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MILD THUNDER 02-18-2016 08:28 AM


Originally Posted by Panther (Post 4405581)
After doing a lot of research I think I'm leaning away from the EQ heads for this build and I'll state the reasons why.

First, it has nothing to do with the quality of the head. From what I'm reading and hearing they're a good head.

However, I don't think the head is going to meet the needs of my build primarily because the intake runner is too large (320 cc). I'm building a 509" MPI engine and there is a lot of restriction in the throttle body and more importantly the intake manifold. With a 320 CC intake running, it's probably going to have most of it's power gains above 5000 rpms and this engine is going to be a 5200+/- engine.

EQ also makes a replacement GM head but looking at the spec sheet, there's no real advantage (in my opinion) of going with that head because it doesn't have a rolled valve angle, raised exhaust port, upgraded valve seats or bronze guides for example. So even though it's cheaper, it doesn't meet my needs.

I feel that I need to put a head on this package which has a smaller intake runner such as the Edlebrock Performer RPM, Victor Jr, AFR 290 or largest port being the Dart Iron Eagle 308 CNC.

Just my opinion, but i wouldnt write a head off simply on port volume. If the part is designed properly, it will have better airspeed and flow. The stock merc head has similar volume, however, the overall flow and port speed is lacking. Hence why if you were to swap that merc head, out for even a 335cnc afr head, you will still likely see more torque and power across the board from better cylinder filling.

Big ports dont necessarily mean poor airspeed, and small ports dont necessarily mean better airspeed.

I know of a builder who recently did a pair of 525 merc upgrades. 525 has edelbrock rectangles, which arent big flowing heads, and have a 315cc port, made 650 plus ft lbs of torque, and around 590ish hp at 5300.

Id be hard pressed to believe, that the EQ head, with its good airflow, good wet flow characteristics, would perform any less than those edelbrock stock exhaust port location heads .

The afr 290 is a sweet head, but whats the price difference ?

phragle 02-18-2016 08:30 AM


Originally Posted by Panther (Post 4405595)
Thanks for the info! I'm expecting this build to be around 500/525hp.

Arcticfriends has a thread going with a lot of dyno time wth the mpi intake and different throttle bodies

MILD THUNDER 02-18-2016 08:31 AM

Ive seen where guys go in and port heads , and gain power afterwords. If properly done. This sometimes involves doing some bowl blending, thinning of guide bosses, and other cleanup. The material removed that increased flow, also increased the actual volume of the port. But the engine made more power and torque from better low lift and mid lift airflow and cylinder filling.

Pour an intake runner on most of these heads, esp ones that have had some cleaning up, and compare the actual cc's, of both ports, to the advertised port volume. You may be surprised.

Panther 02-18-2016 08:37 AM


Originally Posted by phragle (Post 4405599)
Arcticfriends has a thread going with a lot of dyno time wth the mpi intake and different throttle bodies

I've been watching it, it's a great thread. Very informative.

The intake runner/plenum is going to be modified but not the TB on this build unless the owner wants to invest in it.

Panther 02-18-2016 08:41 AM

There's no data out there that I can find supporting running the EQ heads on a 502/509 MPI build. I have to put my name on these and I'm not going to take a chance with an unknown combo. They may very well be a good choice, I'm just not willing to take the chance without hard data for this exact combo. If it were my own, I might take a chance but not with someone else.


Originally Posted by MILD THUNDER (Post 4405598)
Just my opinion, but i wouldnt write a head off simply on port volume. If the part is designed properly, it will have better airspeed and flow. The stock merc head has similar volume, however, the overall flow and port speed is lacking. Hence why if you were to swap that merc head, out for even a 335cnc afr head, you will still likely see more torque and power across the board from better cylinder filling.

Big ports dont necessarily mean poor airspeed, and small ports dont necessarily mean better airspeed.

I know of a builder who recently did a pair of 525 merc upgrades. 525 has edelbrock rectangles, which arent big flowing heads, and have a 315cc port, made 650 plus ft lbs of torque, and around 590ish hp at 5300.

Id be hard pressed to believe, that the EQ head, with its good airflow, good wet flow characteristics, would perform any less than those edelbrock stock exhaust port location heads .

The afr 290 is a sweet head, but whats the price difference ?


Panther 02-18-2016 08:48 AM

2 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by Panther (Post 4405603)
I've been watching it, it's a great thread. Very informative.

The intake runner/plenum is going to be modified but not the TB on this build unless the owner wants to invest in it.

Phragle, a friend has a nice lathe in his garage and modified his EFI intake a number of years ago so he's gonna hook a brotha up! I'll also port match the intake to the head.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]551227[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]551228[/ATTACH]

Gimme Fuel 02-18-2016 08:58 AM


Originally Posted by Panther (Post 4405595)
Thanks for the info! I'm expecting this build to be around 500/525hp.

Buddy of mine is doing a stock headed/fairly stock intake build 502mpi and is expecting about the same 500-525 hp result. You should see 525 easily in the iron eagles and some intake massaging easily. If not 550

SB 02-18-2016 09:29 AM

With the intake being such a choke point, even if mildy worked on, I would think the larger runner heads (320) which include OEM would not be a 'good' choice. I would think the Iron Eagle 308's would be the better choice here.

A lot of thinking huh ?

BTW: Speaking of 'smaller heads' On the net , Saw a few AFR 300 's (roval) go nuts on power. One 460cid and one 555. 460 had 11.1 compression and went to 800hp. I believe the 555 went 850.

BTW#2 Panther: I would strive for a little better transition into the top of those MPI runners than what is shown in the pic. At the min, round over that center divider. Remeember, air has mass, and when it goes into those runners as in the pic, air will try to flow towards the center of the runner (again, at the runner) and effectively make that section of the runner act if it was narrower.

Panther 02-18-2016 09:55 AM


Originally Posted by SB (Post 4405622)
BTW#2 Panther: I would strive for a little better transition into the top of those MPI runners than what is shown in the pic. At the min, round over that center divider. Remeember, air has mass, and when it goes into those runners as in the pic, air will try to flow towards the center of the runner (again, at the runner) and effectively make that section of the runner act if it was narrower.

I agree! I think that pic was taken right off the mill and it was smoothed over by hand. That's what I intend on doing with this.

Panther 02-18-2016 09:56 AM

Also, Dart now has a CNC 308 which I think is a good choice over the regular 308.


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