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I know it has been beat to death but ... hydraulic roller lifters ??

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I know it has been beat to death but ... hydraulic roller lifters ??

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Old 07-15-2019, 06:39 AM
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Default I know it has been beat to death but ... hydraulic roller lifters ??

Hey guys,
I know this has been beat to death but what seems to be the latest word on hydraulic roller lifters ? BBC about .625 lift. 135 seat and 420 open. Not a marine application but really should not matter. GM ZZ502 engine. I have not built anything for over a year and I know that a bunch of stuff has changed in that time. I almost hate to recommend anything right now. I am not building the engine. Customer asked me for a recommendation. He would prefer to stick with the factory dog bone style but will switch to link bar if needed. Main concern is noise.

Thanks,
Bill
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Old 07-15-2019, 12:42 PM
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I was just looking in the GMPP catalog and the 17120060 lifters used in the ZZ572/620 look like they might be the thing. The ZZ572/620 engine has a .632" lift cam and if the GMPP catalog is correct the springs are almost 200lbs seat pressure ???? I think that is what I am going to recommend to my customer. I don't know what else to do. I have 2 sets of noisy Morels sitting here that I ended up eating. I don't know who is making Cranes stuff now days so the GM ones are looking pretty good. Bargain price too.
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Old 07-15-2019, 02:13 PM
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Those should work fine. I have used them several times in milder builds.
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Old 07-15-2019, 02:46 PM
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I just rebuilt my ZZ502 with the 525EFI cam 610/632 lift and Eddie Young gave me his blessing to use the stock lifters as he feels they’re a really good product. Mine were low hours so I reused them and not just to save money, but because I know they work. Too many stories of $800 boxes of lifters having issues.

On a side note, the Comp Cams short travel lifters are the exact same size so you can switch them out and not need new push rods.
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Old 07-15-2019, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by BillK View Post
I was just looking in the GMPP catalog and the 17120060 lifters used in the ZZ572/620 look like they might be the thing. The ZZ572/620 engine has a .632" lift cam and if the GMPP catalog is correct the springs are almost 200lbs seat pressure ???? I think that is what I am going to recommend to my customer. I don't know what else to do. I have 2 sets of noisy Morels sitting here that I ended up eating. I don't know who is making Cranes stuff now days so the GM ones are looking pretty good. Bargain price too.
Yup, here: https://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/...visited-8.html

Did you get the Morels thru Straub ? Or Morel ? Just asking. He tells everyone with lifter noises it's their fault and tells them to pound sand. Everyone loses money but him and Morel. Kinda sick.
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Old 07-15-2019, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by SB View Post
Yup, here: https://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/...visited-8.html

Did you get the Morels thru Straub ? Or Morel ? Just asking. He tells everyone with lifter noises it's their fault and tells them to pound sand. Everyone loses money but him and Morel. Kinda sick.
I got them through PBM / Erson. Don't get me started on Morel I had one set for a Big Block that one of my customers was installing in a brand new engine. This guy is a cleanliness nut for what its worth. He put the lifters in and went to adjust the valves. Three or four of the lifters would "stick" in the compressed position as he was adjusting the valve train. I got him another set that worked fine. We sent the first set back to Morel for warranty. A week or two later they sent me a picture of a white paper towel with a bunch of what looked like metal filings on it. They said that the metal filings were what caused the lifters to stick and they would not warranty them. Well DUH . . . . this was a brand new engine that had never even been pre-oiled, never mind started. So I wonder where the crap came from ? I e-mailed them back and told them that the metal had to be there when the lifters were manufactured. I guess you know the answer I got Anyway, PBM took the high road and gave me credit for the lifters but that was the last set I ever purchased. Those were after a couple of sets of noisy ones in a Mercruiser 502.
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Old 07-15-2019, 08:57 PM
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Thumbs down morels suck

I know the feeling! just took my boat out yesterday for the first time after sitting for almost 10 years. (it took me this long to build another motor) due to other reasons - new house, etc. got about 1/2 way across lake- couple miles, and started clattering worse and worse, so shut it down, started paddling toward shore, but luckily got a tow back into a cove. pulled valve cover (not fun with powerflows) bumped it around and had 2 that were way loose. pulled girdle, backed off pulled pushrods and inspected. both straight, so proceeded to readjust , put on base circle and gave them the zero lash + 3/4 of a turn. also checked spring height to make sure valve was not stuck in guide or somthing. bumped over to check if any others were loose, couple more were also loose, but not as bad as cylinder #1 readjusted etc etc, fired up , started hammering again... pulled off again, **** was loose again! started adjusting again and noticed that after adjusting and moving to another cylinder , cylinder # 1 was loose again! things were bleeding off in a few seconds so ended up getting towed . ran it at idle speed for a while, but would have taken way too long back to marina, anything over idle would start clattering again........ yes the lifter bores were in spec, was running 10/30 oil, with correct pushrod length, and recommended preload. I build quite a few engines a year,- all performance big and small block Chevy engines. I had originally bought a set of the street series lifters, but figured i had better get the higher performance "endurance" morels for $750.00! guess i was wrong to do that, because i put the street lifters in another engine( with a bigger cam even) and it's running flawlessly- with a full turn of preload! l guess i am just pissed because this **** only seems to happen on my own stuff, but when i build motors for others, everything always works as it should! why are these high dollar lifters collapsing? sorry for the long rant, just extremely dissapointed about ready to go back to solid rollers with a rev kit, the crowers i had in a 12-71 blown jetboat lasted for 12 years , ( traded boat, didn't fail) i mean WTF?
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Old 07-15-2019, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Blowncat 509 View Post
I know the feeling! ..............
i mean WTF?
Its almost to the point where I dont know what to tell customers. You would think that after making hydraulic lifters for a hundred years we would have it right
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Old 07-15-2019, 09:34 PM
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Morels suck period!!!! Ask me how I know...

Will only run Johnson’s from now on.
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Old 07-15-2019, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by BillK View Post
I got them through PBM / Erson. Don't get me started on Morel I had one set for a Big Block that one of my customers was installing in a brand new engine. This guy is a cleanliness nut for what its worth. He put the lifters in and went to adjust the valves. Three or four of the lifters would "stick" in the compressed position as he was adjusting the valve train. I got him another set that worked fine. We sent the first set back to Morel for warranty. A week or two later they sent me a picture of a white paper towel with a bunch of what looked like metal filings on it. They said that the metal filings were what caused the lifters to stick and they would not warranty them. Well DUH . . . . this was a brand new engine that had never even been pre-oiled, never mind started. So I wonder where the crap came from ? I e-mailed them back and told them that the metal had to be there when the lifters were manufactured. I guess you know the answer I got Anyway, PBM took the high road and gave me credit for the lifters but that was the last set I ever purchased. Those were after a couple of sets of noisy ones in a Mercruiser 502.
i went thru the same thing with PBM/Erson and they sent me the same pictures of filings...probably a crock of sh!t. They refunded me and never turned back.
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