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https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...8aa4dab85e.png Min 4 Qts and a fitting with hose out the drain plug be my route. Just sayin... |
Originally Posted by dereknkathy
(Post 4679838)
You aren't hitting waves at 60 mph at 5500 rpm. If you see oil pressure at idle you have enough oil to idle. The less you fill, the less you have to mop out of the bilge. At 5000 rpm pump is drawing oil 6 or 7 times as fast as at 750 rpm.
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Originally Posted by Rookie
(Post 4679883)
Drain oil into their bilge? Why? They make vacuum pumps for that...:picard1:
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Originally Posted by getrdunn
(Post 4679877)
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...8aa4dab85e.png Min 4 Qts and a fitting with hose out the drain plug be my route. Just sayin... |
Update:
It was warmer than expected so I got out there after work and got 3 more cycles of clean oil through her (4 total now). Whats coming out is starting to look a little more like oil. The good news is that I found a local Merc master tech who can bring a trailer down to my neighborhood ramp, haul her back to his shop, and pop the heads off to get an idea whats going on in there for a very reasonable cost. We're gonna do it on Wednesday so I'll soon know what the situation is. Thanks everyone for the advice and I'll keep you posted! |
Blown, My Sunsation had the oil drain tubes like you posted from CP performance. While it did save the mess in the bilge, it took forever for the oil to drain. Just a warning.
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Originally Posted by jadento
(Post 4679983)
Blown, My Sunsation had the oil drain tubes like you posted from CP performance. While it did save the mess in the bilge, it took forever for the oil to drain. Just a warning.
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I had a hand pump but bought an electric one from West Marine and much happier with it. It’s 12v with alligator clips so I just set it in the bilge and tend to other duties. It still struggles with cold oil though. I installed one of those drain hoses while the engine was out because there’s no reason not to but haven’t had the chance to use it yet. It does have a threaded fitting on it and may connect it to the extractor pump. |
Originally Posted by blown
(Post 4680001)
even with hot oil?
John |
I was speaking with GoFastBoater yesterday and he told me he's done the same but added another drain plug in the transom just for this. He doesnt even need to get in the bilge now lol. BTW Thanks GoFast for your advice and offer of help!
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There are drain plug set ups you can hook to the hose with a small chain.
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...e79090b1a2.jpg |
Originally Posted by jadento
(Post 4680012)
I have to admit. I never warmed the motors up before draining. I guess after knowing it took forever I just planned to have time to wait.
John |
Also I don't think blown wanted to warm up the water in his crankcase. He wasn't making tea. And his screen name may well have been prophetic.
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Not to be rude at all but somebody might be off their meds. :bong: With 3/8-1/2" clearance from pick up to pan??? You'd be sucking air among destroying components. |
Originally Posted by dereknkathy
(Post 4680036)
Also I don't think blown wanted to warm up the water in his crankcase. He wasn't making tea. And his screen name may well have been prophetic.
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So... I got the news, and gonna go pick up that case of beer...
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Originally Posted by blown
(Post 4680195)
So... I got the news, and gonna go pick up that case of beer...
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Sutphen30 called it: Cracked block. On the outside.
Getrdunn called my need for a case of beer in that circumstance. I cant really explain it as I pumped until -200 was coming out of both exhaust pipes, then put in another gallon of the pink. I even walked out back over the tie bar and drives (my boat is suspended on the lift over the river) and wetted a white paper towel to be sure of the color. I remember this well because I had a lot of difficulty with the other motor on the port side (which are the farthest from the dock), antifreeze was only coming out one pipe so I blocked off the coolant lines on that side and eventually got antifreeze to come out the other pipe using a transfer pump, just before the sun went down. Jason Moffit of C&C marine who has it now said maybe some passages were blocked up and didnt get antifreeze. He also said it takes about 5 gallons per motor and while I cant remember exactly how much I used, im pretty sure it was that much, im guessing 3 gallons per side. Hard lessons. I want to thank Jason for helping me over here. Will report what's next. |
Originally Posted by blown
(Post 4680195)
So... I got the news, and gonna go pick up that case of beer...
Talk to you tomorrow. John |
Originally Posted by getrdunn
(Post 4680201)
Kinda figured as much. Hopefully your just in need of one case for the starboard engine and not TWO for its brother as well. Talk to you tomorrow. John |
Did you run your engines first before putting antifreeze in them? I use to work at a marina in upstate NY. We used -50 and -100 below antifreeze. 5 gallons used on v8 engines. 4 were used on v6. Today i hobby in boat stuff. I winterize my twin engine boat and other boats in the area where I live now. The key is, you must start and run the boat up to operating temperature first. Let it run and start circulating water..... then and only then, start pumping the antifreeze in the block. Fogg the carb or air filter and shut her down at 1/2 gal of antifreeze and she is ready for spring. I have seen several other folks with cracks blocks by starting their engine and not allowing engine to warm up and have that t stat cycle. sorry to hear about the block. |
Originally Posted by MyIsland
(Post 4680250)
Did you run your engines first before putting antifreeze in them? I use to work at a marina in upstate NY. We used -50 and -100 below antifreeze. 5 gallons used on v8 engines. 4 were used on v6. Today i hobby in boat stuff. I winterize my twin engine boat and other boats in the area where I live now. The key is, you must start and run the boat up to operating temperature first. Let it run and start circulating water..... then and only then, start pumping the antifreeze in the block. Fogg the carb or air filter and shut her down at 1/2 gal of antifreeze and she is ready for spring. I have seen several other folks with cracks blocks by starting their engine and not allowing engine to warm up and have that t stat cycle. sorry to hear about the block. The other explanation that crossed my mind was that the coolant passages were partially blocked by corrosion or gunk. But I didnt really know, and after taking the thermostat housings apart 20 times (on top of all the other issues I'd been dealing with since installed) I was pretty happy to see oil temps around 240 and just go boating. |
It just crossed my mind... In my thinking at the time of winterization I'd completely killed the bypass with those spacers, but I cant remember now if the balls were really tight in there (completely stopping flow) or if I left a little bit of slack which would allow the coolant to flow past into the bypass instead of through the block, even with no stats in.
What do "normal" Hp500 guys do about the bypass when they winterize? When I go check the boat next (maybe tomorrow) I'll pull the braided lines off and inspect how tightly I'd blocked off the bypass. |
you should get into the habit of draining the blocks.then put the antifreeze in,should take(bbc) ~6gal.
and I'm sorry for your cracked block. I had the same(I got the pleasure to fix it) milky oil in a whippled hp500efi.A supposed pro shop put 454 felpro head gaskets on and sealant on the head bolts(which were all loose),morons must have thought engine was a 454,he/they couldn't tell that the fire ring was in the bores,unbelievable. all fixed and ready to go back to florida.(yeah,boat got sold and then the engine failed.if the shop doesn't compensate the owner,,I'll gladly rat them out. |
Sorry to hear the news, was it cracked at the drain plug or else where......and as s-30 stated pull the drain plugs and stick a small screw driver in the hole to clean it, I'm working on a pair of 580's for a friend of mine, boats been sitting for a few yrs and when the plugs were pulled one side has been completely blocks all this time, hope their okay and the coolers were full of water. good luck on the rebuild.
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^^^^^ What F-2 Speedy said. I always pull the plugs and drain the water , small screw driver and blow gun to clear the rust and chit from the water jacket drains.
Ive had more than one customers boat , that they self winterized. Had the plugs in a ziplock bag and the block and manifolds were still full of water .... and cracked all to ****. |
F I feel bad for you. We all slip from time to time. The norm is live and learn but sometimes we just live more than we learn over time. I've posted different times on an effective set up that works well for many applications. Run 3/8" pipe to 6 an adapter from block drains and loop up over the top of engine with a coupler for quick disconnect. Just need to make sure you get close to equal amount of water on each side when lowing into the bilge. If not apply a little air to hose to loosen possible scale blockage. Connect back together and drain coolers, exhaust and raw water pump. Fill with antifreeze under t-stat. Many methods that work it's just a matter of preference. I went for years with complete success with just getting engines up to temps, pull muffs, whip the throttle a couple times and immediately have muffs ready with a 6' hose connected to to muffs and a 5 gallon gas can and lay on swim platform and start and let run til empty. Never had an issue. One one year I screwed up and got lazy and cracked two drag ass 330's thinking it wouldn't get that cold TONIGHT with a lightbulb in the bilge and both blocks cracked. Big fk up but was looking for a reason for more power anyway but still a waste of two low hour 330's. Stock cast manifolds bit it also. No biggy... They come in handy for front end weight on the kabota for snow plowing. Since then just for quick emergency situations I did the block drain set up for a piece of mind. And exhaust is easy to drain. Can do both engines in the length of time it takes to drink one beer. Can always go back and do the truditional route for security when it's not chitty out. Btw the year the 330's snapped only other thing that went was the exhaust. Once I saw the one engine was cracked there wasn't much I could do so I just let them go til spring and then surveyed the damage. Nothing else was crack or hurt in anyway. I was surprised. |
Quick block drain
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Boats can be like wives - even when you did everything correctly you still f***ed up. Lol Bummer deal, but know that almost everyone here has popped an engine for the silliest of reasons so you’re in good company. ;p You can probably sell your two engines a get a couple solid runners from Sick Stringer for about the cost of redoing that one engine. |
That's why I had to mention out of all the years boating and knowing very well all the risk I still fked up. Ya kinda like getting married. Lol... Mine was just stupidity and my normal procrastinating. Boat was in a building and thought no way it was cold enough to pop a block. Wrong. Kinda like pulling the pontoon out. Let's not do it on a nice mid fall day and wait and do it when it's sleeting and in 30 mph plus winds. I always think I will get that one last ride in and never do anyway so wtf. |
Towed my hatteras 2 miles with a jetski early November. 45 degrees light drizzle. Seadoos dont get 13k sportfish moving very fast.
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So I finally got my boat back last weekend and wanted to give an update after all the advice and condolences given here by you gentlemen on OSO. It took a lot longer than forecast as these things often do, and there were some complications along the way, but the silver lining is that (knock wood) the motors are now running a lot stronger than last summer and several other issues have been addressed along the way. Some details of the journey: The replacement bare block we found turned out to be bored 30 over so the starboard motor is now a 509. Cooling was simplified by replacing the hp500 t-stats with stainless housings & no bypass. Senders were added so I now have working fuel pressure gauges again. Motors & drives got painted. The motors are MUCH easier to get started now and aren't dying constantly when cold. With my 26p 4 blade bravo props she ran a bit over 5000 RPM showing 71 on my phone's GPS app last weekend, which im happy with (last year when these motors were put in they fell on their face and ran out of steam by 4700).
The one issue I've still been working out is that the motors (particularly the unrebuilt port motor) were still bogging down and at times backfiring when trying to get up on plane, though once up on plane they run fine. I was thinking it must be a carb issue but I replaced the old coils and that seems to have significantly minimized the issue, so im going to do the caps and rotors next to see if that totally resolves it. While trying to work it out I did break out a vacuum gauge and adjusted the idle but I could only get them up to 10 inches of vacuum. Does this sound way too low? The tune of the carbs is still an unknown factor for me, I really dont know if they were setup right when installed last year so this is the last thing still on my list to verify. Well there will always be more stuff on the "boat todo list" lol. But in any case, I'll be out boating this weekend! https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...94155e5529.png |
Jumped in on this thread way to late. But I know your pain. I had my boat winterized by a shop in 2017. spring of 2018 I fired up my motors to get ready for the season and had oil and water everywhere. Culprit one cracked block. Both motors were taken out and one block was replaced. Took the opportunity to have what I thought was a good shop do extra work and add some extra hp parts. didn't get boat back at all last season until the end. it was winterized went to get it ready for spring noticed it sounded like I had a lifter tick. Took it to another shop who I found thanks to guys on here, the brand new motor with less then five hours on it had 2 lobes on the cam sheered off. Yay me...... So i just purchased to lightly used way more power motors from sick stinger and awaiting there arrival. hoping to actually use the boat once this year. Its been way to long. All because I was in a hurry and thought I could trust a shop to winterize my motors. I later found out that the original motor that cracked was because it was never winterized.
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We boaters are gluttons for punishment. But when things finally work out its all worthwhile. Good luck with the motors from Mike, what are you putting in there? Re your motor never got winterized, its probably more hassle than its worth but if you can prove it they should be paying the bill.
Originally Posted by Smoke eater
(Post 4696329)
Jumped in on this thread way to late. But I know your pain. I had my boat winterized by a shop in 2017. spring of 2018 I fired up my motors to get ready for the season and had oil and water everywhere. Culprit one cracked block. Both motors were taken out and one block was replaced. Took the opportunity to have what I thought was a good shop do extra work and add some extra hp parts. didn't get boat back at all last season until the end. it was winterized went to get it ready for spring noticed it sounded like I had a lifter tick. Took it to another shop who I found thanks to guys on here, the brand new motor with less then five hours on it had 2 lobes on the cam sheered off. Yay me...... So i just purchased to lightly used way more power motors from sick stinger and awaiting there arrival. hoping to actually use the boat once this year. Its been way to long. All because I was in a hurry and thought I could trust a shop to winterize my motors. I later found out that the original motor that cracked was because it was never winterized.
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Yea trying to prove anything will be almost impossible. Ive thought about it, especially after my new mechanic said that they were probable the cause of this other motor failure that i experienced this year. But even in his words trying to prove anything will be next to impossible. So on to bigger and better things, just hope to get out this year. Last year I should've just went with my gut and bought this other set of motors from mike. But learned my lesson again. So this time I bout a set of 489's from him they were just shipped yesterday eagerly awaiting them. Have some more work that needs to get done on the boat just hope it gets done in time.
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Your setup must be different than ours. If our water is left on it simply fills up the strainer and comes out the drive...the water connection at the transom assembly is lower than t stat and engine block. |
When I flush the motors I connect the hose in the bilge and close the seacock valve so the only way for the water to flow is through the block and out the exhaust
Originally Posted by 1MOSES1
(Post 4696380)
Your setup must be different than ours. If our water is left on it simply fills up the strainer and comes out the drive...the water connection at the transom assembly is lower than t stat and engine block. |
Glad to hear that your back in the water. I hadn't heard from you after we talked back in April.
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Originally Posted by gofastboater
(Post 4696418)
Glad to hear that your back in the water. I hadn't heard from you after we talked back in April.
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