holley 650 adjusts
09-01-2011, 06:25 PM
#22
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Originally Posted by Dennis Moore
The biggest problems with Holley carbs is the needle and seats in the float bowls will leak even when brand new!
ME:You must be buying some Chinese crap, I have used/worked on about 100 holley carbs on all kinds of vehicles and other than a few that had fouled needles and seats from idiots that installed them with no fuel filter I haven't ran acrossed this PREVELENT phenomonon[/
Dennis:The accelerator pump diaphragm/gasket will leak on about 50% of them when they are replaced. Sometimes the surfaces will need to be flattened.
ME:Again, you must have the worst supplier for parts in the world or do very sloppy work if 50% of the accelerator pumps you replace leak afterwards[/I
The biggest problems with Holley carbs is the needle and seats in the float bowls will leak even when brand new!
ME:You must be buying some Chinese crap, I have used/worked on about 100 holley carbs on all kinds of vehicles and other than a few that had fouled needles and seats from idiots that installed them with no fuel filter I haven't ran acrossed this PREVELENT phenomonon[/
Dennis:The accelerator pump diaphragm/gasket will leak on about 50% of them when they are replaced. Sometimes the surfaces will need to be flattened.
ME:Again, you must have the worst supplier for parts in the world or do very sloppy work if 50% of the accelerator pumps you replace leak afterwards[/I
Dennis:The metering block idle fuel wells and main metering wells have small fuel/air bleeds inside the metering block that will clog and are almost impossible to clean out by soaking in carb cleaner. It may require a new metering block.
ME:MAY REQUIRE A NEW METERING BLOCK????? I was driving down the road one day and found a couple of holley carbs at the curb on trash day, totally corroded and throttle blades were frozen up, grabbed them for parts anyways, threw them in a old fashioned solvent soak tank and forgot about them, cleaned them up and worked the throttle blades loose again, put trick kits/renew kits in them and one runs 11.67's on my buddies 69 gto and the other we use as a test carb for various things, haven't found metering blocks that are IMPOSSIBLE to clean or needed to be replaced. Are you working on boats that sank in salt water and were recovered or something????[/I]
Sorry, just some of the joys of owning a Holley carb!
Dennis Moore
Warped base plates/main bodies from repeated over tightening
well plugs that perpetually leak
wore out throttle bores from plates hitting
wore out throttle shaft bores
very little tunability on primary metering rods, especially with engines that use high duration cams with low idle strength
generally butchered up over time without a readily available supply of replacement parts
I save them for parts and once in a while I have enough pieces to put one back together and have everything right, Gm hasn't used them on oems since the early 80's but you obviously know this, Holleys have put them in a GRAVE. I looked at your website, other than selling cheap, casted, imported low performance manifolds, do you actually have ANYTHING to do with high performance marine engines or are you hoping/waiting near the phone for a 1988 liberator owner to call you up to have his quadrajet carb rebuilt???
Last edited by articfriends; 09-01-2011 at 06:51 PM.
09-01-2011, 07:23 PM
#23
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I am a BIG fan of Holley Carburetors...especially the Double Pumper Mechanical Secondary versions. I have had very good results with them on boats and in my opinion offer the best available throttle response you can get...short of Multi Port FI...which is the best fuel delivery system we have developed so far.
I however am currently running Quadra Jet Marine Carbs on my near stock Small Block Chevy s with great success. Now don't laugh...but the damn things work for me!!!
I found a great source for Marine Carburetors that I want to share.
http://www.nationalcarburetors.com/
These guys sell just about anything you want to buy and they are in Jacksonville, Fl...employing Americans...rebuilding carburetors...Automotive and Marine...of all makes...including Rochester and Holley!!!
I bought my Q-Jet Marine Carbs ...rebuilt, for $199.99 ea plus freight!!! I took them out of the box...bolted them on...connected the fuel lines and linkage. I spun the engines a few times to fill the bowls and they started right up. I had to set the idle speed but the mixture was spot on. These carbs looked as good as new and came with a spec sheet showing the air flow results, A/F ratio achieved and what engine they were tuned on!!
Check them out. I wanted to share this because they are a group of Americans building parts in America for American products...and I think that's a good thing.
I however am currently running Quadra Jet Marine Carbs on my near stock Small Block Chevy s with great success. Now don't laugh...but the damn things work for me!!!
I found a great source for Marine Carburetors that I want to share.
http://www.nationalcarburetors.com/
These guys sell just about anything you want to buy and they are in Jacksonville, Fl...employing Americans...rebuilding carburetors...Automotive and Marine...of all makes...including Rochester and Holley!!!
I bought my Q-Jet Marine Carbs ...rebuilt, for $199.99 ea plus freight!!! I took them out of the box...bolted them on...connected the fuel lines and linkage. I spun the engines a few times to fill the bowls and they started right up. I had to set the idle speed but the mixture was spot on. These carbs looked as good as new and came with a spec sheet showing the air flow results, A/F ratio achieved and what engine they were tuned on!!
Check them out. I wanted to share this because they are a group of Americans building parts in America for American products...and I think that's a good thing.
Last edited by sprink58; 09-01-2011 at 07:25 PM.
09-01-2011, 07:25 PM
#24
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arcticfriends -
Let me guess, Quadrajets/Webers work good for you with factory dual plane intake manifolds, oe heads, and idle to 4800rpm cams ?
They work good for us in those applications too !
Maybe I'm onto something here......
=================================
Dennis -
BTW: I've never used wire brushes and gasket remover to remove the old OE Holley gaskets. Maybe that's causing a problem for you ?
Carb cleaner, a long fingernail (thumb preferred) and a new razor go a long way. Quick too ! Be amazed how good the carb clean loosens things.
Tilting surface being 'scraped' down is also beneficial. Gravity lets the material drop towards bench, not into the holes. Also, blowing air from opposing holes makes any material on/over the holes blow out. If you blow into the hole material is in/on, you'll just jam it up.
A rubber tipped blow gun is a great tool to have.
They do make a book for all of this.
Let me guess, Quadrajets/Webers work good for you with factory dual plane intake manifolds, oe heads, and idle to 4800rpm cams ?
They work good for us in those applications too !
Maybe I'm onto something here......
=================================
Dennis -
BTW: I've never used wire brushes and gasket remover to remove the old OE Holley gaskets. Maybe that's causing a problem for you ?
Carb cleaner, a long fingernail (thumb preferred) and a new razor go a long way. Quick too ! Be amazed how good the carb clean loosens things.
Tilting surface being 'scraped' down is also beneficial. Gravity lets the material drop towards bench, not into the holes. Also, blowing air from opposing holes makes any material on/over the holes blow out. If you blow into the hole material is in/on, you'll just jam it up.
A rubber tipped blow gun is a great tool to have.
They do make a book for all of this.
Last edited by SB; 09-01-2011 at 07:31 PM.
09-01-2011, 08:26 PM
#25
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[QUOTE=SB;3494169]arcticfriends -
Let me guess, Quadrajets/Webers work good for you with factory dual plane intake manifolds, oe heads, and idle to 4800rpm cams ?
They work good for us in those applications too !
Maybe I'm onto something here......
=================================
Scott, I have built quite a few quadrajets for medium and low performance applications, was 25 years ago though that I actually had one on something that ran 13's , when I wanted more adjustability and moved into the high 12's then 11's (with a much bigger cam, heads, intake etc) I went to a annular discharge holly carb (my personal favorite aside from fuel injection). I still build one once in a while for a old muscle car but my latest project-1974 T/A is getting a mefi fuel injection, Smitty
Let me guess, Quadrajets/Webers work good for you with factory dual plane intake manifolds, oe heads, and idle to 4800rpm cams ?
They work good for us in those applications too !
Maybe I'm onto something here......
=================================
Scott, I have built quite a few quadrajets for medium and low performance applications, was 25 years ago though that I actually had one on something that ran 13's , when I wanted more adjustability and moved into the high 12's then 11's (with a much bigger cam, heads, intake etc) I went to a annular discharge holly carb (my personal favorite aside from fuel injection). I still build one once in a while for a old muscle car but my latest project-1974 T/A is getting a mefi fuel injection, Smitty
09-01-2011, 09:02 PM
#26
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Had a few Quad's on non-race cars with small blocks (one a 403 Olds)down low 12's. Was also a small part of a few Superstock cars and few Stock Eliminators with Quadrajet's and Webers. Ran amazingly well, but way benefited from 'magic potion carburetor tuners.' Big moolah too.
Those guys craved Holley's but rules forced the others.
The upper classes of course, most pick cars that came OE with Holley's so they could run those. How about AMX's that came OE with two Holley's. Yeh baby.
=================================
Back to boats, be it Quads/Webers/Holley's etc with Vacuum secondaries (Quads/Weber's only come that way) they can be a real pain in the azz with a strong motor and lighter boat. Believe me, I've been in a bunch.
You set up vac secondary for best acceleration and top end, prob is when trying to cruise near sec throttle opening. Slight touch of throttle and secondaries and vroom. Too much, Slight pull back, and not enough.
CAn play around with it somewhat to make that area a little better but you end up taking a little from either acceleration and or top end.
Enter mechanical secondaries. You control the secondaries. You control the exact speed of the boat. No mechanism working on it's own...thru airflow, weights, nor etc. You are in total control with mech secondaries.
Those guys craved Holley's but rules forced the others.
The upper classes of course, most pick cars that came OE with Holley's so they could run those. How about AMX's that came OE with two Holley's. Yeh baby.
=================================
Back to boats, be it Quads/Webers/Holley's etc with Vacuum secondaries (Quads/Weber's only come that way) they can be a real pain in the azz with a strong motor and lighter boat. Believe me, I've been in a bunch.
You set up vac secondary for best acceleration and top end, prob is when trying to cruise near sec throttle opening. Slight touch of throttle and secondaries and vroom. Too much, Slight pull back, and not enough.
CAn play around with it somewhat to make that area a little better but you end up taking a little from either acceleration and or top end.
Enter mechanical secondaries. You control the secondaries. You control the exact speed of the boat. No mechanism working on it's own...thru airflow, weights, nor etc. You are in total control with mech secondaries.
09-01-2011, 10:48 PM
#27
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Good description of vacuum vs mechanical secondaries. Learned something from this.
09-01-2011, 10:57 PM
#28
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Enter mechanical secondaries. You control the secondaries. You control the exact speed of the boat. No mechanism working on it's own...thru airflow, weights, nor etc. You are in total control with mech secondaries.
This is a fact...and why I prefer the system. The ability to control acceleration accurately becomes critical in rough seas...especially following seas that you must regulate forward speed precisely. I have been in situations...especially running in and out of our East Coast inlets here in South Florida in marginal weather...that depend on this ability. Being able to speed up and slow down quickly can make the difference weather or not you breach or pitch pole a boat.
It's much easier to do this with a properly sized mechanical secondary carb than one with vacuum secondaries. I had this explained to me also by some "old school" offshore racing team throttle men.
In my current situation, with near stock engine set ups, with a decent power to weight ratio (right at 10lbs for each horsepower in the water) it's not as critical so I do well with the Q-Jets. If I start running something like a pair of 383 strokers then I will be running Double Pumper Holley's for sure.
This is a fact...and why I prefer the system. The ability to control acceleration accurately becomes critical in rough seas...especially following seas that you must regulate forward speed precisely. I have been in situations...especially running in and out of our East Coast inlets here in South Florida in marginal weather...that depend on this ability. Being able to speed up and slow down quickly can make the difference weather or not you breach or pitch pole a boat.
It's much easier to do this with a properly sized mechanical secondary carb than one with vacuum secondaries. I had this explained to me also by some "old school" offshore racing team throttle men.
In my current situation, with near stock engine set ups, with a decent power to weight ratio (right at 10lbs for each horsepower in the water) it's not as critical so I do well with the Q-Jets. If I start running something like a pair of 383 strokers then I will be running Double Pumper Holley's for sure.
Last edited by sprink58; 09-01-2011 at 11:04 PM.
