Alternative engines
 

Is there any need for a new engine deign ofr offshore boats? I am contemplating the design and production of a V12 (60 degree) version of the Big Block Chevrolet or 429 Ford SCJ.

I don't know anything about offshore boats but it would be useful to know if an engine like this would be useful to any high performance boat applications.

Please let me know if this engine configuration or some other that you have in mind would be useful to you.

Best Regards

Jon Schmidt

[email protected]
motorsportsdesign
schmidtmotorworks

Do you have a website?

A 60 degree motor would be useful because it is narrower. That is always a good thing, as it allows the drives on a twin to be mounted closer together without staggering.

Furthermore, a 60 degree motor can have raised intake ports for a straighter shot into the motor, if you want to take advantage of that benefit (which you should). Problems lie in a couple of areas: height- a 60 degree motor will be taller. Raised and upwards angled intake ports will make the motor taller, too.

As far as a BBC or SCJ "base", how are you figuring using them as a base if you are changing the vee angle? You just talking about sharing bearing sizes, rods, pistons, lifters, rockers, valves and springs? Okay. I'll buy that. If that is the plan, why SCJ? Parts are much more readily available for the BBC.

How about a SOHC setup with ball-pivot rockers and hydraulic lash adjusters? That is the biggest single gripe on the BBC. Too much valvetrain mass and flexible actuation. SOHC will allow the cams to be positioned inboard on the head, where they won't interfere with exhaust risers like the outboard cams on a DOHC. No moving lifters, since the lash adjusters will be fixed in the head pockets and provide the motoinless fulcrum for lightweight but strong rockers to bear directly against the camshaft. This will allow lighter springs.

And for springs, plan to allow room for 2.25" of installed height and be able to accomodate .700" of lift.

No reason to go to a 4 valve motor. 2 valves is just fine, just as SOHC is just fine.

Now bring it on .

(you are aware that there have been some 90 degree BBC based marine V12's on the market, aren't you?)

Turbine.

The falconier. V-12 all alminum. A real work of art. Also bankrupt.

Market may be limited, build a better Bravo to go with it. The way I see it without going to #6 you can build plenty of power with a BBC by cubes or blower. Many of us would have more power if only the Bravo would hold it.

the torque v12 cool setup big power on pump gas, also bankrupt

I *believe* the torque was the reincarnation of the falconier.

The Allstar engine was designed for that. She is around 800CID. Not much bigger then a BBC engine. Cost is around $30K. I think she is 1000#/ft torque and 1000HP. RPM is around 5500. Mercury had/has some involement but I don't know where it went from there. It was the brain child of Niel Manton.

Chris

Here is a dumb a** question. How much more real dollars does it take to build a 800 ci engine than a 283 V-8? Think about it, how much more metal is really there. Yes some parts will cost slightly more to tool etc. and there is an economic factor in R&D and volume sold but I think vendors charge what we will pay. There still is X number of bearings, X holes to finish and so many assembly steps etc. Over Simplification to a point but it does not cost what many charge.

What is the up-charge from Merc to go from a 350 SBC with B1 to a 330 BBC with B1? About what you can buy a crate 502 for.

Maybe we can get a group discount for about 10,000 800 CI engines, how many OSO'ers are there?

The alstar is a all aluminum engine. All the good stuff. If you wanted to build a engine and not grind the block, or sharpen the crank, use a cast crank, stock rods, standard pistons, standard flat tappet cam, etc. then I'm sure the cost would come down dramatically. Then again, you'd be building a 502.

Cord my point exactly. Although the current 502 is a pretty decent engine it would not cost much more to make the holes bigger and it may appeal to a larger market. I am not sure how many people would opt for a pretty much stock (aka gen6 502 roller, forged etc) 800 or say a 620 over the 502. Sure would beat having to add a blower, stupid cams, carbs and so on. Maybe there is a market for a run of the mill 620 or 800.

Anyone know how to get more information?

The name of the game is volume. As in millions. Have you ever seen a engine block transfer machine? Auto makers invest tens of millions of $$$ to automate as much as possible. Feed in rough blocks at one end and finished blocks come out the other. The only way to pay for this investment is to sell millions of the same block. Volume is the reason a GM can build a complete engine for the same cost as a set of aftermarket connecting rods. 10,000 of anything just gets you aftermarket pricing.

In 1971-72, I was GM of Holman Moody Marine. At that time, the cost difference from Ford between a 289, a 302, and a 351 was six dollars!

2112
Info on Allstar
Bob
http://www.allstarengine.com/