Ok, so the great OHC engines from Ford are better in what ways over the LS ?? only make more power with lots of boost, fuel mileage ? nope..why do you think Ford trying a aluminum body in the F150(good luck with that) to get economy..reliability ?? spark plug clusterf@#k, timing chains ??? No thanks...I'll stick with simplicity of the "old" pushrod engines, not that they don't all have there shortcomings....

fords ohc is more efficient any way you look at it. not that i was trying to start an argument in anyway with my post. but since you want to.

yes they do make more power with lots of boost. (more efficient)

the 4.6 block is the strongest production block in the history of the world. it went 6s in the quarter years ago. what chevy,toyota,dodge,honda, lambo, etc has thought about that without an aftermarket block. (sorry it may have been a filled block.) close enough to production for me.

economy. ever wonder why the gt500 /GT didnt have a fuel tax and the camaro / vette did? (More efficient)

spark plug issues.
a very small percentage of early 2v 4.6 blew them out. any hack worthy of owning a craftsmen tool set could helicoil and repair it.
3 valve. im sure youve heard horror stories on dealerships having to pull heads and replace engines do to sparkplugs being stuck in heads. i wont say ive change spark plugs on hundreds of 3v trucks. but i will say i have changed hundreds of spark plugs on 3v trucks. guess what ive never broke one off. i run an in induction cleaner through them first ( seafoam etc) and let them set until room temp. then i put a 3/8 impact on the plug very lightly. in may take 5 sec to 10 minutes for a plug to come out. but they come out. (not more efficient lol)

external packaging. as far as looks and fitting into a tight spot go. the ls wins hands down.

now the new 5.0 next generation mod motors. gm has nothing for them. piston cooling nozzles etc from the factory. 800hp at the wheels from a bolt on procharger is nothing to sneeze at.

and now we are even moving onto the next generation from them allready in 2016 with a flat plane crank and an 8,200 redline from the factory.

Man you stole my trick! Actually Fords service procedure for removing the plugs works very well to.

I talked at length to ATI about building me a balancer with a 58X wheel made into it, while keeping the same external dimensions of a standard balancer. We did all of the drawings, measurements, etc. I just never pulled the trigger on it. It was pretty pricey, but sure would simplify things. My only issue was that if/when you had to replace it, it was expensive at more than twice the price of a standard ATI balancer.

GT performance makes the 1 piece coil brackets .

I believe they have them or can make them.i saw them at my buddies shop.i'm checking on it right now.

They told me that they can certainly make them. Like I said, we had all the measurements and drawings finalized and ready to go. I just never pulled the trigger personally. That was really just due to price and limited use. A lot of customers already had a good balancer so why would they want to but another one that was more than twice the price when we could just add a trigger wheel. It was a really sharp piece though. This was several years ago, so maybe they started making it anyway.

does that work when the plug comes apart ?

they make one,,8-10 weeks to get them.waiting on a price.

ok, 1st the GT 500 DID in fact have the gas guzzler tax hung right on the window sticker, the spark plug theasco on these are well documented, costing owners tons of $$$$ and also rest my case..lots of boost to get power, I'm not arguing the fact that the newer 5.0's dont run good..but look at the cost...the whole deal there is $$$$ and if you want to spend that kind of $$$ in your mod motor, thats fine...just let us know what it cost

I give you credit for talking the "F" word on here. I gave up on this clear observation a while back. Can you imagine running a poker run with 704 Hp and then idling down a river for maybe hours efficiently (300cu, no huge cams). Unfortunately, the Bowtie vs. Blue Oval battle is more important than actual facts to some. Just my opinion. I personally don't care, I'm more of a technology guy.

He's a couple quotes below and a link below from Hot Rod Magazine.

Though limited in displacement (3.623 bore, 3.653 stroke), the Coyote offers a specific output of 82.4 hp per liter (1.364 hp per inch), a number not equaled by Ford or Chevy on any of their normally aspirated V-8s. Credit for the impressive power numbers go to a combination of massive flow (nearly 300 cfm) from the 4-valve, aluminum heads. The overhead-cam design lends itself to impressive engine speed, though the peak power output of 412 hp comes at just 6500 rpm while the torque peak comes at 4250 rpm. This 2250-rpm spread between the horsepower and torque is a clear indication that the Coyote offers not just impressive peak power but a broad torque curve.

Quote 2

The Coyote crate motor offered a stock specific output unmatched over in Chevy land. Run on the dyno with the long-tube headers, the otherwise stock 5.0L produced 462 hp and 411 lb-ft of torque. Credit high-flow, 4-valve cylinder heads (that flow nearly 300 cfm) and variable cam timing for the impressive specific output.

Please don't bash me for this. Again, I'm and GM and Ford guy.



Read more: http://www.hotrod.com/events/coverag...er-adder-test/

$6100 for a complete NEW engine is a lot? And a complete LS will save you $1000's??? For those who don't know, the spark plug problem was redesigned a few years ago. Dead issue. Old News. All manufactures had something they regret.

Now that this thread has been FULLY hijacked ,can we get back to DIS!!!!!! ????!!!

http://fordracingpartsbydonwood.com/...gVPBoCv4Pw_wcB

Reason the plugs came appart was the u shaped eletrode and part of the body was made of inconel and was crimped to steel (as it inconel wont weld to steel) also inconel coroads in the presents of cheep porclin. When I found out about it triggered my memory years back when I was designing stationary turbo test cells for Schwitzer. I was studying what materials to use inconel, wasp alloy and other materials used most comonly used in jet engines and remembered specks listing issues with porcelain.

I did help a friend at ford to design a cover to hold down solinoids for a camless valve train. Problem was how much eletrical power needed to run the solinoids.

Fords 300 CFM heads not sure about those figures as Ford measures flow at 68 inches and standard is 28in so if thats a ford fllow bench figure at 28 flow would be 190ish. I used to port a lot of cobra 4 valve heads was getting 320 CFM at .600 lift @ 28in thinking as cast was 260 CFM its been years since working on a set.

If the plug comes apart you need a puller. But it has been my experience if you follow Fords removal procedure the plugs don't come apart. I've probably done 20 or so with no breakage. B4 I found out about the Ford procedure I was putting penetrating oil in the hole and telling the customer to drive it for a couple of days then bring it back. This worked great and never had a breakage. The only time I've had to extract plugs is when someone else worked on it previously.

They were in the $800 area. That was several years ago though. Also, they weren't actually making it at the time, so maybe that caused the price to jump since it was a custom deal. It may have come down if they are actually producing them now. Let me know Bill. I still think about using them and wish I would have pursued it sometime.

I've seen them.granted only 4.

So what components are needed to fully assemble a crank trigger system starting with a new build using say a Holley EFI system. Is crank position sensor all that is needed for spark and fuel triggering? I am in the process of doing homework on a blow through EFI system now. I would assume any blank distributor can be in place to drive the oil pump if its not needed for anything else.

Yes, Only the crank sensor is needed to control both spark and fuel when operating a batch fire injection and waste spark ignition modes. If you want sequential injection/single plug ignition then you need a cam sync sensor to let the computer know what stroke the engine is on. You can use a factory GM distributor with a cam sync sensor (4x I believe) and just get a cover to replace the distributor cap.

As Gimme mentioned, if you want to run sequential, you need to have a cam position sensor. In the case of the Mefi, the cam sensor allows you to run 2 knock sensors and have individual cylinder knock retard. With the Mefi, we make a 1x cam sensor that takes the place of the distributor. I'm not sure what the Holley uses. Haxby could better answer that. You can have DIS without the cam sensor, but it's so easy to incorporate it. There are some that are commercially available. I just didn't really care for them. The have a cast housing with a stamped steel wheel. They just look cheap to me. That's why we did a billet aluminum piece. It has a larger shaft, sealed roller bearings, the wheel is hard coat anodized, etc. Obviously, it costs more than the cast one, but I think it's worth it.

That's a nice looking piece. Is that available for sale?

It sure is. I'll send you a pm
Eddie

http://www.accel-ignition.com/produc...s+Shine+at+PRI


Video of Accel coils if that helps anyone as to what they are offering nowadays.

Some people said the same thing about nascar engines making 500hp back in the 80s.

You're incorrect. As long power density is the real metric worth considering and not specific output, pushrod engines will have a future.

The Holley ECM can work with both the 4x and 1x cam syncs. It can read the 1x sensor 3 ways, from a magnetic signal, or reading a rising or falling edge. I just checked the settings in the software - Very configurable. You can choose to go waste fire with the coil packs, or individual coil on plug. Holley loosely recommends one of the cast type housings Eddie was talking about - I agree, cheap looking. Eddie's piece looks very nice.

How good does the housing need to be in order to spin the pickup?

Just wondering has anyone tried using an msd 6012 to run the coils?

Yeah, I hear you... my thought is if the housing is cheap, then the distributor gear and oil pump shaft coupler could be too. Maybe that's a stretch, but I definitely wouldn't want a racing engine running a Chinese distributor using pot metal parts or the material used for XR gears :party-smiley-004: ensuring that my oil pump keeps turning :)

I have.carbed 6.2 denali motor in a wake board boat.ran and idled really nice.

I was thinking about mounting the Ls reluctor to a bbc crank...

I thought the trick was to use a distributor out of a vortex motor. You can use a GM melonized gear which are the best...

you can,,I have 2.only problem is the body is plastic and some think it may not be strong or accurate enough for higher lift cams.high lift cams need more spring pressure and may screw w/ the pick up in cam sensor body while driving the oil pump and such.

not a bad idea,,would that be a 58 or 24 tooth?

well there out of stock.damn
do they make one for a 58 tooth?

I was thinking 58 tooth. Seems like a pretty involved project for a Mark iv block. I have the reluctor wheel worked out in my head just don't know how to work out the crank sensor mounting. Gen 6 is no problem 4 is a different story...

Actually, just thought of an idea. POS Audi's are good for something. Have to make an adjustable bracket for the crank sensor.

I just don't see it. The only thing I could see that would have an effect on the housing is the oil pump and the fact that the cam gear is going to try to pull the distributor gear into itself. The steel shaft in the housing is a steel shaft in either housing. Spring pressure is going to twist the cam and change the timing regardless of what the distributor housing is made out off.

thats a good price but

this is just a touch better.been on the fence for years on doing the conversion.just haven't found a need yet.

http://www.jegs.com/i/Chevrolet-Perf...60247/10002/-1

The info I found for what it's work says the GM kit is very poor quality.