External Steering
 

I have some questions about external steering systems. I am going to add one to my convincor the system I am looking at is from world class marine. I am not looking a the full hydraulic system just the add on that uses the stock cable and pump. Has anyone used this system ? There was a write up on one being installed in the Dec/Jan hot Boat but nothing was said on how the system worked/ performed. I like this system because of the shorter wing span on the cylinders ( the convincor is only 7.5' beam). But how dose that affect performance. Also any thoughts on single over duel cylinders systems. This boat will never be a 80+ mph boat. 60's yes, 70's maybe but 80's no way. I was looking at a single system at first( do to cost). Can you add a ram at a later time with out having to upgrade to total system?

I just added Imcos' full hydraulic steering to my 259 Convincor. It was an easy install. I was afraid of not having enough room to mount the helm, but it turned out there was just enough room. I looked into adding the half system like you are thinking about. When I posted that question on this board I got many responses saying that the half system tends to be hard to turn while at idle speeds ( such as docking ). However, some guys were able to enlarge the orifice in the pump to allow greater flow at idle which helped this condition. I would suggest the full system if you can do it.

Thanks for the feed back checkmate454mag

Who has the best pricing? CP seem to be the cheapest with a WPM system at $1,299.99 single and $2,100.00 dual. again this is add on systems

MikeW

I installed a single ram WPM add-on system on my Baja 24 outlaw 2 seasons ago. The system works fine - no hard steering for me at any speed.

Just purchased a single WPM tie in system from RW Marine in Etters, PA for 1200. He was the cheapest on my procharger also and is very dependable. Always seems to have time to help with tech questions. He advised this is the easiest system to install at the best price. Have not installed, but looks pretty simple. All seems to be of highest quality.

Look at what I found on E-Bay...It is the assist system, but it is brand new.



http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=31283

I just bought a dual ram setup that was used on twi outboards. I plan on using it on a Bravo. It has the hydrolic helm. Do I still use the power steering pump and the internal Merc steering in this setup?

MikeW
The steering your talking about will work just fine. A single ram plumbed into your stock steering rack using a brazil manifold. I know of a 26 eliminator with a 900hp, Bmax Drive that uses this set up, only differance is he uses dual rams by Imco. If your only doing around 70 or 80 the single ram will work just fine. The full system is nice but the cost is high, it would be over kill for your application.

I bought one of two units that guy had on E-bay that checkmate454mag posted. It is a new Imco Dual SA-2. $1550.00 with shipping was the same cost as a new single ram system. I have an 1990 bravo 1 so I need the Fitting for the Saginaw unit. It is Imco part FA23 need two of them. any one know what the thread size these fittings are?
MikeW

Friendship 1 If you have a manual helm no you do not use a power pump. You might want to look for a power helm usally cheaper then a manual helm. Maybe you could find a swap.
good luck

ah so you were teh guy who bought it!!!!!

i forgot abotu it and checked it abotu 5 miniutes after it closed... :(

Puder
No I did not buy the one on e-bay. I e-mail him and he said he had two units. So I got the other one

MikeW

Steering
 

I bought my Pantera in early Jan., so I haven't spent too much time with it. But.
The boat has twin Bravos, with Marine Machine dual ram steering.
It has the MM full Hydraulic helm.
There is no stock Merc steering arm.
Both 502MPIs have steering pumps. Why? You'd think one is enough. I haven't traced the lines to see how everything is hooked up..

Any external system is better than the stock stuff.
Your upper 60s boat doesn't neeeed dual rams. It's a light boat, and doesn't run too hard. Don't waste your cash on the big system. Just get a single ram for less than 2k. Word has it that the system on my boat was 7500!!

This boat steers very well. You can take your hands off the wheel at 70 in the rough without any wander at all.
The only negative is the turning radius. those arms dont let the drive swing as far to the turn side. Yes you will notice a difference.

There is another system on e-bay. Single ram used but for $500.00 it my be worth a closer look...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=31283
MikeW

TimG
Alot of boat manufactures when installing motors will not remove the power steering pump on one of the motors in a twin motor set up during assembly. When a boat manufacture recieves a motor from mercury it comes complete ready to install in the boat including the power steering pump. So one of the pumps on your motors is doing nothing. I found this out many years ago when I purchased a new boat and a few times out it needed a new pump. I went to the dealer and they did not have one, so being a good dealer they went out and took a pump off one of the motors of a new Champion chase with twins. Thats how I discovered this bit of information.

If you've got two pumps, do yourself and your passengers a big safety favor and get the Merc priority valve kit and hook them both up.
You are not safe from from a hard turn just because you have external steering and only one pressure source. If the engine with the PS pump on a twin fails at speed, especially if airborne or in a turn, you're in for a very exciting if not dangerous event.
(speaking from experience!)

Jafo,
Your exactly right about the pump failing. On a full hydrualic system when the pump source stops the drives stay exactly where the helm last turned the drives. You can spin the wheel in any direction and nothing happens , just like when the engine is off. On a partial set up, thats where the stock cable and rack steering are used, if the pump stops you can still steer, it is just very hard to turn the wheel.

Well Im sold on the half system now , with that said,
I dont expect to see anything over 70mph at least
anytime soon :D

I thought that there was a bypass valve on those helms so that you could still turn even if the engine went down. That would SUCK to blow a engine way off shore and not be able to get home!!!!!.

Jon

:confused: Are you sure ??? Has this happened to you ???




:rolleyes:

Hi,

Attached is a picture of the IMCO I had on my old Shooter. The boat was good for 75mph and I did numerous poker runs with no problems at all. I was running a Supercharged 454 magnum with a Labbed Bravo 1. Bought it used here on the board and picked up the extra parts from IMCO to make it work.
http://www.newfocusis.com/shooter/drive.jpg

Jafo
On the new boat do you have a hydraulic helm or a cable

mikew I've used WPM for 12 years on tons of boats ,call them direct or p.m. me and tehy are great to deal with !ask for tommy ,only out there at wpm ,909-371-8247 you will not go wrong with them they also have killer nose cones


hope this helps :D :D :D
ps on the slower 80mph and less boats we use single ram systems and stock helm it works great and you can add another cyl and full hyd as the funds become easier

pss/ most rams come from one of two companys

Tom;

I can not speak from any first hand experience, but I think you are wrong on this one. I just installed Imcos' full hydraulic dual piston system. I have not yet tried the boat with the new steering due to winter. BUT, when I ordered this system, Imco assured me that if there is a case where the engine stalled, you can still steer the boat. It will simply revert to a manual steering gear, or in this case helm. Although it will be harder to steer, you still will have full control.

check mate,
I know of some of the older helms that worked this way. If your system is installed try it out, just turn the wheel and see if you can turn the drives. Let me know if it still works with the motor off. Anyone else with a full system try the same thing and let me know. Also Let me know what make the system is. I dont want to give any one bum advise.

Tom,

I wish I could give you that information. I just installed the system after I winterized. Everything is done with the exception of mounting the rams on the plates and adding fluid. I haven't tried it out yet. It may be a while, the weather sucks here. I did call Imco about this question, they told me that the steering will work, but without power assist.

checkmate454mag

Forgot to thank you for that lead on the IMCO system on E-bay. Turn into a good buy. thanks again.
MikeW

Priority Valve??
 

Anyone have info on this Priority Valve kit?
I'll have to look at my motors to see if one is just a dummy pump.
If so, the priority valve would be great...
I bought the twins with the reliability, and get ya home idea. But if my pump drive motor dies..then I have no steering... Bad Bad.
I do have the full hydraulic helm....

Mike W.

You are welcome. I am glad it worked out for you.

Tim G.

You should try to contact the manufacturer of your steering system.. Mine is from Imco, they told me you can still steer even without the motor running. You would just lose the power assist.

mike w. with full hydrolic steering if you lose your power steering pump you will still be able to steer the drives it will just become harder to steer. with a cable assist steering system if you lose the power steering pump it will be very hard to steer, and you could possiably break the steering components under the dash,(the gears,or rackenpinon parts) another thing with cable assist , lets say if your running along at high rpms. and your belt comes off your pump do to lack of hydrolic pressure to the control valve the boat could make a violent turn,due to prop torque pulling the steering wheel out of your hands . that is why we at IMCO feel that boats going 75 and above should be full hydrolic, weather it be single ram or duel ram. If you have any more questions call us at IMCO NV. 702-294-3030

Tim G. if your pump goes down and you are full hydrolic you will still have steering. We do have a twin pump manifold, like a priority valve but more free flowing and causes less heat in the oil, it will adapt to your steering if you want to run both power steering pumps call IMCO NV. tech support for more info and pricing 1-702-294-3030