to make. I don't necessarily agree that the industry is the lonely victim in the downloading war, cause I feel they encouraged it. But I'd rather see you stand firm against it, than to stand firm for it (copying).

And if you stop saying it's like stealing my outdrives, you don't have to bite my butt.

mc

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Actually it would be like someone copying the drives off his boat and doing so without having to pay a dime for them.

Roby

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

The pircary on the Internet of movies and music is never going to go away and it's time for the industry to figure in the loss. For every method created to thwart piracy it is only weeks later that the method is cracked. Even with the new legal download sites their member numbers aren't even one percent of the numbers of people who download for free. It isn't just that it is free that makes it so popular. You don't have to provide a CC. You don't have to give out any personal info for piracy sites or software and that makes it very attractive for even the most law abiding individual.

Roby

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Hey boss I think it is Intellectuall property law :p :p

I agree it is not the same as steeling a drive, but it is steeling none the less. Same I gues as Martha Sterwart...... It is blue collar crime (I think this falls under that ok?) I just take issue that people who do it don't see that they are having an effect on a industry. Believe it or not most that do it do NOT think that they are doing anything wrong. Read above and it has been stated that it is LEGAL to rip DVD's Hell I know people that take great pride in thier 5000 song library of downloaded music. I admit I have dowloaded a lot of music however what I use it for it to find the song that I want and what album it comes on. Nothing pisses me off more then to purchase a album and get it home and I got the wrong one. Then it is back to the store to get the correct one.... Also there is a lot of music that is no longer in print. I do not think that the recording industry sould take any issue with that..... The one thing that Movie industry does have going for it is unless you are ready to buy HUGE hard drives storing DVD's on a hard drive is not super practical as evidence by the unit that I sell. To store 1000 DVD's would cost you about 50,000 bucks. :eek: :eek: I still feel that even if CD's were 5 bucks or even less that people would be Kaazaaing over buying. After all free is better then not free. At my last check Apples downloads on their MP3 site are such a small percentage of the downloads that happen it is not even funny and others the same. That is a buck for 3 songs for some of the places......

Hell I am just glad not to have to kiss your harry azz :D:D

Hey you still need a Runco? May have one coming in in a couple weeks

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

The piracy will be thwarted that I am sure. People figured that they would never get the cable boxes and Sat boxes also. Well There is NO WAY as of yet to get Digital Cable for free OR Sat for free now that they have the new cards and boxes. Give them time they will get it the same with DVD's
They do figure it into their losses. To compensate they just raised the cost of DVD's AGAIN!! I was buying DVD's for about 14-20 bucks each for a long time. Now we are back up to 20-30 bucks..... No coincidence that it is about the same time that hacking software became more well known.
If you think that you do not have to give out your CC number or anything else think again. These softwares have all kinds of embeded stuff in them. Remember the guys that hacked the code for DVD had to be DAMN good to figure it out. They can track you all over the internet when you have that stuff loaded onto your computer. They probably can get your CC info and you do not even know it :eek: :eek: :eek: Ok Morphius :D:D This is the Matrix :D:D Now back to my worm hole :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Oh ya and I can not IMAGINE that guys driving around in speed boats are complaining about a $30 buck cost of a DVD!!! :D:D

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Audio, No one said it is "Legal to rip DVD's" I said ... DVDShrink software is NOT ILLEGAL and I'll proudly stand by that statement or post :) BTW, Every other word after the word however in your post above is BS! You do it ... done deal. You can't draw a line here and then tell me the line is over there! There is no being a little pregnant my friend :D lol And here I go, I said it was like politics and religion, but here ya go sucking me into this ridiculous 'arguement' :p :D

Who cares what impact is on the industry?? YOU? How many albums or DVDs have you released? The technology is there and people will use it and abuse it. Human nature is a b1tch, always has been, always will be. Besides, 'they' have finally figured out this obvious fact :rolleyes: and now have begun to 'capitalize' on the DL'able music and movies formats ... Check out I-tunes, Real Player, heck even Wallmart sells songs for .79. Movies are also available this same way and for very reasonable cost (movielink.com). So now they will once again make their proceeds and profits people are 'steeling' (lol j/k'ing) from them and the world is safe again :D :p

You must shop at different places than I do. LOL Harddisk space has never been cheaper and it only will(gets) cheaper every day. I can get HDspace at about .25 or so a gig. 1,024 megabytes are equal to 1 gigabyte (GB or Gig) A normal size album is around 75MB so you do the math .. no?? OK .. I'll do it ... that's about 13.65333 albums per gig or .25cents. A typical movie is 5gig or so, that is still only a buck and a qtr./movie even at todays harddrive space prices ... plus once you burn it you can delete it from your HDspace anyhoo. HDD cost factor is a moot point, IMO.

I will always pay for the movie, CD, go to theatre, etc ... but I can sleep well at night knowing that I've backed-up a movie or CD for my in home useage or for the case where maybe I do not want my daughter running around with a CD or DVD they will (probably) scratch the, you know what, out of before it get returned to me .... if I ever even see it again :D They get a back-up copy that I really don't care if it gets returned.

BTW Jon, "now that they have the new cards and boxes" sounds like you might have 'known' a little bit about SAT hacking there ... maybe for a while??? Like till the P4 showed up ;) :D

Over and out, Chris

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

No every work after HOWEVER is not BS as I qualified my purpose as a tool to help me purchase the correct CD and that is exactly what I use it for. Find out the artist, song, album, grab my keys and buy the CD. I would rather claw my eyes out or be boiled in oil then hear the inferior quality of downloaded music plus it is frankly the right thing to do and if I can not afford an 15 buck cd then I guess I will have to sell my boat, car, house and everythign else. At 128Kbit rate and even lower were most have thier music stored I am not sure how anyone enjoys downloaded music it.
I absolutly care what impact it has on the industry as rise in DVD prices from people ripping cd's and dvd's has raised the price that I pay in the store!!! There ya go you are costing me money :p :p Also as a system integrator every time that they come up with new software that is not backwards compatable then I get all the calls from my customers that are pissed because their stuff no longer works....

As for your DVD shrink being legal keep on dreeming. To record off the DVD (a part or whole)you have to break the anti piracy code. To break the code you have to break the law unless you purchase a license to do so. I can guarantee that you do not have the license if you downloaded free software. The license is I believe 3 grand and at that you ARE NOT allowed to alter the DVD in any way. You have to record the entire DVD with trailers and all. I hope that you are not relying on the web site that you downloaded your software from for the info that says that it is legal...... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: Remember all the Cable descrambler people used to say that it was legal to own the boxes..... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: I can not imagine that you think that it is ok to get your Netflix and rip a copy for yourself. You have only paid to use the DVD NOT rip a copy for yourself or so your kids do not loose it or scratch it....

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Hey now, nobody here (me included) needs to get all huffy and pissed on this thread unless they are pirating for profit.

Jon has a valid point and I think we all need to nod our heads and understand that DVD copying for any purpose other than self-archiving is illegal. Period. Same goes for CDs. Same goes for traveling 20 over the speed limit, or 5 over, or 1 over. It's all against the law.

Now obviously we have to put it in proper context.

(my thoughts)
If a piece of software can decode a DVD and allow you to change its compression, etc., then maybe that software is illegal. As far as I'm concerned, if the software is illegal, that is between the author/distributor of the software and whatever authority polices them.

If I plan to archive my own DVD's that I bought for my own personal usage, then if I use illegal software or legal software to achieve the same goal, then that's my call. Shouldn't be an issue, as long as I have no intention of using those copies outside of my own home.
(end of my thoughts)

Sure people will use Kaaza because it exists. I contend that Kaaza exists BECAUSE INDUSTRY WAS GOUGING the consumers. Otherwise, Kaaza wouldn't exist. Or maybe it would exist, but only on some crappy hard to operate level.

Jon is our resident AV guru. He is entitled to his box to preach from. If he feels strongly about this issue, there is no reason to ask him to stay quiet about it. Doesn't mean anybody has to adopt his opinion. I don't quite share his opinion, at least not the specifics of it, as he has presented it...

Let's all settle.


Jon:
(yep, you got me: it is "intellectual property law")
And, no, I picked up a VX-1c last December on your recommendation. Paid $2000 for it (wouldn't mind an anamorphic lens for it, though). But if you've got something really cool coming in on trade, let me know.

mc

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

MC I can sleep well knowing that the COURTS are on my side. They to date have not sided with the people ripping info no matter what format that it may be. EVEN for self archiving. I personally feel that self archiving should be legal IF you only rip movies that you BUY not RENT. After all there are other units out there that do what the Kaleidescape does for half the cost, even less maybe. The problem is legality issues.

I have the advantage that my father is a patent lawer and he and I have looked into this issue to quite a degree. Last thing that I want to do is open up a multi million air customer to a liability issue that the industry will want to make a example out of.

MC as for your point of they charge to much maybe, maybe not, who knows. I still think that most people that rip music would find that free is free and money is money and if I can save I will. The technology was coming no matter what they charged IMO so...... Human nature is to save money and they as you have said think this a not harming anyone..... From there I only can point to the fact that pay sites like Apple and so on have almost zero downloads compared to the Kaazaa's and what not.

Jon

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

So if my friend steels a car, and I am caught driving it but I knew it was stolen...... :eek: :eek:

Jon

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

:D Boy, I get all the credit??? :p
So now, you say I make you money!!?? Man Jon, make up your mind! LOL :D :D
Well ....... errr uh ... Sure :p :confused: :D

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

nod nod :)
nod nod :D
I never asked anyone to stay quiet? :D and I don't think it would even help to try! LOL :p

Resting quietly now .... aahhhhhhhhhhhh :) Its all good and in fun ... hence the :D :D :p

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Well now come Jon .. they can afford to buy a CD, DVD or 2 :D :D lol

Last thoughts ... It is funny this all came up now (for me) I have friends that just put out a music CD (liveforevernow.net ,,, check it out) and of course bought the new CD, love it BTW :) , and discussions came up between myself, the wifey, friends (not the musicians) about what was right and honest to do:

- Buy the original copy ... which I have done ... and then burn the kids copies for their listening enjoyment, as well as a copy for my wife??!

- Or ... buy 3 additional copies of the CD (1 for each 2 kids and 1 for wife)?? :eek: :eek:

Well, needless to say my wife won and convinced me (I kinda agreed anyway deep down) we should buy total of 4 CDs :ouch: :)

So what is your opinion Jon??? Like I really need to ask! lol ... and you, mcollinstn??? I think I know your answer as well ;)

L8R Chris

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

I can not believe I did not see this earlier. You make it to easy...

There is also no being a little bit of a theif, or sort of stealing..... :D:D

Ok on a serious note what example to we set for our kids? I mean they know full well it is illegal but we tell them it is ok?

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Ok now for your question. Man you must be cheaper then I ever imagined!!!! You wont buy more then one CD from a FRIEND!!! :eek: :eek: :p :p :D Your wife is correct...... of course...... get used to it she seems to be smarter then you... :eek: :drink:

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Uuummmm, that was my whole point about you dude! Follow along ... Remember? along with the line in the sand comment??? :confused: Like I said before I buy or rent everything at that point we may agree, to disagree :)

Again ... that is the entire 'arguement' in a nutshell (I was conceeding and my friends musical effort threw it right in my face :D :D ) Buy? Not buy? ... 1, 2, 3?? does the # really make the difference?? It's the crux/basis of/to the issue ;)

I will never argue about your last point ... that's a no brainer ... no pun intended :p :p

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Remember my friend and my relative? They both release CD's every so often.

I bought 20 CD's of my relative's (the musician) CD to give to people.

When my friend's CD's come out, he (the artist) gives me 20 to pass out. Then he burns me a handfull if I run out.
*********************************************

Modeling for our kids. Yessir. Teaching them to burn CD's is a hideous thing. Letting them watch you tell the waitress they are 9 (when they are 11) to get the kid discount - tht's bad too. Letting them watch you change lanes without signalling first - that's another one. Watching you decide for the family to spend the weekend on the boat instead of coming in and going to church - another biggie.

I suppose all unethical/illegal/immoral/etc. acts are best to NEVER be witnessed by a child. But at some point these children will have to make value decisions on their own. It is a bit simplistic to think that a child is capable of NEVER making a bad value decision regardless of whether they have never witnessed one by their parents. In fact, it may be practically useful for a child to have witnessed some transgressions by their parents in order to develop some healthy level of prioritizing those transgressions. Maybe not.

There are children from drunken families who turn out to be drunks. There are also children from drunken families who turn out to be teetotallers. Abusive families sometimes breed abusive children - sometimes NOT.

A household that rips CDs may or may not create a horde of music pirates. Dunno.

I do know that my kids know the difference between legal music and illegal music. They do understand that the downloaded music is NOT legally obtained. They also know the difference between illegally obtained music that is used to profit from and the same music used to create a background track for a theme party. Their brains are complete and intact with the mental image of Uncle Brent sitting poor and penniless because people downloaded his music instead of buying it.

I accept that I am a bad parent.
I teach my kids to do burnouts. I wheelie while doubling them on sportbikes. They see me drink beer on occasion. I teach them to jump wakes on jetskis closer than the legal limit. I show them how to download music. I tell the people at theme parks they are younger than they are to get discounts. I'm sure there's more.

And my bad kids are compassionate, sweet kids. Their teachers rave about them. They are chosen for special projects at school. They get grades at the absolute top of their class, as well as scores on formal achievement tests that consistently place them in the national recognition level. They aren't ashamed to hug and kiss on their dad in front of their peers. They got tons of friends. Their friends' parents gush about how happy they are to have our kids spend the night, etc..

So thankfully, Dad's horrible badness hasn't ruined them yet. There's still hope.

I guess a DVD burner, though, may push them over the edge and transform them into corrupt thieving savages. I'll do my best to make sure they don't get one.

Re: DVD Copy Software Question
 

Ditto .. MC ... on almost all examples :) REPENT and turn from your wicked ways! BTW ... My kids are even better than yours!! (of course, right) he he LMAO! :D :D :p