upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

I currently have a super 16 cc that I use in Gardiners bay around east hampton. I love this boat but the waters out there are quite a bit rougher than the GSB waters I grew up on. Some days it is too choppy to have any fun out there. All the slamming makes the ride exremely uncomfortable for any passenger. My wife has basically refused to go out in anything where she's going to get tossed around. My question is if I were to upgrade to a 21 millenium would I notice much of a difference in the ride in rough water compared to my 16? Any feedback would be apprciated. Thanks.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

There is no comparison in the ride of a 16 to a 21. The 21 will literally go over anything. There are some guys in here that have had them, hopefully they''ll let you know too. Besides, the Millenium is so much roomier. Not to mention faster.

Rick

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

cwc,

i just bought a 1974 16 cc that i'm restoring...should make a good "flats" boat for around gardiner's...i hope... i'm currently in riverhead and have a house in southold...where do you keep yours?

what kind of power do you have and what kind of speeds? any pictures? post away! :)

sean

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Sean
The super 16 is a perfect flats boat. I keep mine in East Hampton in Hog Creek. It has a merc 115 and does mid 50s with the engine at its current setting. If I lifted the engine to the next setting it would be 60 plus top speed. The problem is there are very few days where I can really open it up due to bay conditions. I'll take some pictures next time I'm out at there and post them.
Thanks
CWC

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

21 Millenium?.... hmmmm....where should I start. Aside from the fact that the last two that were built ( nothing to do with RICK FX-10 he wasn't even back working at SUPERBOAT at that time) porpoised like a mutha with an array of 250's & 300's with all different setback & prop combinations. I was sold the red/white one. Hadda trade it back to JC for the 24 :argue: (& happy I did :) ) . Guy in Florida has the last one built. Heard on Scream&Fly same story. I have talked to owners of the first ones ( less than 10 were built I was told) & they seem to be OK.
-As far as design...they look sleek...yet they don't have the speed of the 21 LEGEND (they are heavier & less aerodynamic) . I found minimal room. They are not a fishing boat either. The worst part is the 25" transom design. Big flaw. Needs a 20" with a motorwell (even though this takes up even more room inside).
- I owned a '80 16C/C and also a closed deck 16. Both were sweet.
Now if only they had pads.....:rolleyes:

-Oh CMC...how about representing that 16 of yours in the poll my fellow SB'er.
http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=91140

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Bash,
I wish I was back with John when you got your Millenium. I would have had you dialed in without a problem.
This winter we should be building 2 of them. One for me and one for John jr. Both lightweight's. Not super lightweight's...........But I think I can get them to between 900 and 1000 lbs. 500 less then a regular one. Either foam or baltek panel stringers and and race layup of 3 plys of 1708 as opposed to a mat, roving (24oz.),mat, roving layup.
For power................ 250 merc.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Superbash-thanks for the info. Your review of the Millenium is giving me second thoughts about looking into one. I was also thinking about the Spectre center console. Should I forget about the Millenium and look into something else? As for the poll, I am now represented.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

-As far as design...they look sleek...yet they don't have the speed of the 21 LEGEND (they are heavier & less aerodynamic) . I found minimal room. They are not a fishing boat either. The worst part is the 25" transom design. Big flaw. Needs a 20" with a motor well (even though this takes up even more room inside).

CWC,

As far as what Bash said about the Millennium. Let me set a few things straight. The Millennium was never intended to go as fast as a legend. It was intended as a do anything kind of boat. Want to take the family to the beach ? Plenty of room for all the goodies. I build these things, but I own a 22' Mako (for sale). My mako doesn't have much more room then the Millennium. A foot on either side of the console, 2 feet behind my driver seat, and maybe 6 feet in front of the console. And my Mako is a fishing boat. And I also had 2 16' Superboats. In the Millennium, you have more room and a more stable ride. I have been on a Millennium and can't see anyone having a problem fishing off one. Hell, a 16 has no where near the same room as a millennium.
As for the 25" transom. My Mako came with a 20" transom. Major design flaw. Anyone who drifts in 3 or 4' swells while fishing knows that waves come in the well, especially in the ocean, and especially in 20"transom wells. In my 30 plus years of doing glass work I have raised at least 50 transoms to 25" from 20" to keep the waves from filling the well. My well probably holds 40 gals.( approximately 350 lbs.) of water. I plated and raised my transom to 25" to keep the water from filling my well. With the higher transom, I don't get water in the well anymore. That is the reason for the higher transom.
As far as the Porpoising, as I said before, I could have corrected that easily. Coen might have me beat by a few years when it comes to building boats. But when it comes to repairing and fixing hulls, I have him beat. I check the hulls before they go out, and if I see a problem, it gets fixed. All Progressions get Blueprinted before they leave the factory. do you think they would have to do that if their hull mold was perfect in the first place. Just something to think about.
The Millennium isn't a race boat. It's a performance center console. Hell..........It does over 20mph faster then my Mako with the same power. The glass work is top notch, and your getting a boat that will be around for years.

Rick

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Rick,
THanks very much for all that info. I love the looks of the Millenium. I am not looking to do 80mph. If the Millenium can do 60 that's plenty fast for me. I like the idea of a 25" well. I don't need swells breaking over the stern. I'm not sure what my time frame is but I would love to take a look at the ones your going to build this winter as they near completion to get an idea of the layout etc.

Thanks
CWC

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

no problem. I'll keep ya posted.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

rick,

i like the idea of the 21 cc also...and when i outgrow my not yet finished 16, i'd love to have a look at one...my only comments would be to make it more of a fishing boat...taller console, leaning post, t-top...that sort of thing...are there any plans?

sean

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

I don't think so. I can pretty much guarantee the console isn't changing. We do have the center console from the 16, but I don't know if John would put it in the millennium.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

If Anyone Is Looking To Sell A 16 Cc Please Let Me Know
Im Looking To Put One Together For Me And My Son

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

The problem with my 21millenium was that it was sold to me as a BRAND NEW BOAT. In fact...later do I find out ...since I was unable to drive it...that it is had been sold to a guy in Florida previously who couldn't drive it either!
- The reason I am against the 25" motors on a SUPERBOAT is:
First of all...the transoms should have full length glassed knees standard in all 21's & 24 O/B's. But they don't. & guess what. The seam where the deck joins the hull will crack. You gotta install tie bars in them from the beginning or they will crack. JC says you don't need them. But you do. They crack. The 25" with all its additional leverage further aggravates this . It makes it crack. That is what I am saying. Something need to be added to the transom as part of its design.

-Secondly...this is a performance hull. The 25" in combination with the rubber mounts & relatively narrow hull (7'-2" rub rail to rub rail). The motor steers you instead of you steering the boat. It did on my 21 & 24. I notice it. I don't fish. I am a performance boater.

-(Hey...I'm glad you guys are building 2 at the factory. JC didn't wanna take a chance & build me another one in fear of he'd have a third one out there not right. & he did tell me he had flipped mine over & blueprinted it prior to selling it to me...yet still couldn't find out what was wrong with it. BASH was not a HAPPY SUPERBOATER in SUPERBOATLAND at one time :D But now he is :) )

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

The Hoser's 21 tie bar transom.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Superbash,
In reference to "THE CRACK". The cracks in the pictures you are showing are not in the fiberglass. They are nothing more then cosmetis cracks in the gelcoat that is applied by Bob to fill the void between hull and deck. The hull and deck are glassed on the inside with 5 alternating ply's of mat and 24oz. roving. Rather then have Bob spend 5 hours making the transom look pretty. From now on, we'll do like all the other manufactures and put a piece of aluminum trim on it. This way we won't have anyone say our transoms are cracking, when they're not.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

For heavy abuse, I agree with you. Tie bars are the way to go. They can easily be tied into the stringer system.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

SUPERBOAT #1


Yes FX...I agree with you 1000%. SUPERBOAT is my boat. Has been for years. I'm not afraid to beat on them. Yes...I gotta do the angle trim to cover the "fractures" in the gel. :D


-PIC 2002-2003 Millenium :D (Before my a-hole neighbor told the town & made me take down my "SUPERBOAT-PORT") :mad:

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Superbash,
Any more pictures of that boat?

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

CWC - I had some really nice ones... but the 'puter ate them.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Superbash-is that the one you traded back in? I have to get me one of those.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

CWC:chick:
Yes. JC rigged it with a 125 early spring & sold. They are some kids seen during the summer at Gilgo.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

This guys name who previously owned this 21 was "Cooper"...he put that retarded overgrown windshield on...bottom painted...& took off the SUPERBOAT decals...& made "COOPERBOAT" ones.
- The boat recently "went under".
(Serves him right for leaving a SUPERBOAT ..."In the Pond overnight"...:D )

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Bottom Paint, ( I'm Sick Again ) Superbash To The Rescue !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :(

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Oh Yea, Bash The Stupid Windshield Was For His/hers ( Big Hair ) !!!!!! :(

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Yes. "Big Hair" was the least of his concerns. :D
-my 21 was called "the boat from hell" http://photos.imageevent.com/superbash/gifs/devil.gif...but this one "looked like hell". http://photos.imageevent.com/superba.../wellfunny.gif

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

where is that thing now?

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

He just sold it. He's "Supaboatmillenium"...on Scream&Fly.
- Lets see pics of your mystery 16.... CWC?????

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

I'll take some pics next weekend when I'm out at my house (I live in the city during the week). How much was he asking for the millenium?

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

I don't think he was asking anything. The boat went under. He sold the motor. Was looking for a different motor...then the next thing the boat was sold & he was looking at OhZones 24. Thats about all the info/history I can tell you. :rolleyes:

-Is your 16 an '80? Its not my ex is it? I sold it to a friends brother in law...he put a 115 MERC on it...then sold it. I heard it went out east. I sold it in 2000-2001.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Bash,
I bought it in 03 from a guy who lived near the sunrise mall. I think he is part of the Canni (Uncanni) family. He told me it used to be named "six pack" before he totally renovated. It is blue and white with a 115 merc. I just checked out some of the threads regarding supaboatmilleniums 21 on scream and fly. Definitely seems like a wierd story.

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Ouch!

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

my 16 garaged for winter

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Bash,
Here are a few more.
CWC

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Bash,
last 3 shots. Barely fits in the garage. If I go for a 21 I'll have to put a hole in the wall.
CWC

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

Whats the big deal about a little hole in the wall. ;)

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

cwc,

thanks for sharing those pics! gives me something to look forward too :)

sean

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

sean,
how are things progressing? Are you going to be ready to go by spring? What did you decide on for power?
cwc

Re: upgrade super16 to 21 millenium?
 

:cool:COOL SUPER 16:cool: