is kip designing the cam or is he grinding a cam specked by a cam designer?i am curious as to how that part happens.

From what I know Kip grinds what he is asked to...

Maybe I misunderstood the conversations. But, I was under the impression that Kip writes the lobes. At this point my personal oppinion on the matter is there is more than one person/ company to blame. Ask yourself this Mike. If you were subletting work from another company and you were producing garbage in the process would you let that stuff out your door? Myself I couldn't do it. I'm not that good of a business person. If someone brings me a job and wants me to do something sub-par I tell them to go down the street cause I'm not doing it. It's either my way or no way.

I will think long and hard before I do business with either company in the future.

I'm not sure how it works, but I think that's correct. Bob specs the lobe and then Kip has some software that will write a cnc file to cut the lobe. I have used some Cam motion cams in the past with great results, and I know they are very concerned with lobe stability. I have personally seen where their milder profile made more power and was easier on parts in a 2500hp TT small block Ford. I think it's similar to the Merc CMI thing. Merc spec'd a part, and CMI delivered. They (merc) are technically the end user as far as cmi is concerned. I doubt Kip gets much feedback on the cams he grinds for Bob, because Bob refuses to accept that there could possibly be an issue with his designs.

It shouldnt matter if Marty Moose is grinding the cam. If the delivered product sucks, it sucks.

FYI I think a person building an engine has to first define what the operating range and purpose will be for that engine, with that said I have gone to various cam companies and selected cams that I thought would be best for each application. some off the shelf and a limited amount custom ground by the leading cam companies, it al about what the end use will be. Examples my 427 Vette received a standard shelf Crane stick, my 302 ford motor (68 Cougar) received a shelf cam from Bullet, In my 69 Camaro 396 12.5:1 solid roller cam I had Comp grind me a custom cam (basic # as follows, event #s if interested can post later) intake duration 263.3 Ex 274, In lift .64814. Ex .64654 +4 deg Different base circles intake and Exhaust this cam is very easy on the valve train, Boat cams Harold Brookshire worked with me as I was doing extensive Cly. head testing and wanted to enhance mid range Cyl. filling we decided to go .609 lift with 238/ 246 duration very stable valve train and believe it or not combined with the correct Cyl. head work makes very respectable power. I run all these cars still today and my advise check around to all the well known companies and it you don't see what you want THEN have them grind you a custom stick for your desired results.

Great post Abones. The one thing I would hope people can learn from all this is, if you're going to have a custom cam ground, make sure whoever is doing it is using proven engineered lobes that have been tested. Every cam manufacturer has a catalog of lobes, and will know their characteristics. I think these "one off" lobes are even more of a problem then the sometimes compromised valve events. That being said, EVO needs to be in a safe range on boosted apps. Don't try to go after some free hp here on marine hydraulic roller engines

How do you know if you have a one off lobe or a proven one etc. ? Even if someone gave you the specifics how would you know?

When the cam card/ print out from the cam doctor says custom its custom. Also if it has a BM stamped on the end of it that means it's custom.

But surely all customs can't be bad because they are all different. How do you differentiate?