Von Bongo

HHahahhaha, I almost wet myself! 30%....I only wish project/updates only went over budget by 30%.

I'd take whatever amount you can't possibly imagine ever spending, you know they kind of money that gets you divorced when the wife finds out...then double that and you'll come in just over that!

Von Bongo

35K for motors sounds pretty close when you pay for everything including pull, rig, new hoses, couplers, starters. oil pumps..yadda..yadda yadda..

My rebuilt carb to pan 500HP's that became 509's with everything new were $12,500 each including having the 250 blower shop blowers rebuilt. Only thing reused was the exhaust and the oil pan, nothing else.

You might as well do all your shift, thottle and tab, drive indicator cables while the motors are out. The new cables all move much easier and it's also eaier to do while everythings out. Do you bilge pumps, blowers, switches etc. If you don't you'll be replacing things you wish you would have done while the bilge was cleaned out and easy to work in.

Your 45K budget is probably pretty close really depending on what all you do. The little stuff adds up and that is usually where it gets you.

Steve_H

get with carter and jryan in your area. those guys know good shops with good pricing for rebuilds and parts. you should be able to rebuild with new pistons/heads/intakes/carbs/exhaust for under 7k each if you put it back together yourself starting with an assembled short block.

as far as the transom. if it were me i wouldnt do much to it unless it has a "serious" moisture problem. almost all older boats will show "some" moisture but whether or not it needs attention is the question.

forgot..

the key to save is doing all the grunt work yourself.

BY U BOY

Andy,don't be affraid of aluminum. The whole top of my mill is aluminum and I only boat in salt. 2 years now and they still look new.Flushing is the key if you do any boating in salt.It only takes a few mins to be safe. Good luck

Pantera24

Personally I would go with twin small blocks...call me crazy if you want but the balance will be better ....and with the price of gas.! Ouch twin BBC...and easier to work in bilge and you will never blow or hurt a drive either. My 28 Pantera had twin small blocks and it was sweet!!

Stormrider

how much change in the rigging would there be w/ sbcs?
How about the engine mounts?

TxHawk

iTrader: (2)

Andy, be careful how far you dig, you will wind up deep. I think we can help do a couple projects and get the boat where you want it.

You need to sell the SeaRay and free up some engine money.

Not sure if you have seen mine in the rough. It started out as a rebuild engines and reupholster job. Pictures of everything here.

http://community.webshots.com/user/excaliburhawk

TexomaPowerboater

Thanks, I think mine were on for 3 years............

I guess I could do closed cooling which should fix my worries. I don't do any boating in the ocean, but I do have some places on my bucket list I'd like to take the boat to.

TexomaPowerboater

Yeah buddy, nice restoration. Those engines look like gold, very nice. I recall seeing it in rougher shape at the 2005 High Roller Poker Run. Perhaps I need some more consultation before I jump into this blindfolded. Did you rebuild your engines or buy new? They look new

SeaRay is not mine to sell. Its a family boat I take care of. I consider it mine because I'm the only one who drives it and takes care of the maintenance, but it doesn't cost me anything. Ahhhhhh the perfect boat.......one you don't have to pay for. Thats the beauty of the Sea Ray - I could spend 5 years on this project and not lose any boating time. The big engine money won't come for 2-3 years. I figured best to get it in shape in the mean time.

TexomaPowerboater

Thats a good topic for conversation. Velocity Vector found some nice 383's - where did you find those by the way? Thats a hell of a deal with outdrives.

I've heavily reasearched the topic and I have found some interesting findings, which are in no way meant to criticize your post.

1) My twin 454's 450hp burned about as much as my single 24ft did with a 502 390hp. I was suprised that the consumption did not increase significantly. I even recall Griff saying that he burned more in his 28 pantera with single 525SC than he does in his 32 AT with twins. I'm sure the twin sbc's would be less fuel than the big blocks, but I'm pretty happy with what I'm burning now. I think the higher RPM's of the sbc to get the same power at the lower RPM's of the big block would outweigh any fuel savings.

2) Is it easier on the outdrives? Just a few months ago there was a guy from the bahamas who bought a used 28 Pantera hull and was rigged with twin 6.2's by Jo. I think he maid it a month or two before he had drive problems. He probobly needed to run at higher rpm's vs the big block to achieve a satisfactory cruise speed. Maybe he didn't have the magic touch, but I would venture to say that for cruising purposes a big block pushing 3-3500rpms would be better on the drives than a sbc pushing 4-4500rpms to get the same speed.

3) Reliability????? Spillman has twin 350's in his 28AT. I think they only made it around 300hrs. Someone check me on that. Again, I think this goes back to the rpms he needs to push the boat at cruising speeds. I once read one of the best recipes for reliability is 75% throttle 75% of the time, or something like that. I think for reliability purposes it would be ideal to have an engine that will give me great cruising speed at lower rpms. The 454 450hp had great cruising at 3000rpm, which is were I had it most of the time and probobly why my gas wasn't much. I was trying to baby it........alot of good that did If I wanted to increase the hp down the road I also think the big block would be easier to do it on. It seems like most sbc's need superchargers for REAL hp increases.

4) Balance? This ain't no 28 Pantera. I have been in both with big bolcks. IMO the apache is better balanced with big blocks than the pantera. Its a bigger, heavier boat and stands taller in the water. I have had some airtime and I was very happy with the landing and how the nose carries. Please, let not get into a pissing match between the two boats. I think the geniuses who crafted this boat balanced it as perfect as you can balance a 28 with twin big blocks. For that reason I don't think its a good idea to significanlty alter the balance of the boat by taking 1000lbs off the rear. It does have a little porpoise in calm water as do most all boats under 30ft with twin big blocks, but she flies level.

It would be much cheaper and easier to work on with sbcs, but I'm not convinced I'll get the reliable hours I'm looking for. So what do you guys think?