State of the Sport?
 

I started to respond to another post regarding overall boat count...but felt that it didn't really focus on the issues.

1988....... OPT broke away from APBA

Since then has come........ in no particular order NPBA, USPBA, USORA, OPA, SBI, SBR, OSS.

In 1988 there were over 450 offshore boats of one kind or another campaigning in National and Regional events in the U.S.

Today there are about 80........total

My conclusion is that the biggest problem the sport has....started in 1988....and continues.....

The problem is division......

As long as there is more than one sanctioning body.....the friction and factions will tear this fragile activity apart.

Since the APBA joined SBI......leaving OSS apart... the fleets have divided about evenly.......

Bad news.

Each side is about as strong.....(or weak)....as the other meaning that no one group has any significant leverage to "win"...and (mercifully) end the "contest"...for racer's hearts, minds and wallets.

So..

The beat goes on with each side declaring "victory".... and supremacy....... over an ever dwindling fleet of boats.

Because.....

As long as there is conflict....and there is...... many people will turn off and turn away.

As long as there is conflict..... and there is..... sponsors will hear about it....and find other ways to spend their promotional dollars.

As long as there is conflict....and there is....race sites will have half a fleet of boats at their events...half a dwindling fleet.

As long as there is conflict...and there is..... each organization will have only half of the budget available for promotion, TV, Safety, and technological development.

I've listened to both sides...... I have friends on both sides.... beating their chests.... and trumpeting their organizations

all I can say is:

Can the bravado....and get back to a unification agenda.

Time is running out.

For my part... I can prime this pump with some questions............. for instance:

1. How many current (expenses paid) race "officials" are willing to step down (or step out)...for "The good of the sport"? (Those are the ones worth keeping)

2. What is it that keeps APBA Detroit insisting on signing "Long Term Contracts" for the Offshore "rights"?

3. How many classes is too many? OR...is one boat running alone....really a race?

4. Where does a racer get started?

5. When is TV an effective merchandising vehicle....and when is it "Wayne's World"?

6. How many current racers ever went to an event with over 200 boats (other than a Poker Run)?

I hope this stirs some thought......

I, frankly, don't care if it makes you angry at me......

Finally , I wish y'all........ Good racing.

T2x

Re: State of the Sport?
 

:drink:

Rich your input is always appreciated

thanks

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Rich,

Glad you stepped in on this with your knowledge and questions. You have been around longer then most on the board and if they can not realize that then OH WELL!!! Thank You for asking the questions people have been wanting to ask especially the one boat racing against yourself and no one else in a class.

THANK YOU

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Couldn't agree more, Rich.

It's a crying shame.

If this continues, there won't be any "real" races in a couple of years.

Where's Ike Batista when we need him? :( :( :( :(

Re: State of the Sport?
 

A house divided against itself cannot stand. True in the 1860's, true today.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

The fact is that all of the reasons that the OSS boys departed for are now cured...... it would appear that they were successful in their original goals but are now drunk on their own being... what a shame. They are truly standing in the path of the whole thing coming together. If it were a "for profit" organization I could somewhat understand the unwillingness to fold into the Sbi/APBA but they are not.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Fort Lauderdale: SBI + APBA - OSS = 42
(+ OSS = 75?)
Here we go again, back to the late 90's!!!

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Well it's about time T2x!

Where ya been? GSB perhaps? :drink:

Re: State of the Sport?
 

t2x you are right as allways . now bring every body back togather as one . i rember opt usora apba . :drink:

Re: State of the Sport?
 

So, How do we make OSS go away ??????????


Mike

Re: State of the Sport?
 

I dont think that "making OSS go away" is the answer, I think getting OSS to fold into the current organization is the key. If they were to realize that as a group they would have tremendous voting power to control the rules and classes I think that any concerns that they would have would go away. They are, for all intents and purposes, the obstruction to this sport attaining new levels of growth and participation.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Folding into a "current organization" is not the answer.
I have to admit, I like the fact that OSS has only five classes.
I don't like the fact that they do not offer an entry level class (or two).
I would think that they (OSS) as an organization needs to accept the fact that the Factory One and Two classes are a great way to introduce racing to potentially serious participants.
Many of the racers started out in these two classes and stepped up into bigger and faster classes.
This would bring the class count up to seven. This is all that is needed to offer those who want to race offshore at an entry level.
I am sorry but the P classes have to much going against them with such an array of boat sizes, weights, speeds and configurations.
P class is a great concept on a Divisional level but not for a professional circuit.

I have always been an APBA fan and for what reason I'm not really sure. Maybe it was the heritage. Maybe it was the boat count.
Now, I am not for or against any organization.
I used to plan some vacations around the races and that is not happening again this year. Not enough boats at any one venue that justifies the expenditures of my hard earned cash.

And one more thing. Do you really need SuperCat and SuperCat Light?
That could be rolled into one class, easily. Now we're down to six classes.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Not a fact but, IMHO the heavy hitters of OSS could easily buy SBI if they really wanted to. Its time to end your thoughts of them caving in to SBI. They like thier program, and they will see that it suceeds. good luck with your new boat, it looks great. but does it have the muscle???

Re: State of the Sport?
 

I like to think it has the "muscle", but the motors were sealed at Innovation so they probably are not making as much HP as the Merc sealed motors....... Ha!

Re: State of the Sport?
 

"How do we make OSS go away?"Why?

From what I've seen this year OSS does a good job putting on a competitive,well organized event.I was unimpressed with the first two SBI venues.Its a big ocean out there.NASCAR seems to exist fine with multiple sanctioning bodies.Every one has its plus and minus.Its like two children bickering all the time and that will not grow and improve the sport.

]This is the view according to Louie,all other views may be different.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

NASCAR has multiple sanctioning bodies?Explain.I look at how the CART vs IRL fragmentation of indy car racing has turned off the fans,sponsors,manufacturers,drivers and teams.In fact,many team owners and drivers have made the move over to NASCAR.There are not enough teams,particularly in the Super classes, to support two national sanctioning bodies
for offshore powerboat racing.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Once again, it is not about making OSS go away.... its about them acknowledging that the differences are no longer there and continued existance is detrimental to the sport. Look at it this way, OSS was essentially created out of a "strike" or "walkout" due to legitimate complaints about the APBA owner (MA) and the way the racers were treated. In any strike the goal is rectification of the complaints and return to work in better and more promising conditions. Well we have that. What has happened though is that OSS no longer wants the problems corrected now they want to be the epicenter of "professional" racing. All that they have succeeded in doing is further fragmenting a very small pool of available participants. The worlds is a prime example. We could have the worlds on 2 different weeks, but they have to be scheduled the same week. The only explanation that I can come up with is to force participants to make a choice....ie: fragment. At a time when quality people like Bob Bull, Pops and others are going to the bargaining table and making real concessions for the betterment of the sport I am amazed at the arrogance of some.......... I personally think that bringing JC, Bob Bull and Paul W. to a mediation with real labor mediators to iron out the differences would be tremendously productive. I have always felt that the differences between the organizations is negligible and this is really about egos. I will even provide the mediators, including the best labor mediator in the country, a former VP of HArley Davidson who has watched this whole process and is a 30 year expert in collective bargaining, and a NASCAR exec similarly trained at my expense. Lets get this stuff out of the way!!!!

Re: State of the Sport?
 

It is my opinion that neither OSS nor SBI/APBA should “go away”. What I believe is needed is for both groups to genuinely recognize the need to unite as one on an equal basis. I know for a fact that each group possesses positive attributes that would be beneficial to the other. Until both organizations realize this and until there is true unification, I believe we will continue to witness the demise of our sport.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

I absolutely agree.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Pete

How does the personal wealth of a few teams positively affect the sport?

All OSS has proven to potential sponsors is that the racers are more interested in their personal goals then being commercially viable and delivering for sponsors. This does not encourage companies to invest in the sport. OPT had huge money behind them they failed. The APBA LLC owners had deep pockets they bailed out realizing that some of the racers would not let them do what was needed to break even. Oddly enough the most publicized offshore races were from the LLC and OPT.

The OSS members had the opportunity to buy the LLC with site, TV contracts and $400,000 per year from GM for only $200,000. They passed, why I would say it did not fit their agenda. Bob Bull purchased it and is doing everything possible to put the sport back on track. He and JC have compromised and worked close together to deliver for the racers, race sites and sponsors.

All I am saying is the course that has been chosen has hurt the sport commercially. Offshore no longer has any Brand recognition. This is not unique to Offshore racing. Look at Champ car and IRL. Some of the Teams and Tony George decide to split off rather then stay with CART and work through their issues. At that time CART was big; all races were televised live most on ABC. The sponsor money and marketing synergies were vast, and they were rapidly building an audience outside of the US.

At this time CART had a 120 million dollar war chest to take on the IRL so they decided to fight rather then do what commercially made sense. Today they have burned through all of there surplus capital and spent much more. During this process CART has been reduced to a fraction of what it once was and yes Pete the Team owners are very wealthy.

Today both sanctioning bodies are in trouble the races are poorly attended the fields are never full of competitors. The races are generally broadcast but not on ABC any longer. The point is nothing good has come from the split with the exception of a few team owners and Tony George getting their way. Offshore is on the exact same path as IRL and Champ car. If the once prosperous publicly traded CART cannot survive this how can Offshore?

The fact is Offshore was easier to sell when a potential sponsor could and probably did see it on TV. Not only has the TV disappeared but so has most of the print media. If you do a search after a race goes off you will find very few printed articles. Sponsors pay for positive exposure while you may land a sponsorship deal. Can you retain it under the current operating model? Most deals are financially marginal for the race team in the first year due to the cost to sell, graphics, uniforms etc. The following years are when a team has the best chance of retaining the sponsorship dollars and delivering value to the sponsor. If you cannot retain both your primary and a good portion of your secondary sponsors the net income to the team is very low.

Finally look at Baseball and NASCAR. It is no coincidence that when baseball went on strike that NASCAR's fan base grew rapidly. The baseball fans did not agree with the selfishness of players and the clean image and close competition NASCAR offered every week filled the void. Baseball still feels the effect of the strike to this day, and NASCAR is now building an International audience.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

I understand youre desire to see SBI/APBA/UIM/WPR succeed and i admire youre dedication to them, This year i am just a fan, due to my work i travel alot out of the country, so could not commit to being on any crew. so , what i say is based on my opinion. while i dont know what will bring a happy and united offshore curcuit. i do feel that OSS has capitalized on the fact they only have 5 classes, It is very enjoyable to watch only one or two classes on the course at once not 8 or 9,in the apba heyday there were usally 45 p-class boats at a race, some racing the entire national curcuit, which is thier choice, but i think this should be at a divisional level, until the worlds when all get to race. I still dont like the term "worlds "
It should be "North American chamipionship" because this is what it truly is. Baseball and Nascar, apples and oranges, If you go to other forms of boat racing look at thier attendance, The gold cup used to attract up to half a million, and hydros are awesome to watch. Drag boats if youve ever seen them, they are bad A$$, in offshore people wonder what is going on half the time, ive heard everything from is this a boat show to are them filming a movie. who's winning??? there usually is little to no advertisement, ive been to many races where if you werent prepared with drink and food in the pits you had none. the races need to have a carnival atmosphere, vendors, kids running around with signed posters, At the biloxi, kids were everywhere with the biggest smiles on their faces, because they not only got free posters, thier mom's and dad's bought them a hat or shirt from a team they liked, they met the driver throttleman (or woman)and team members , they got to come up and look at the boats close-up. this is how the fan base starts, one of the indidviuals i was at the races with struck up a conversation with a gentleman from ??? he saw the races last year while on business, he enjoyed them so much he brought his whole family for a weekend get away to watch the races. When people can understand what is going on it will draw more fans. Not to say SBI/APBA/UIM/WPR isnt competeing on a professional level, it is. but there are TOO many classes which can lead to another thread. each post doesnt have to be slam agianst the other or them vs us. everyone is entitle to thier own opinion, and able to share in a public forum. some say history repeats itself, well if thats the case it will, some try to make a change or difference and they are. only time will let us know if they are successful. so lets stop arguing over this and that and let the season unfold. I plan on attending as many races as work permits, and hope to share the excitement that offshore racing OSS style brings, i would hope that, more would bring the excitement of SBI/APBA/UIM/WPR races to the forum prior to the event being over. make the sport fan friendly and they will come.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

I believe Pete is right on target,as I mentioned on the SVL-OSS thread yesterday its all about the fans.Without the fanbase we have a hobby not a professional motorsport.At our last race we had over two hundred thousand spectators and the only reason they came was to see a boat race.Our biggest complaint from the fans was because of several classes racing together no one knew who was racing who.At our last race we begged JC for a parade lap ,it was like pulling teeth because he doesn't like parade laps,but guess what?The fans do.When the fans book their rooms a year in advace the sponsors do also.Even with the economic damage from hurricane Ivan our sponsors from last year and many more have already signed up for August.The best thing we can do to better our sport is to remember the fans and show respect for both organizations and stop the public bad mouthing as it hurts our image more than you think. Gary

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Absolutely right on Gary!

Re: State of the Sport?
 

100% Correct Gary. This marriage thing may be good for you! Hey Dave.

Re: State of the Sport?
 

That's quite an offer........ and goes to the heart of the matter.

Sitting down in good faith........

How can it happen?

1. Both sides have to acknowledge that the current divided situation is wrong. The sport is too small and underfunded to support two groups.

2. Both groups have to let go of the concept of "control". This is a tough one given the fact that various people are making some form of living off of the current formats. With the lack of funding and need for volunteerism in the short term....Anyone who uses this sport solely as a means to make a living.... should be eliminated. In addition, no matter who paid how much for what in the past..... That was a bad investment...and no racers owe an investor any return at all.

3. The exclusive APBA contractual rights..... Have to be canceled........or abandoned..... to solve problem #2 above. If this means leaving UIM recognition on the cutting room floor...so be it. That's why there are special events sanctions.

4. Racers, in general, have to put their own selfish interests on hold and join a unified group for the greater good. Nascar does not assure each racer a trophy/championship/world record every race...or every season.... but it pays off in sponsor dollars and ROI...and funds the teams very nicely. While that level of profit may be unrealistic.... certainly the sport can be as profitable as other tightly controlled motorsports like motocross or SCCA..... The point is you can't come to any major motor racing organization and arbitrarily decide you are going to race a 20 year old design....or add an extra motor... or build a completely different transmission.... simply to feed your own ego.

5. Finally..... To the trouble makers.... Grow up...and shut up.
The finger pointing....tale telling...and outright lying is beyond damaging. If you are among the loudest and most flamboyant defenders of your group...be it APBA or OSS ..... You are probably one of the main causes of this problem. I've been around a while, and believe me, at this point, neither side has all that much to crow about..... The sport is shrinking for chrissakes!!!! This means stop the name calling, stop the pathetic flag waving, and stop speaking about the "other" group as "them"..... You are all racers...and you will all sink or swim together.

Those of you who follow my posts, know that at the height of "LLC mania" a few years ago... I was a lone voice in the night pointing out that the emperor had no clothes....

Now it seems we have come full circle and you are running out of chances to make a decent wardrobe.

T2x

Re: State of the Sport?
 

It's right on time for a meeting of the great minds of this sport to put aside differences and think like a FAN and not a racer, many sponsors just might begin to open up their wallets a little as the transition to unity begins :cool:

Re: State of the Sport?
 

UNIFY or the sport WILL DIE

Re: State of the Sport?
 

Don't worry! Everything will be just fine. ;)

If we can get the organizations to perhaps work out a deal to race together such as same sites same dates, SBI race on Saturday and OSS race on on Sunday with everyone keeping their own rules and sanctioning that would be just great!

Sure it may be a dream for now, but then again, so was the Worlds of 2004. :drink: