The ultimate "poor man's Drive"
 

Last year after going through 2 drives with a Crockett 565 Whipple 935HP, 1000 LB torque engine, I have finally arrived at the conclusion that drives are the weak link. It took me too long to get to this conclusion. Duh. Try $20,000. Max, IMCO, Teague Platinum, (basically shiftable Bravo style outdrives), are not up to the hp/torque that current technology has been able to generate.

Is the NSX Merc skinny trans/Gimble/Six drive the answer? I know that I would'nt be getting a new boat, (we are talking more money, slower boat). If this is the answer, I would have been exceedingly better off to be 2 years younger, (I'm 59), and been introduced to the NSX tranny concept now. What do you think?. Quent

Hey bud I hear you loud and clear! I dont want to go to that extreme plus you will scrub power and speed from the number 6 drive. We are waiting for one last try. We have gone through all brands none hold up what they claim. There maybe a new choice soon coming from Pfaff racing dont know when they will be introduced but they claim handling 1000hp motors. They are being tested on a 1500hp motor right now with great results. No promises here but if its true we are lined up with one as soon as possible.

Surface Drives
Zf marine is one. There are others out also.

http://zf-marine.com/ZFR/Surface_Dri...SC=1024:768:32

Another big name.
Arneson
http://www.arneson-industries.com/

Neither will work for me. ZF have to redo the back of the boat from previous gimble housing (not cost effective -) . Arnesons bravo conversion kit is only good for 750lbs of torque.

I rate them at 850 lbs of torque.

What size boat do you have? I

Why not just buy a Konrad with the tranny in the extension box????

Two words.....KONRAD MARINE!

Called konrad he plan said they will not handle a 1000hp. Having good luck around 800hp but still have failures.

"The ASD6 Kit comes with a one year warranty with a 750 lbs of torque rating along with a transmission that is suited for the application." Straight from the site.

Plus we are around a 1000 ft lbs .

Rik we are running a 27 eliminator

Also Rik if you do have a possible application for me how are the handling characteristics? Have heard some people say the handle different.

approx. 4500 lbs boat

Konrad won't warranty it, but there are several larger boats than your out there with 1000HP + running Konrads with great results. Alot of it has to do with the driver on the stick. Not infering you are not a good throttle.

I will be doing the same with about 975 HP soon in a 5200# boat with the Konrad ACE. See the Pantera section for my conversion.

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...d.php?t=147043

I wish you luck in your quest, but I think the Konrad or others with a transmission would suit you fine.

Sorry, I was referring to the ASD7M Drive Kit. I rate it at 850 and that is conservative to say the least.

I have several older 24-25's Daytona's, and a new 30' Eliminator Daytona. 28' Warlocks. All handle fine around the docks and at speed and all have about the same power you have.

Your engine is fine with that boat and the #7M.

Handling, ask Rock Pirate there is more incorrect rumors than facts so don't be worried by what you hear from in-experienced people.

Have you run the BMax HT, it's warrantied to 950hp/tq.? If so, how did it hold up?

I thought I heard somewhere they've never had a failure?

Yeah same hear thats why we called and talked to them personally.Trust me if they had no failures they would warranty 1000hp motors.Konrads are only guaranteed for like 700-750 ft lbs of torque I believe not positive. I think there is a market for a drive that can handle more abuse thats why they all try to build them. Calling Bmax tomorrow about the HT to see if my gimble and hyd streering will work on there drive. Then Arnesons to see how much to change everything over. Keep you posted

I'd probably trust the Arneson over the others. I would think you would get some more top speed with a surface drive, too.

Michael

I have the HT's on my Apache. The first year I owned the boat I had IMCO Extreme SC's and blew two of them in 20 hrs. I switched over to the HT's last year and had a 70 hr trouble free season.

My motors were blower motors that made about 715 hp and 750 ft. lbs. This year we made some changes to the motors and they'll probably be over 800 hp maybe even 850, I'll find out today... ;)

From the documentation I have the warranty is for 950 hp/tq in a 15K boat.

Here's a few pictures of the upper gears. (5 inch diameter.) These were taken a few weeks ago and with 70 hrs there's not much of a wear pattern on the gears. Just gotta watch your gear ratio, these come in 1.30, some people have lost speed, I only lost 2 mph from 1.50's.

What about #5's, what are they rated for?

I think Merc. rates them to 800 but I've seen people run 1000-1200 hp thru them and live.

what about the Sage #8? There is a Suberboat being built with this drive hooked to a turbine.

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...d.php?t=116625

That trans is huge!That would take my back seat!

Do you know how much the sage drive costs vs arneson 7 or merc 6?

What ever happened with the Weissmann's package?

with all due there is really no scrub or power loss due to the 6 and tranny. as a matter of fact the same boat , same weight same power was faster with the 6's over bravos.(dry sump)

point is there really is no substitution for it in a case like this. you can pick up a used 6 and gimbal for what your gonna spend on a maybe upgrade.

id look around
good luck

But, he then will have to move the engine forward to make room for the trany. Does anyone make a trans in extension box setup for a #6? I know the NXT is like that but it can only be purchased in a package. Can the Konrad Ace transome assembly and box be made to fit a #6? Seems like that would solve the problem.

Here is the details from the link I provided.

Sage # 8 drive $ 20,000
Sage, zero effort shiftable tranny $ 5,000

What reinforcement to the transom is necessary moving from a bravo to a #6?

none if the transom is in good shape.

and if you go 6 youll need to slide the engine forward bout 11-14 inches,

you can also use a waet sump which is less desireable, but more affordable.

monstaaa you are telling it takes less power to turn a transmission and larger gears? I understand dry sump is more efficient than they wet #6 but I cant believe its easier than a bravo one.

I believe it takes more power to turn the trans and #6, but the #6 goes thru the water so much better that you gain with the 6

The 6 is faster because it is dry-sumped and it is also has better hydrodynamics to it.

Hasn't anyone hung the tranny in the standoff box? If they did, what transom requirements are we talking about now?

Check300 put a transmission in a stand off box for #6 on his 30' Check.

Theres a few Bmax's for sale in the classifieds.

Is there a thread on this?

Look familar??

call marine turbine technologies in louissiana
STINGER DRIVE.
WE BUILT IT TO HANDLE TURBINE TORQUE AND LIVE.

That's the one I was talking about! Bam Transmission in the box.. 1400-1500 hp in front of that.

What did they do to distribute the stress of all that weight hanging way back there? Looks like it wants to break off in the rough stuff.

Not knocking it, just dang curious. Arctic, You must be busy, have not seen you around as much lately. How is your testing going?

I been working from 6:30 am to midnight so I'm not around much. I have a guy in Austrailia running a set of prepped gears right now,waiting to hear feedback,I have done atleast 15 sets for various other customers but they are not going to hit the water until this summer.
As far as Check 300,he passed me going 20-30 mph faster than I was going before at wot and I didn't see any fibreglass breaking off his boat:evilb: ,from what I have been told and seen he has his set-up dialed in very well,Smitty