Mufflers with dry exhaust?
 

Just curious as to what you guys have run for mufflers on dry exhaust? I called Teague today and the idiot there told me to go to autozone and clamp on a set of car mufflers. My set up is Lightning headers ( the same idiot at Teague said Lightnings are junk) with solid tails that run through the transom and the water exits out of thru-hull fittings. I'm looking for something clamp-on. The tails are 4". Any help is greatly appreciated!!!

We run the CMI mufflers but on CMI exhaust where the tail pipe tips have a notch to allow water to be dumped at the end of the tip. This keeps the CMI switchable mufflers to be cooled open or closed....sure this is clear.

Yeah, I talked to the guy from CMI today and he said without water I'd just burn the mufflers up. Which is a shame cause a guy on here has a good deal on a set of their Sound Eliminator mufflers. I just can't have any water in my exhaust stream due to reversion. I'm running a 408ci LS motor and it sucks water like crazy. Even with the exhaust dry to the tip, it reverted. So instead of changing my cam, I went dry on the exhaust. It's pretty loud, and I am just looking to get rid of the "crackle" of the exhaust. Good thing is, if I can't run anything I don't have any kind of sound level laws on my lake, so I can deal with it.

I did pick pick up a set of Drew Marine Shotgun mufflers but those aren't a clamp on. I would have to drill a hole through both tubes of the exhaust to mount them and that won't work cause of the water being able to enter the exhaust stream if I do that. I could cut and weld on them and make them a clamp on style, but I hate to do that if there is something that I can just bolt on and sell these.

Thanks again guys!!

Not sure I am following you as we having no CMI reversion issues. We are set-up with CMI dry tail pipes where the water dumps at the tip of the tail pipes into the CMI mufflers. You are saying that water is reverting because of the CMI mufflers? What is your angle of fall on the tail pipes? We are using a fairly aggressive cam profile and we have had 0.00 issues with reversion.

No, not saying that at all. I have reversion without any kind of muffler at all, even when the exhaust was dry all the way to the tip outside of the transom. So to fix that, I made them completely dry. They are still jacketed, just now the water exits out of the top of the tail just inside the transom and exits out of thru-hull fittings. No water in the exhaust stream = No reversion. Now I am just looking for mufflers that can be used with no water in the exhaust stream. I called CMI about their Sound Eliminator Mufflers and he said they can't be run with no water in the exhaust.


Just to reiterate, I no longer have any kind of reversion issue. I just want to see if there are any mufflers out there that would work with dry exhaust.

Now following you, we dump 90% +/- water into our CMI tail pipes thru the transom but still get a small amount of water mist between the inter & outer tail pipe wall at exit. This water (heavy mist into the CMI mufflers) does not revert in our setup.

Just a guess, but I doubt you will "burn up" the muffler. You will of course lose the polish and they will look like crap, but should hold up ok.

Well, apparently the CMI's have some o-rings and seals inside them and that's what I would burn up. But you are right cause I also talked to the guy from Aqua Power today as well and that's what he said. They would turn brown and blue and look like crap eventually.

GGB's will definitely be fine with dry exhaust...don't know how much quieter they'll be run dry ? I'd look into it.
They make many different OD's and maby different lengths (# of baffles)

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/01...53818170728298http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/012...g?v=1435761902http://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/321652...-1/s-l1000.jpghttp://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/221673...-1/s-l1000.jpg

When i started using my dyno i had giant semi or tractor mufflers, i found they still cost 15 to 20 hp though, it may have been exhaust reversion though where 6" tube slipped over 5" tube. I had a set of 5" 400$ gibson clampons laying around and stuck them on the 5" pipes, they cost about 3 hp at 550 hp, cost 7 to 10 at 700 hp. After 100 pulls they still look fine and there is nothing in thembto burn out, might be a viable, cheap option for you! How much hp we talking?

The motor makes right at 600hp.

I actually like the GGB idea. I have some extra polished 4" stainless pipe laying around that I could fab up some clamp on mufflers with those inserts. I'll have to check on them, but I am not going to get too crazy with it cause like I said, my home lake (Lake Cumberland) doesn't have any sound laws, I was just looking to take the edge off the exhaust sound. I have also bought some new exhaust manifolds and will be fabricating a whole new exhaust system that will have a pair of those mufflers that look like snails and whistle, but those won't go on for at least a year.

Thanks Guys!!

I have never heard the term 'snails and whistle.' Maybe it's my isolated part of the country. :) Are you talking the auger (screw) type ? These typically cost power. My mild SBC loses almost 3mph with them installed. So say, almost 30hp.

That would be correct. I didn't realize there were o- rings, etc.inside. Heat would definitely toast the rubber. I was thinking more along the line of the Gibson exhaust that somebody else also mentioned. There is nothing inside those to burn. But, again without the water to cool them (water also does help with the sound!) they will get pretty ugly probably after the first run. As fas as the GGB's are concerned. I'm sure they are effective. Personally they scare me. Many years ago I had a dirt bike with the same set up in the exhaust. Now I understand the oil mixed in the gas makes the exhaust a lot dirtier, I get it. However, I had to clean them after every run or the holes gummed up and I lost power. Cleaning them was very time consuming and a complete pain. I tossed them. Probably wouldn't happen in this application, but they are not for me!

Double post.... I hate this new layout

I'm pretty sure these won't cost me any power..... :)

http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/a...s/IMAG1170.jpg

oh. they look like snails and make a whistling sound...and you are at 600 now? won't be the slowest small block, that's for sure.

Nice ! And yes, snails and whistles is a fitting term. Now in my vocabulary.

^^^^^^LOVE^^^^^^^^ Carry on!

I agree either the Gibson inserts or the Bullet Mufflers would be your best option being full dry, the Inserts being the option that wouldn't look like crap over time. Should slide right up the tails unless they aren't a straight shot out the transom and maintain the cleanest look. Would most likely help with reversion potential to dampen the exhaust pulses a bit too. That LS firing order tends to make reversion worse, ask me how I know! Haha.

and they would look better than the semi mufflers...

What about using the Gibson Power Curves? To direct the sound toward the water? If you are worried about reversion, then mount them so they do not sit below the waterline..???

Is GGB Gibson? Or another company that has a g in their name? Do they make a self contained muffler, or just inserts?

I never really thought about those. I don't really care for how they look, but they might work. I'll have to look into them, thanks!!

GGB is not Gibson. I have their inserts in dry stainless marine pipes and they make a big difference, very happy with them.

Teague seemed rather rude.

Padraig

When you do the turbo(s?) you could cam back enough to lose the reversion. The engine will still make mucho ponies due to the forced induction.
Have you looked into turn downs? With the overlap you are running they'd have to be short to avoid reversion wile coming off plane when your boat's nose is high and the following water is high.

Yeah, F@%K Teague. I was planning on spending a couple thousand dollars on that phone call between some mufflers, an oval flame arrestor and some other odds and ends. But by the end of the conversation with whoever the asshat was answering parts questions that day, I'll never give them a cent. He also said I should be running a marine cam, when I explained to him that I got my cam custom ground from a reputable marine specialist, he didn't know what to say. Then when I explained to him that the reversion seems to be inherent to LS motors, the dumb ass didn't even know what an LS motor was.

There will be a lot of things changing when the turbo's go on, the cam being one of them. I am also converting it over to EFI, so that in itself will allow me to widen up the lobe separation which will help the reversion. Actually, with the turbos, the cam won't have to be much bigger than a stock LS cam since I only want to make in the 800hp range being that I am still connecting it to a Bravo 1 drive. So I don't think reversion will be an issue at all with that set up. I will also be doing a piston swap to get the compression ratio down from 10.5:1 to around 9:1.

you shoulda got his name. then called Teague back. sounds like he should be working in McDonalds...

Yup, Teague has been huge for our industry...I'm sure he and others there would love to know this. + it will help out future customers if he is removed or atleast removed from the phone.

Other than the reversion problem would you still do the LS swap?

Absolutly. Can't beat the fact that other than the motor being stroked to a 408, it's a really simple motor. It makes really good power and fully dressed, it weighs 500lbs less than the 454 I took out of the boat. Next I'd love to get my hands on a 28 Pantera with twin big blocks and LS swap them.

Just wanted to update this. Bob Teague called me tonight after he was alerted to a message I submitted on their website and to this thread. Without going into details, he has made everything right, and has earned my future business. He's a real stand up guy and talked with me about my exhaust problem, gave me some options and his honest opinion, which I greatly appreciated. Its good to see that even somebody with as big of a name as his in the marine industry still genuinely cares about the little guy like me. Kinda refreshing.in this day and age.

Sounds like everything worked out with Teague Marine. What solution did you come up with?

Kind of the same thing that had been discussed here. My best option was going to probably be a set of Gibson Bullet clamp-on mufflers, but with no water through them, they wouldn't last as long as they should, and probably wouldn't do as much muffling as they would with water. So, I have decided to just deal with the sound for now. I can't justify spending the money on a set of new mufflers just to destroy/discolor them. And who knows, maybe all the noise will make me get on my turbo build that much faster.

Clamp on's you have to worry about feeding them to the fishes, and they need water.... GGB inserts all the way!! I've used the 5" long and now 8" long competition versions in my 5" dry pipes and absolutely love the sound. With my low transom height, 5" dry pipes were deafening in the rear seat at a 4,000rpm cruise, and barely tolerable in the fronts, even though I'm a hard core noise lover.... Knocks it down alot, but still has a great strong sound - more muscle car than nascar. If you research it, you find people seeing maybe 5-10hp loss with their regular versions, and the same or sometimes nothing measurable on the comp versions.

I actually had stainless marine build my tails with dumps at the bottom, so the bolts for the mufflers could go up thru the dumps and not be seen :) SM puts ramps inside between the inner and outer pipe to help direct the water to the top of the tip when doing bottom dumps. Also tucked the inserts back 3" so they wouldn't be noticable. In video, timing was advanced a good bit for initial startup... Removing the inserts takes about 10 minutes for when I want to be obnoxious...

How do I find the GGB mufflers and see what they have to offer? I have tried their website, but it always asks me to log in and says it's for dealers only.

Happens to me too. Click on their snowmobile link and that works. Sure there is a phone # there.

Edit in : Here https://snowexhaust.ggb.ca/index.php...=cms&id_lang=1

one of the big performance marine parts guys carries them and has all the info - like CPperformance or ? forget who. Less than $300 a pair now I think

I actually found them on eBay of all places. Looks like what I would need it less than $200 a pair. I think I am going to buy a set of their competition series and build my own clamp-ons to test. These LS motors seem to be really sensitive to back pressure changes, so I want to be able to easily remove them if they cause too much power loss. Thanks again everyone!!


Oh, by the way Hang Time 27, that little Cig is SWEET!!!