Camden P1 and P2
 

Does anybody know what the top speeds were in P1+P2 after the GPS units were checked?.. All classes put on a great show

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

I was too scared to look down

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Firewater hit 97.8 before the starboard engine let loose.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Firewater you were running very well but we could tell the end was near when you passed by the USS NJ and we could smell the oil in the air. To bad,you guys looked great.

Wazzup I am sure this is true. If you could have seen all the debris in the water we saw from the ship... well you may have been more scared. congrats

Does OPA report the GPS speeds from the on board units or just check that the max speed were not exceeded?

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

They just check to make sure you did not exceed the max speed. We were running right around 100

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Smitty,
We saw on the radar gun, your boat at 103.3 MPH ,you and Kurt were flying.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

DOH... :eek: Busted :D

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Radar Gun?????? Where was that?

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Oh no does that mean I have to run a 30 ft V bottom in P1? Better get a roof

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

So wonder I blew up a motor trying to catch you guys !!!

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

The radar gun was on my boat and you defenetly were over your speed,on more than just one lap,so was Kurt,at one time we saw Kurts boat at more than 106 mph,and he only received a penalty/bogus,I think that Mark and Bill in the Wanted boat deserved the checkerd flag,they did not break out and they never will running in the same class as you guys,this is just proof that P class racing will never be the way to go because you have guys running in the wrong classes/period.The only way it will work is if you limit the length,weight,cubic inch,spec carbs and exhaust and have single and twin engine classes this is the only way to keep it fair and have an inspection process that controls it,if not it will only stay the way it is more about the partying than the racing and we can all party at home for alot less money,so if we want to be treated like a professional motor sport we have to become more and act more professional or just be happy to be a sport that is not taken seriously.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Bill In an other post one of the other racers said that since there was no money or points everybody was running for fun and they were going to let it all hang out. Remember the last two races were in very calm water, not what the boys are accustomed to

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Hey Bill are you going to key west?

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

YUP ...Bad Boys was running over 106 mph turning a 27 5 blade at 6400 and never hit the rev limiter. Apparently the boat is set up better than they could have ever expected. I dont know the numbers, but their slip % is very low. I guess they will have to tune down the motors. Theres no way a 38 V can run 115 mph in P-1 without a roof. Well, they could , but I dont think they have a death wish.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

not to nit pick bruce but that would be a 3 percent slippage and thats just not happening however they were running very well ( or maybe the tach is off and they were spinning more rpms than that)

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Dont you think that these guys have been breaking out all year or not,I think that these guys and everyone else really need to look at the classes and someone needs to place these boats in there propor classes,you have the bad boy boat with all that HP and a enclosed canopy 36 Cigerette with only 1050 HP in the same class that is in no way even close to being fair even when propped down the acceleration alone will dominate in the ocean or in the calm,make the classes fair and more people will show up and alot of racers wont get discouraged and want to do something else with there boats and money.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Little food for thought. We ran a 30'' wheel at 6000 on a 1.5 ratio. Do the math

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Hyper, you keep trying to relate us to a professional motor sport. Professionals get paid. There were plenty of races where Wanted ran away from us. That flat water was our day to shine. Wanted has also been tested at 100 mph. Anyway, no matter what you say, I will never take my son on a race coarse in a 30 ft open boat and run P1. EVER Smitty

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

OK I'm bored at work,

6000 rpm 10% slip=102.3 mph
6000 rpm 12% slip=100.0 mph
6000 rpm 15% slip=96.6 mph

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

hyper 1,what you are talking about ,having engine rules and so forth,will not work unless the organization is committed to it,being that it is all volunteers.no one wants to be in an engine compartment late on a sun afternoon.also factor in the dollars, when i raced, A class had boats that were doing over 90 mph.in p5 24 footers are competitive at 70 mph.my boat, which was a 90 mph B class boat,had to run against a 110 mph 38 fountain.i can now compete in p class again without getting outspent,there is no such thing as affordable racing.p class takes the dollars out somewhat. it will not become a professional motor sport anytime soon.not enough boats too, many organizations,too many classes.no marketing.could go on and on.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

That sounds about right...He told a few of us at the awards he was running 102 mph.
Which to this day still amazes me.....
Not bad for the ole Mary Kay hull.

I assume after all penalties were assessed, they must have still finished in front of Wanted some how, whom did not break out.

It is still not clear to me what the rules and penalties are. I thought in Cambridge the penalties for breaking out were 3 minutes...:confused:

Whatever..... :rolleyes:

It's over....Look forward to Key West!!! :drink:

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Here's the rules.

OPA doesn't use the decimal number. So 70.4 is still 70 and 70.5 is 71. Follow?

Up to 70.4 is OK.
70.5 to 71.4 is a 1 min penilty
71.5 to 74.4 is a 3 min penilty
74.5 and over a 5 min penilty

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Smitty,
I would not expect you to run with or without your son in P1 with no lid,second the point I was making is that you and Kurt ran in P3 all year with OPA and in reality you probably should have been in P2 because it is now very obvious how fast your boats really are,so either you have been laying back or you and Kurt some how found a whole bunch of speed,HMM,and Smyth/Eddie to here those comments come from you surprises me because at one time you were the one that thought that the OPA structure would not work properly and now that you are racing with Bruce who I respest very much your opinions are different,I remember when you were racing that fast Fountain with your 32 Hustler and those rules were not fair either so you guys can believe what you want,if you want it to be fair you need Length,weight,cubic inches,max length,single and twin engine classes and cat classes with spec carb and exhaust and the classes will control themselfs,if not those people would be the ones called guys who did not play buy the rules. or cheaters.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

1HYPER1,

To simplify the whole situation: Break Out = DQ'd!!! Period!
Then hours would not be spent with scorers pounding on calculators and going back & forth with time sheets.

It would also discourage those that want to intentionally breakout and try to get a win by the clock...
Even the way it stands right now, any boat that breaks out should never place higher than the ones that did not.

In my opinion, the guys that don't break out are being penalized when a boat that did break out gets placed ahead of him in the end...

All in all though, it's their stadium.
They will run their SHOW however they want to.
And if it's just audience that complains about it, the suggestions they offer hold no water...
If the boat owners don't speak up, then everything is assumed that it's working just fine.
If the entertainers are happy with the way the show is run, then so be it.
They are the only ones that have to live with it....

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Sharkey I agree with what you are saying,alot of the OPA racers agree also and have made mention of it but they do not want to create waves because some of the people that create and maintain the rule book with a pencil also are the ones who maintain there boat or engines or just live down the street from them and dont want an uncomfortable situation on there hands,so I can see why they dont say much,people in the past have spoken up on more than one occasion and all that happend was they were given the cold shoulder or told if you dont like how we play go somewhere else but they really dont want to have to go to Florida or some other far race venue to run there boat when they live within one hour from most of the OPA events.It is alot cheaper to run in your backyard than 1000 miles away.Then on the other hand people think it will never become a professional motor sport but are willing to ask for someone to be a major sponsor and help them run a program,I would like to here that conversation,well sir I would like you to give me X Amount of money for my race boat but we are not going to worry about the rules or getting you good exposure we are just going to put on a party and show,I dont think a smart buisness man will back you mr Smyth,but if you went to a sponsor and had a solid background and a more professional set up and program and could show how someone could benefit from spending there money it would be alot easier I know because I have done it in the past,no it is not and never will be Nascar or IRL because of the nature of the sport but it could most definitly be more professional than it is know and that is what OSS,SBI and APBA are trying to accomplish and go after major corporate sponsors and help promote the sport and not just be happy about where it is now.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Sharkey, I agree that breakout speeds should be penalized with a DQ, as well. But, we must make sure that we have GPS equipment that is accurate and reliable. If you go to the GLSCS rule book, their penaties for breakouts are more realistic, and would discourage anyone who might be thinking about working the penalties to their advantage.

Hyper, I understand what you are saying as well. Especially, when you are trying to attract corporate sponsors. I dont agree that it is all about the show. In Camden, Some may have had that attitude, because this race really meant nothing as far as titles or prize money.

If we can attract more sponsors, and convince them that their money will be well spent, we can offer an impressive purse and more stringent rules and tech inspections. And therefore, elevating to the next level of professional motor sports. I dont think spec motors and inspections will work in this day and age. Too much time and experience is needed for this task, and no one , especially volunteers, wants to hang around Sunday evening tearing down motors. So, with that said, we need to find the happy medium and, like you said place boats in their proper classes. But, please understand, the only way to really keep it fair and place everyone in their correct classes, is to add classes, which is what we are trying to avoid. So, where do we go from here? Sanbagging is not the answer and it is very difficult to hold back. For example, I can easily power up to run low to mid 80s and bump up to P-4, as can several of the other P-5 boats. The problem is running against boats like Augies in big water. I dont mind running against boats like Steelin Time or Cms because they are a bit smaller. But how can we be expected to run a 28 ft 5,000 pound single engine boat against a 38 ft 12,000 pound twin in big water? I might as well throw my money in a fire and jump off a 10 floor building. The results will ultimately be the same.

Yeah, Smitty and Tony ran some crazy speeds in P-2 while runnin P-3 all season. Yes, their boats are obviously capable of speeds way in excess of P-3 speeds, but they set their boats up accordingly. For specific conditions and speeds that they intend to run.

My opinion would be for Tony to run his stock 525s and he'll run 90+ all day long in P-3. Smitty cant run those speeds in Big water. The competition between these two teams was fierce throughout the season and there was no one else that came out in this class all year, except for the Cambridge race and Camden, both which were calm water conditions.

I also agree with the conflict of interest between guys writing the rules and racing boats. If next year is going to be succesful and attract new teams, all these issues must be addressed. So, lets see what happens.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

Bruce,
I commend you for you speaking out.
You are one of the very few to actually do so.

It's not about causing disruption, it is about trying to make things better and fairer.
But obviously when one disagrees with the higher ups, they become accused of starting trouble... :rolleyes:

Good luck with it... ;)

Hopefully Offshore Racing will come back to the North East next year...

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

yes, we are going to key west just doing some repairs and maybe a little engine work before the race

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

hyper 1,people are racing now because they love racing.they know there are no purses, no sponsors, no promotion and rules that are not perfect, but still spend tons of money to do it. most of the guys complaining on here aren't even equipment owners. i've been through the whole sponsor thing,there may be small sponsorships here and there but will not be a professional motor sport in the near future.i don't know when i ever said i didn't like the p class format.it's the whole reason i'm coming back out.if you have an older boat you can race it again.

Re: Camden P1 and P2
 

I can't beleive I'm gonna say this but I agree with Bruce, he can't run with us in big water but I'm gonna also turn it around. Every boat that ran all year in OPA P-4 (all smaller than us) put a whoppin on us in flat water...and I mean a whoppin, in both the Cambridge, Md. and the Camden Races. We were never that far in the back of the pack in three years. I went against everything I beleive in at the Cambridge, Maryland Race, being pi$$ed off, ranting and raving when I should have realized how lucky I was to be doing what I am doing and no one got hurt. There are a lot of issues to go over in the off season and I suggest if you plan to run OPA next season...Write your concerns down and bring them up at our December Meeting, someone will listen.