[QUOTE]Originally posted by Audiofn
[B]Man this is unbelievable. Mr. Offshore I see what you are saying that they company should know about drives and what not, HOWEVER it is the person that is filling in the paperworks responsibility to fill it in correctly. I mean if you say you have a 32 foot skater and I am the shipper how do I know if you have a 32 foot skater on there and you have NOT included drives and the front of the trailer, or if you have a 24 and DID include the trailer. You see what I am saying "

What he said!

Its whomever booked the freights responsibility to know the freight size/dimension. Why should the carrier know a boat from a boat from an air conditioning unit? Do ya think they care or know a skater from a Bayliner? They need size and shapes and weight. They dont care two craps what it is(most of the time).
All they know is someone paid for x amount of space/Kilos and the estimate was wrong. They now want to get paid for the difference.

Again, only the race teams suffer, but the carrier does not care about the consequesnces. The imortant thing that needs to be addressed is making sure the boats are safe.

Mike it was a joke bro see the smiles and winks like this:p :p :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :eek: :eek: :D :D

had to Fever Mike
 

Mike:

As a past P-Class inspector you should KNOW there are no 36-38 ft CENTER CONSOLES on that ship! HAHAHAHHA had to jab ya - BH

they have my truck also
 

I am losing $$ daily, while I am without one of my Trucks, and Doc Santiago's boat needs to get to the Boat Show. If I hear anything FIRST HAND I will post it.

This sounds like a bad situation, but they will get it worked out.

Crunch Crunch Crunch Crunch, Slirp Slirp Slirp
Gimey another bag!;)

sounds like a sticky whicket. good luck to all of you. not alot of time till key west. best wishes.

I believe this thread belongs in Racers Roundup. It is being moved.

Alright...It's funny how quick everyone is to blindly speculate, offer their ingenious advice, tell the APBA how they would have handled it better, but most of those have no clue, nor were they present.

Look, We've heard from Ted Zoli, we've heard from Racers and equipment owners and they're tune is totally different and more understanding. It's time to quit the finger pointing, blame games and coaching from the couch(office chair :D )...

You heard straight from the president...A contract was drawn, a price was agreed upon and the shipper is giving them a hard time........

It's certainly a precarious situation, but let's not blame the wrong party. :cool:

I'll say this because no one else did. I think that it was very nice of OSO to offer to pick up the boats for the teams that can't get down to So FL. If everyone in the high-performance end of the industry would follow their lead on customer service, maybe we'd have more people interested in this sport.

I was hanging with a bunch of guys from the NYMTA and the NMMA. They made the analogy that if the boating industry were one big family than high-performance would be the bastard child that no one wanted. Sad.

OSO - Thank you for your unselfish gesture of kindness to our felow racers.

Does anyone know if SuperboatUSA.com and Dirty Cash got out on Friday? And, is this going to effect the Key West race?

Best regards,
Jennifer

From Ted's words the least the shipper could do is to explain how the boats were measured incorrectly that led to the extra $$. If they won't explain how the papers were filled out wrong, how can you argue the case?

Ted offered to give them $500,000 in colateral, that wasn't enough? They need to hold many millions of dollars worth of boats to collect $30 K? Something sounds fishy. Too bad customs doesn't oversee this nonsense.

Jennifer
 

Super Boat and Dirty Cash did not race in The Bahamas..............BH

I agree Jen. OSO has made a great offer. They have come through big time for me in the past and looks like they are stepping up again. :D:D

If I was owed money like the shipper there is NO WAY I would release anything tell I got the money in full. IF you have a COD package from UPS and it is shipped in two packages you do not get one and have them hold the other tell you pay for both. It is a nasty situation no matter how you look at it. I am sure that teams are paying drivers and shippers to sit and stay in hotel rooms tell this whole mess is solved.

Jon

I usually would not post on something like this. I am in the transportation business and quote often on oversized (OD) freight. It is usually a "quote" and after the freight is picked up, the final numbers are established based of the size, weight, permits, rigging, etc.

Example recently there was a 320,000 lbs Machine we moved. They client did not quite have the proper measurements and did not include bracing and blocking.

I do not know what the original quote was for, but the $29,000 difference would seem extreme. The only way we would hold the freight is if someone said they would not pay or their was a credit issue. If COD was required that could be another issue.

Seems to me the shipping company is making matters worse.

Florida NVOs challenging Caribbean carrier practices
 

"The professional association for non-vessel-operating common carriers (NVOCCs) in South Florida has formally petitioned the Federal Maritime Commission (FMC) to investigate rate setting and service contract practices by steamship lines operating in the Caribbean island trades....

...The NVOCCs' petition claims that the collective actions of the steamship lines "are reducing competition in the trades covered by the CSA and producing both unreasonable reductions in transportation service and unreasonable increases in transportation costs to OTIs (ocean transportation intermediaries), their customers and the shipping public" in violation of federal shipping laws.

The CSA carriers include Bernuth Lines, CMA CGM, Crowley Liner Services, Interline Connection, Maersk Sealand, Seaboard Marine, SeaFreight Line, Tecmarine Lines, and Tropical Shipping..."
--© Copyright 2002 Commonwealth Business Media Inc.


FYI:cool:

The question about lawers.

What is Mike A.????????? If anyone should be on top of the problem with legal matters it should be Mike A. and his law firm.

What is Lee Mills??? Another High profile lawer!!!!!!! Why should we have to look outside the offshore family for help with this matter?

How is it that SBI can go over there for the last 7 years and not have this problem?

This is totally hypothetical.

Imagine an organization being able to hold hostage participants in another competing organizations championship event????

Na......riuning someone elses show, eliminating the competition....couldn't happen. Wouldn't be weird if all the boats were released on.....oh I don't know maybe like nov. 10th or so.

Couldn't happen......never mind i'm just having random thoughts.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by sgrady
[B]I usually would not post on something like this. I am in the transportation business and quote often on oversized (OD) freight. It is usually a "quote" and after the freight is picked up, the final numbers are established based of the size, weight, permits, rigging, etc.

Exactly! When I shipped boats with Seaboard, they gave me an estimate. Then, when the boats arrived at the port, they re measured & gave me the exact shipping price in the paperwork. The price was within 1% of their estimate.
They won't ship anything before the paperwork (contract) is signed.
Someone knew the numbers:confused:

I'm glad you stated "hypothetical." That post is like throwing Cam 2 on a fire.

"As the Prop Turns" espisode 2002.

There seems to be quite a bit of misinformation out there .

I have posted a complete report under General Discussion, "The Freeport Situation.

As your Customs Broker and Freight Forwarder I can report the the information is accurate. REMEMBER, the "Estimate" was made by Ted Zoli NOT the Carrier. They had no idea what would show up and quoted very simply at $72 per square meter. Costs were calculated based upon the actual measurements of what showed up . See my report.

Not even a fair post even with "hypothetical" in the statement...I feel for the teams that are trying to get their stuff...A couple of those people are friends of mine and from my hometown...And yes thank you OSO and Steve for offering your services, See Steve, I didnt bash, suprised arent ya... :D

I myself am a world class international ocean export supervisor for a large, multi-national company. I handle everything from teeny shipments to vessel chartering. Let me preface this post by stating that had I been in charge of this - nobody would have their boat in hock right now.;) - I'm just that good!
No disrespect to you Searider!
The freight forwarder/broker is at the mercy of the carrier (Seaboard Marine). However, the carrier based the freight rate at $72.00 weight or measure (w/m) which is either a cubic meter or kiloton - boats will almost always "measure out" and be charged on volume rather than weight.
Seaboard would have signed a contract simply stating the rate would be based at $72.00 w/m. Boats on trailers would either go as breakbulk (B/B) or Ro-Ro (roll on - roll off). Either type of freight is subject to measurment/weighing at the port(s) of export and piers generally are really good about getting accurate dimensions.
I'd be curious though - the boats had to have been measured for exporting out of Miami - certainly SOMEONE must have been aware that the total cubic meters (cbm) was more than originally estimated??:confused: There had to have been an export (Miami-Bahama) ocean bill of lading showing total cbm's - and an import B/L Bahama-Miami) showing total cbm.
And as far as Seaboard dealing with individual boat owners - iffy.

Good luck everyone....

MO
Agreed!

And We way over estimated the sizes of our boats and trucks, and even left a truck out we sent paperwork on. Seems real unrealistic the measurments were off by that much.

We are supposed to shoot for a movie here shortly, I hope we get our boats out soon.

OK, after reading this thread and hearing Ted Zoli's side of the story and hearing Searider's side of the story, there are just some things that don't jive. I have not looked at the forms the racers had to complete before shipment, but I suppose they had to estimate the size and weight of their boats and vehicles. When we are making an estimate we are not going to be exact but should be reasonably close. According to the numbers stated the actual bill is over 24% larger than the original estimate.:confused: Everyone of you know about what size and weight your boat is and there is no way that you would miss it by 24%. There is more to this story than is being told. I say that APBA must do whatever it takes to get the boats back ASAP and settle the overbilling in due course.

As usual when something goes wrong, people are often more interested in fixing the blame, than fixing the problem. The most important issue is how to get these people their boats back. Maybe someone with Daddy Warbucks kind of jack can just pay the $29K, then after the boats are out of hock, decide who to go after for the money, either apba or the shipper. One of them is wrong.

Ted Zoli has given an update of the situation. I believe APBA is doing everything they can the come to a resolution quickly. Most of the racers have given their support to APBA.

I ask that people do not speculate about what is happening and only post facts from personal situations and not second hand information. APBA has not been a part of the board for quite some time and it's great to see Ted Zoli giving an update of the situation. He didn't hide and neglect to comment. You have to give him credit and trust APBA is doing what they can and has the racers' interest in mind.

Jamin, welcome to the board.

Ray Van

OSO and races teams
If needed I have space for 2 or 3 boats up to 50' over all, at my shop fence in and locked in Fort Lauderdale
L.A.marine 954 791 2552
LEE AUSTIN

Enough
 

Anyone up for going back to the Bahamas for a race next year?

Pay the money get your boys their boats back.......Now!

Maximus

.
 

If the contract is with the APBA and not the individual boat owners. How can they keep their boats? Is the boat property of the APBA? Also Searider your to quick to pass the blame. Makes you look like your hiding something. Just my opion ( and I now everyone has one just don't always want to hear from it.) Things just don't seem to add up or make any sense. If you have an agreed on contract price then that should be it. No more or no less.

I've got some vacation days left if anyone needs any help towing or whatever.....and an Excursion...also a big fenced and well protected yard in Orlando

don't hesitate to get in touch 407 629 3269

AMEN Brother..... See us Formula guys think a little smarter then the rest of the bunch :D

DJD I have one question for you. Are you laughing as hard as I am right now???? Remember what we were talking about the other day and we got SLAMMED for it.

No I do not have a axe to grind before you all start to slam me, but I do find it odd that there is definatly a history of accusations that bills are not paid by APBA all over the place and it is NEVER thier fault.

Jon

Oh ya and last I checked it was APBA that said not to worry they will handle the shipping and such so it is thier responisibility to get the boat out of hock ASAP and deal with the rest of it later.

Tanned fat. I know you were just thinking out loud, but that thought went through my mind as well :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

:D :D :D :D

Damn...I ran out of popcorn again...Hey Roger...got any left in your box!!!

This forum was designed for the racers and their Sanctioning bodies to discuss their issues. Please refrain from adding your .02 if it does not pertain to you, they are dealing with enough without the added instigating.

REMEMBER: IF YOU ARE NOT PART OF THE SOLUTION, THEN YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM.

Hey dredgeking do you read fortune cookies for a living :D:D;) ;)

jon, my favorite fortune is: NEVER MISTAKE KINDNESS FOR WEAKNESS.

that's another fortune from my old jersey days. ;)

So what is the story today? Has the bill been paid or are the boats still sitting on the dock?

as a non racer...and leary to post here... I can say that as of 1.5 hours ago nothing has changed....

Hey Dredge old buddy
Back up the truck
Youve been a member here almost as long as me, and I certinly value your input...but all the guys are doing here is asking questions and exchanging information reguarding our interests..which I thought was boat related activies. If you want to root for APBA/llc thats your poragative, and you are surely intitled to voice your opnion, but your the Moderator, not a hall monitor, and as long as we ask reasonable questions and get reasonable answers, thats within the guidelines of this forum. Were all grown up men and women here, and we dont need to be scolded or treated disrespectively.
Alwiess screwed the pouch big time this time...and we all know it, now the concern is for the equip sitting in Miami. And its only gettin worse. If this is gonna be a place for only racers...dont move legitimate general questions over here, and then tell us to shut up.
Thanks
Dan