emilsr

Different? Yes. Absolutely. Is it somehow better what Fountain did....because it was "faceless investors" instead of individual boaters? No. I don't think so. Those investments were real people's money; people just like you and me and berk and whoever else has been screwed over the years by people who mismanage their business finances (while living well) then hide behind the corporate structure and laws and don't pay their bills. Okay, so Pantera did it a number of times, and Fountain only once, but it's still stealing in my book.

VtSteve

It's quite different in a number of ways. Fountain had satisfied customers, and satisfied repeat customers. They followed up after the build, in real life, not just online. Fountain was also a publicly-traded corporation. I made several comments in threads about the stock they were going down. Some didn't appreciate it, because they loved the boats, or Reggie, or both.

In Pantera's case, there is a very long history of this Private company screwing people. Many, many judgements against them. Always the same story about how long they've been around, pictures from the old days, we love you, here's our phone number, .......... ad nauseam.


People Gambled on Fountain stock, which was a POS at that time IMHO. Customers Paid directly for product from Pantera, and went through hell. HUGE DIFFERENCE. Not only that, those that complained were spanked online because they complained. Still are, but not nearly as much before these threads showed the proof.

If Reggie somehow got control of Fountain again and ran it, he'd have immediate customers. Pantera? Not that many people are that stupid anymore.

So In answer to your question? No. There is no correlation between the two companies. One worked their hearts out, and made some mistakes, and lost the company. The other swindled people out of their hard-earned dollars and lied incessantly to try and get more people to order boats. When you file for bankruptcy after a landlord needs his rent, and a (ONE) customer sues you for his money, after not paying judgments already rendered, you're pretty much a bottom feeder.

All of Pantera, the entire organization, is not worth what Fountain's manufacturing facility was worth, never mind the land. They only have people chasing the days of old by trying to buy old boats.

Wylie-Rat

Thanks and you are correct about Berk's Boat.., but their is 1 more new 28sr that has not been delivered and from what I know it still needs a good bit of work to be complete... I prefer not to go into any details and many of you probably know who I am talking about - I just hope that this person is able to get his boat finished and delivered to him...

boatme

I would suspect that is because they have been on COD with there suppliers for years (rightfully so) I am sure most of thier suppliers got there number long ago

ZP'd

He's been strung along with Jo's B.S. as well.
Nice guy, sucks that Pantera is not a reputable company to do biz with. (has not been for quite some time looking back) He nor no-one should have to go thru the lies and deceit for months on end.
I'd haul whatever is there and finish it elsewhere it at all possible. Not sure if his boat is tied up now as well?

VtSteve

$460k in unsecured claims, the only secured claim is $25k, owed to a family member.
Sales tax of almost $18 k owed. I would have to think the monies collected from the boats "in progress" is gone, but I wonder if those "sales" were treated as deferred sales.

No real assets, and it looks like the unsecured claims (creditors) amounts is larger than first noted. That must include the two boats. Not much value implied on the boat molds, and only see a 24/36 boat mold, with the 36 being pledged against a secured claim. No 28 or 41 boat molds?

mikebrls

NOT there first rodeo

97FASTech

iTrader: (6)

Strange wasn't Berk's boat a 28'. How does one build a 28 without a mold.

This company is just sickening.

mikebrls

the mold's are there at the factory there just not in pantera's name for this reason You have to give them some credit

VtSteve

Company number one probably owns the molds, and gets payments for their daily rental. Company number 2 does some other task. Company number 3 and 4, possibly 5 are gone, leaving company number 6 with nothing but debt, and just enough cash to pay their attorney to file bankruptcy. Somewhere in this mess are definitely more than one or two boats, quite obviously their state of completion was lied about for many months. I hope there is something at the end of the tunnel for those people.

I was going back through the various threads linked, and paying particular attention to those trashing the poor people that innocently became new Pantera customers, as well as some very nice, considerate comments from the owners. They are long threads, but when you read about them and try to follow them to their conclusion, it gets very painful. This isn't about bad business practices, or bad economies, or even bad luck. It's an incredibly well orchestrated scam.

Since they were sued for fraud, again, who knows where that leads. Obviously they have the money to live and race and whatever. The unpaid judgments are an indication of just how slippery people can be if they want to be. I would think that even the biggest Pantera supporter can smell the stink of this situation, and those that came before, from Miami to across the big pond. Though I'm sure they will do it again. I gather this is going into the third decade at least of some really rotten business scams.