Pushing the envelope—and coming to the Fort Myers Boat Show next month, https://www.speedonthewater.com/aval...calbur-series/

Twin 500's in a carbon fiber pontoon? Hope we don't see any blowover accidents. Powerboating is a bit of a reckless sport, but powerboating in a pontoon takes it to a whole new level of reckless in my opinion.

They don't really pack any air unless they're really shifting so I doubt you'll see any blowovers. BUT....still a bad idea imo. They're all built like crap. All of them. Period. Even the fancy ones. They all handle like crap too. Do we need to repost the loto video? Within reason we've actually stopped working on them. The toon' trend cant fade quickly enough. Heck even on our lake they're dangerous if the wind kicks up. Want to carry 10 people around at high speed? Get a center console. Or better yet, carry 3 friends around at high speed in something with real seating. The trend of 10 people riding around at speed with nothing to hold you in the boat is a bad one. One of these really fast CCs has an accident at a poker run its going to be awful. Way too many people to pick out of the water. Not to mention how distracted the driver is by their 10 "friends".

Ok. Cranky rant over. Carry on

Johnny,

Aerodynamic lift is not dependent on packing air. All tunnel-type boats only "pack air" via ground effects. As soon as the water is no longer working WITH the tunnel, they start "spilling air", a term you will hear a lot in the hydroplane racing world. This is how they can get "out" off the water, but not "off" the water. In my time of racing high performance model boats, I've seen outrigger hydros, which don't trap air at all (by design), lift off and turn into a kite, just because the driver let OFF the throttle. The high lift prop dumps the transom, increasing the tub's (hull's) angle of attack, lift skyrockets, and away it goes. At SOME point, these goon toons are going to reach that point (I think it's reasonable to argue they are already there) where lift-offs are not a matter of "if", but "when". I remember our ROTC teacher in high school making the statement that you can make a barn door fly with enough horsepower. We are just substituting the floor/deck of a toon for the barn door. The only reason we have a 100MPH+ pontoon on the books is because the driver managed to keep the attitude low enough to NOT blow off.

Thanks. Brad.

Toons are not "tunnel style boats". Have you run or setup any? I have. Have you run or setup any real cats other than model boats? I have. You are a very, very smart guy, no doubt. But experience matters in this equation.
I understand everything you are saying, but my point was and is simple....they don't pack air, they aren't tunnel boats. Lift on tunnel boats is very dependent on packing air contrary to what you state. Hence why quite a lot of cats don't always have the sweetest handling characteristics until they have packed some air and start acting like a cat. Its also the reason some guys use tunnel tabs...to increase the amount of air compressed in the tunnel. If what you are stating was true, tunnel tabs would be useless...which they aren't. Pontoons on the other hand are 3 vee bottoms held together with plywood. They are not in any way shape or form a sealed tunnel that packs and compresses air. They "air out" when trimmed to the moon using a lot of horsepower and setback. The one with triple outboards actually hangs there pretty nice at the shootout. It has very little to do with the air under the deck and a lot to do with 900hp on the transom.
For the record, ANYTHING can blow over if abused properly. Vee bottom drag boats do it all the time.
Not really sure how we got this far off topic but remember this is OSO where everybody is an expert...

a 300k + toon i bet. personly dont see the point of this to mnay people can if on it for the speed.

Keep in mind, only the super structure is carbon fiber ... as noted early in the article. The triple tubes are still heavy aluminum.

In the end, gentlemen, safety is in the hands of the operator. My very dear friend Johnny Saris, whose opinion I respect more than most, and I have had this discussion many times and we agree to disagree on certain points. If you run any fast boat at top speed with a gaggle of passengers, in my opinion—and it is only that—you're operating recklessly because when you carry passengers their lives literally are in your hands.

That said, every responsible boat owner I know only goes for the "big number" either alone or with a trusted copilot who is aware of the risks—and only at the right times on the water when conditions allow and traffic is minimal to nonexistent.

Captains can behave poorly in any fast (or slow) vessel. There is no reason to assume a pontoon operator with big power will behave any better or worse than any other operator.

This a very slippery slope, gentlemen. Eye of the beholder ... there are plenty of people in the general public, most actually, who think 100 mph in any boat is crazy and should not be allowed.

Personal responsibility rules. Darwin claims the rest.

Here endeth my rant.

With the angle of attack they run at, looks like they would have to be packing air.

Johnny,

So.... Was it "air pack" that caused Mike Fiore to reenter the stratosphere, upside down, after tapping the tips of his cat? Nope. Truthfully, the air pack was gone LONG before he really lifted off the first time. It always is.

I don't discount your experience at all. But physics matters, too.

What causes blow offs is LIFT, not "air pack". Lift is all about pressure differentials. When there is more pressure below a body than above, the body lifts. Cats act like cats, and hydroplanes as well, because the air pack increases the pressure below the hull. The tunnel traps that pressure. This is also why tunnel tabs do what they do. The create a sudden increase in the pressure at the rear of the tunnel, between the tabs. Until the hull lifts off the surface of the water. Then the air "spills", or escapes the air trap, the pressure equalizes with above deck, and lift is lost. Cats and hydroplanes ideally find that equilibrium where they are generating just enough lift to just skim the water's surface, while the hull maintains just enough contact with the water to keep it stable, sorta like training wheels. This is why I used the term "kite". At least, with our outriggers, when they let go, they are completely out of control, since the only thing keeping them straight was their minimal contact with the water. They usually go nose high, then turn sideways, make contact with the water, and cartwheel. I suspect that, WHEN this happens with a goon toon, it will be something of this sort. It won't blow over. It will go nose high, although, probably nowhere near vertical, then roll, then cartwheel. It's gonna happen. Take a large piece of cardboard, hold it level, and push it into the air from the "back" with your hand, and watch it. You've just simulated one of these goon toons. At 100+MPH, a 10X25 sheet of plywood doesn't need air pack to go ass over teakettle

Thanks. Brad.

Brad, you are correct.
Think about a Cessna 150, it doesn't "pack air" OR go very fast to take off.