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Mirage Plus not more uptodate ???

Hello im tinking about buying a new Set Mirage Plus.

Yes i use long years Bravo Props but i remeber the time most used props befor Bravo are Mirage, than Mirage Plus came out.
For 20 years most boats used 3 blade Mirage Props. Than the Bravo came out with "Mercruiser Bravo I" on it. Some years later "Mecury Marine Bravo I" on it and today many versions are available, LAB, ProFinish, LT, XS, OC, FS, XC......
If we testet Bravo Props from a Mirage we used -1" to the Bravo Prop. 25" Mirage to 24" Bravo, most of the time the Bravo are a little bit slower, but the all-round are better, so we stay most with the Bravo. But the Mirage are usaully faster.

Now i own 20 years same boat. 1991 V-Hull with first 454MAG, than 502EFI, now 525EFI twin engines Bravo Drive. Boat came with 454MAG and 25" Mirage and than i switched to Bravo Props 26" , 28"LAB with the 502EFI and than 29"LAB 31" LAB with the 525EFI engines. The 31" / 5200 and the 29" / 5400 on flat water 1mph diffrence.

" Thank you to BBlades, the 31" are very very nice Props !! "

The 31" to big on the flat water, with some white water i thing the engines can turn the props more and this are nice props für Poker Runs.
The 29" are my fastest props with this old non stepped hull.

My idea are the have a prop with less diameter and same pitch. Something like Hydromotive 15X29, but they are not to find for XR shafts.
But the old Mirage Plus last pitch are 15x29" but only 3 blade are new available. With the old -1" the 29" Mirage are like a 28" Bravo ore more like a 29" Lab Bravo ??????????

Now the question, what do you think ?

Mirage Plus 15x29" worth to test ? LH are 250$ new at time, 500$ the RH version.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...fcd20aeef9.jpg

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...347666ddca.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...98c785b451.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...de24cdf08b.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...4dcaa58e4c.jpg

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...d4264f42a0.jpg

Where did you get those plastic prop cases? I could use about 6 of those.

This are from systainer Tanos, Makita and some other firms use it for work maschines. Makita says Makpack 3 , 3 are the high I used. And old version not the new t-lock version.

Very cool set up you have - and in great condition!

My non step 35 Fountain had those from the factory. Fountain modified them by taking off the polish and you can see where they used a grinder to give them more bite. They are very fast, but would loose bite in the turns. Best riding props I ever ran were the Hydromotive's, except the boat would fall off plane at 30MPH.

No more ideas ??

I have ordert a set of 15x29" today. I have some space in RPM to go up to 5600 ore a bit more, without the revlimiter.
I hope to came in plane with the 3 blades with my -2" shortys.

That is a beautiful boat and you keep everthing very well maintained, i didn't realize you had it for 21 years let alone had gone thru 2 repowers up in hp every time.

come up on plane with minus 2 lowers, absolutely if the transom was not recut and drives already raised, it'll act different coming up and maybe, big maybe, it wont like steering or trim inputs at the just on plane speed.

How fast is it now ?
how about some video ?
didn't you experiment with some bottom work a while back ?
Any results of that bottom work ?

Yes i testet to extend the inner strakes to the transom, to lift the boat more. We testet it on a 28" Commander with a 525efi. We came in plane, at max RPM the boat was faster. Than we slowed down and turned on the river and than we dont came in plane for the way home. One side from the strake extansion are off from the bottom. So we endet with this expiriment, because my frend selled the boat some weeks later and i removed all from the bottom.

pictures from 2016

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...ed0cc94f4.jpeg
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...cfc22efe7.jpeg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...590fbe13e.jpeg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...619c0b188.jpeg

Speed are 88 with the 31 and 89 with the 29" on flat water, with more waves it goes 90 and a little bit more.

The Mirage Plus are on the boat and it came not in plane ?? :eek:

Any idea ?

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...192bd9831.jpeg
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...948b83e5f.jpeg

Did the drive shower bring the air to the prop ? Tape the holes ??

Should i tape the exhaust inlet ? Front and side ?

I will test it ?? No other ideas at time. :picard1:

Did you try putting it in gear and giving it a lot of throttle then pulling back on throttle and then catching the wave and giving throttle again ?. The wave will sometimes give enough lift to get you on plane. only other option I can see is a 1 or 2 inch spacer on the drives. Also it looks like those props have the removable ventilation tabs. Black plastic on the side of the hubs. Try removing them.

Chris

Blueabyss Starting with the second wave working with my Lab Bravos with the welding on tube. With this 3 Blades I don’t came in plane.

The 3 Blade Mirage are not lab.

If I open the vent holes, is it not than more air and faster blowing out the props ???

I have testet today:
Close the Drive shower holes and the Exhaust hole inlet with tape.

No way to get the boat to plane.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...9d9d2054d.jpeg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...63e977e68.jpeg

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeScarab28XLT (Post 4801917)

Mike,

I have read this thread about five times, and can't find anywhere where you've indicated....

Why is the boat not planing? Is it just refusing to plane out? Engines not spooling up? Props blowing out?

You've had this boat for 20+ years, so you know it better than anybody. When did this behavior develop? What changes did you make just prior to the onset? When did the XRs go on? Did they come with the shorty lowers? If not, when did they go on? Why the shorties?

My guess is that the boat is fastest with the Mirage Plus props because they are not inducing near as much transom lift, and the boat is allowed to run much drier, with less wetted surface. We went through this with our 236 Rinker. We bought it with a 22" Bravo that had been labbed to 21". The most we could get out of it was 50MPH, despite an engine dyno'd at 436HP. My dad noticed the boat was plowing when on plane. We swapped to a 23" Mirage Plus, and gained 11MPH. We also gained a lot better planing behavior. As a rule, non-stepped hulls don't really like lifting props.

Just some questions and some thoughts....

Thanks. Brad.
Model Machine and Precision LLC
(937)545-8991

thanks Brad for reading and helping.

I changed to the shorty’s with my 502efi setup and the boat was a little bit slower ( because with many trim the torpedo goes down, now I’m faster and need less trim, more straight) but better in handling. No jumping, more straight thrust, no wiping. Since this shortys i can’t not go in plane with 3 blade props. With Standard the 3 blades have no problem. Now I run with new motors faster and the shortys are great in handling. I have new lower XR with 0 hour but I don’t now if it is useful with mirage ??

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...99078b7c1d.jpg

Your picture "A"

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...997884cf26.jpg

Your picture "A" zoomed in.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...bd09abed35.jpg

Your picture "B"

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...2bcf911b50.jpg

Yoir picture "B" zoomed in.

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...596670c0e7.jpg

These last 2 pictures for camparison, from blue line up to cavitation plate.

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...a98eda9401.jpg

Zoomed in, this drive is raised 3 3/8 inches. The blue line is runs down the keel of the boat.

my opinion is not that your prop shaft is raised 2 inches, but the difference in shape of the lower unit from the blue line up between the two different lowers. Stock and minus 2

I tried to zoom your pictures in on the end of the lower where it is wide and shaped like an i beam.

that section all the way to the leading edge of the lower is causing you to blow out and not get on plane.
(my opinion)

This is bad news that you couldn't get on plane, those mirage plus are good props.
Do you still have the stock lowers ?

It would be interesting to know your propellor shaft height.

edit in; it wouldn't hurt to try spinning the propellors out, it may not work, but it's a free test.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeScarab28XLT (Post 4806789)

Mike,

I'm certainly no expert, but I'm betting it's the shorties that are the problem. I don't think more HP created a reason to change the lowers. In my limited view, hull type dictates the style of prop you need, HP dictates the pitch you can turn, and the drive set up determines the ride attitude.

Everything about a boat is a trade-off. Space for stuff. Weight vs rigidity/stability/durability/ride. Speed vs planing. Sure, a higher pitch prop will make the boat go faster, but getting it on plane takes longer. In your case, the shorties yielded more top end speed, but at the sacrifice of being able to get the boat on a plane. If it were me, I think I'd go back to the stock X dimension and trim for the application. Maybe try 1" spacers (if they are available). Meet it in the middle and see what happens. Proper ride attitude is everything, and sometimes, you have to play with it to find that sweet spot.

Again, I think bow lift is the answer with non-stepped hulls, and that's what you'll get with Mirage Plus props and proper trim.

Thanks. Brad.
Model Machine and Precision LLC
(937)545-8991

I would not even try experimenting with Mirage+ props anymore. The running attitude of your boat in the video is about as good as it can get on a straight bottom V hull.
They would probably work without the -2's shorty's, but the 3 blades just can't grip enough water with your higher propshaft height and the added power of the 525EFI's.
I have never heard of anybody with -2's that could run 3 blade props. They just blow out too easy. Lots of times when going to -2's, people have had to go to 5 blades.

yes you right, 3 blades dont work with my shortys.

Next winter projekt are sending my new standart 30" Bravo Props to BBlades for LAB.

The Boat is out of the water, wintertime in germany, this way i have no new updates.

I working on my dashboard, some repaint in my trailer, bigger subwoofer..........